| Author |
Message |
chris
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 06, 2006 - 6:33 pm: | |
will the michelin wide tires fit on our buses?
how much are the tires and rims ?
thanx
chris |
David Hartley (Drdave)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 06, 2006 - 8:02 pm: | |
What kind of bus?
Only the late models have the front ends designed for the big front tires. Like Prevost...
If you are thinking about Big Singles for the rear, Think again. Takes special offset rims and tires are outragiously expensive. Ask any dump truck operator what they pay.... |
David Hartley (Drdave)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 06, 2006 - 8:12 pm: | |
Ahhh.. Sorry, are you referring to the XDU in the 315/80R22.5 ? They are only rated at 65 mph.
They will fit an 8.25" rim but are made for the 9 inch rims like on the MC9's.
I just bought a pair of Goodyear G670RV in the 315/80R22.5 and with all the mounting, computer balancing and moving other tires around cost me over $1,300.00 , They are rated at 75 mph. and 9,000 lbs @130 psi. Made for RV's with special rubber that resists degrading from sun and limited use. Nice tires.. Their site said 7 year life. |
chris
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 06, 2006 - 8:38 pm: | |
dave
thanx for the info
i saw the show trick my truck on cmt (country music television) and they took the rear 8 off an 18 wheeler and put on 4 of the wide tires w/ new alcoas. i was thinking of putting them my rears(mci5c)
maybe i will call michelin
chris |
David Hartley (Drdave)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 06, 2006 - 9:20 pm: | |
Actually Michelin does make a Big Single.
It does have a 62 to 65 mph speed rating.
http://www.michelintruck.com/michelintruck/productguide/newprod/TireSpecs.jsp?tread=XTE2+% 28wb%29
Goodyear also has them as do some of the other manufacturers. Takes a 13 or 14 Inch rim.
Depending on the axle weight of your MC5C you may not be able to use the less expensive versions. And if you ever have a flat finding a replacement may be a problem in some areas.
Nice Idea though... Buses have strange axle weight loading unlike truck tractors with dual drive axles. They distribute the load at 4 or 8 points. On the truck and the trailer distributes the balance on its axles. Usually 2 axles. |
Bill K
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 06, 2006 - 10:03 pm: | |
I have wrote to Michelin and Goodyear and ask about the age of tire and the saftey issue, They both said that they did not have a age limit, It all depended on use and how they are stored. Mainly a visual inspection from what I can gather. |
William J Kluge, Jr. (Flx_a_bill)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, March 07, 2006 - 9:27 am: | |
Michelin also makes two super-wides (a single to replace a dual tire application) that have a 75 mph rating, the Xone XDA-HT Plus (size 445/50R22.5 & 455/55R22.5) that are to be mounted on 14" rims.... Yes, I understand they are pricy and would not use them on a bus without a tire monitor system.... but as demand increases... just a thought. |
Tim Strommen (Tim_strommen)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, March 07, 2006 - 11:09 am: | |
I was just looking at those this week (ain't that a co-inky-dink)
The only detail the worries me so far is the tread width (~18" for the Xone-HT-Plus 455/55R22.5). I'm currently using 12R22.5's and I don't like the idea of losing the extra 6" of tread width.
Since I'm going through the motions of updating the brakes to discs, I figured that re-evaluating tire technology may be a good idea...
Thoughts?
Cheers!
-Tim Strommen |
William J Kluge, Jr. (Flx_a_bill)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, March 07, 2006 - 12:04 pm: | |
Relative to the last entry, I've been pondering the same, updating to disc brakes, if I could find assemblies at a reasonable cost, and meanwhile, going with super singles for a couple of reasons... and in my work, I've measured a lot of truck tire tread widths, and usually find they are in the range of 8 to 9 inches wide...The overall width at the sidewalls usually corresponds to the size on the tire, like 11R22.5 vs 12R22.5 (11" and 12" overal widths). Therefore, I don't think you are lossing 6" of treadwidth, and that design wise, there are comprable to handle the loads... Otherwise, they would not be used on large trucks, especially, tanker trucks and what not... For what its worth.... |
Tim Strommen (Tim_strommen)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, March 07, 2006 - 2:24 pm: | |
Thanks WJK,
I saw those tires on a "Flying J" tanker and they look good. The driver of that truck said that he liked the way they made the truck handle (improved ride/tracking - and they're quieter). There's a little capacity loss with the super singles, but a little weight loss too (aluminum rims + super singles only weigh about 50 pounds more than one of the 12R22.5s I'm running now - which makes it about 150lbs lighter on the rubber for the "dual", ~300lbs lighter for the axle).
Disc Brakes... Not cheap. I've been mulling over the Bendix Air-Disc setup. Expensive - but I like the idea of stopping... it just feels like a good idea. My rig has an Allison Auto, and no retarder or Jake. Something has to give.
Big Toys, Big Bills - right?
Cheers!
-Tim Strommen |
Richard Bowyer (Drivingmisslazy)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, March 07, 2006 - 3:29 pm: | |
In general, I think the addition of a Jake would be of much more overall benefit and significantly less expensive. I do not feel that the addition of disc brakes would have been of any material benefit on my 80 Eagle after I went thru them and replaced brake shoes and did everything recommended to bring them into top shape. I know they would very quickly lock up all wheels in an emergency.
Richard |
William J Kluge, Jr. (Flx_a_bill)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, March 07, 2006 - 4:13 pm: | |
If your focus is on general stops, long grades and what not, yes, the addition of Jake Brakes is less expensive. But if you put the focus more toward collision avoidance and hard sudden braking, then the reduced brake lag time (or brake response time), more reponsive brakes (especially with ABS), reduced fad characteristics, and reduced stopping distances, then disc brakes have been shown to be better. And industry is going toward that direction... I've seen where a half of second (through reduced lag time and increased braking performance) can be the difference whether a collision may or may not have occurred. Thats one reason ABS is required on all road vehicles is these days. And how many new passenger vehicles, sedans, pickups and SUVs have front drum brakes... None...
That said, it is a big step to basically retrofit an older air brake system with disc brakes.. thats where an engineering background, significant experience with air brake systems and asistance from brake manufacturers, along with other factors, is probably essential... Therefore, the installation of a Jake Brake system is a remarkable inprovement or feature relative to vehicle safety and operating performance... In General... Just a thought.... |
Tim Strommen (Tim_strommen)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, March 07, 2006 - 4:51 pm: | |
The Gillig Phantom I bought from Lane Transit in Oregon, had some known issues with the front brake hardware. This is triggering a major overhaul already - and I'm weighing the cost of doing a full disc upgrade/over-haul, to simply replacing the drums, shoes, cams, cylinders, and mounts - plus adding Jakes (which will require a significant amount of work to the 6V92’s head, and some wiring), or replacing my transmission with one that features a retarder (and re-engineering the cooling system to support the higher transmission heat-load).
Any way I cut it, I'm in for some work and some spending...
Disc brakes look like a single change that will improve my deceleration performance in almost all my situations (won’t have to worry if the torque converter is locked up or not), and will remedy the current problems. In theory, this coupled with my desire to scrub the steel wheels I have in favor of aluminum - should provide a cooler brake, less heat-related tire wear (tire fires also not as likely), and an overall safer ride for me, my passengers, and the vehicles on the road around me. My mileage is known - yours may vary...
Cheers!
-Tim Strommen |
William J Kluge, Jr. (Flx_a_bill)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, March 07, 2006 - 5:42 pm: | |
Thanks Tim...
Forward thinking... implimentation, inovation, and a desire to make better.. I appreciate that.... |
Tom Caffrey (Pvcces)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, March 07, 2006 - 11:25 pm: | |
Tim, I would expect that the risk of tire fires is almost completely avoidable with operator care, a Jake brake and a tire pressure monitoring system.
To make a comparison with converting to disc brakes, you need only compare the differences that you will wind up with.
Since it seems to me that you will have operator care and a pressure monitoring system, regardless of your choice, you are only looking at the disc conversion versus the Jake and restoration of the drum system.
I would not consider discs a defense against a mountain grade, but a Jake will work wonders on them.
For what it's worth.
Tom Caffrey PD4106-2576
Suncatcher
Ketchikan, Alaska |
FAST FRED
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, March 08, 2006 - 6:26 am: | |
"Disc brakes look like a single change that will improve my deceleration performance in almost all my situations"
Some transits (an other busses) use a brake treddle valve that does NOT give full line pressure to the breaks. This keeps he Standees, standing.
You might wish to install a line pressure gage in the front , and see what you have.
The replacements usually are "drop in" and not very expensive.
The decelerstion improvement in a panic stop is noticable, you can lock the front wheels, if not carefull.
FAST FRED |
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