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RJmule (Rjmule)
Registered Member
Username: Rjmule
Post Number: 29
Registered: 2-2007
Posted From: 75.51.75.240
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, March 27, 2007 - 9:14 pm: | |
OK,I have been searching every where for good used tires but it seems that Mexico has a shortage of 12R-22.5 tires because here in So.Calif they are buying them all up.So i have found Toyo tires in the range of $235 to $280 which i have read from some of you nuts are a great tire,If they are as good as the price I'd be a happy camper.I really do not want a stiff or too hard of a tire so not sure if the 16 ply has every thing to do with that.What about 11R-22.5 tires?? is the 11 the width of the tire? if so would it be too narrow for drivers and tag.Any info would be greatly appreciated. Also if there are any nuts in So.Calif with used tires with good tread left and want to sell them PLEASE give me a shout. Thanks All for taking the time to read my topic.RJmule |
Bob greenwood (Bob_greenwood)
Registered Member
Username: Bob_greenwood
Post Number: 788
Registered: 7-2006
Posted From: 64.136.49.228
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, March 27, 2007 - 10:03 pm: | |
go for the toyo....Id do 12's |
Larry & Lynne Dixon (Larry_d)
Registered Member
Username: Larry_d
Post Number: 78
Registered: 7-2005
Posted From: 71.111.191.199
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, March 27, 2007 - 11:01 pm: | |
I have a 4905 and I went for the 11 x 22.5, still think of myself as a newbeeeeeeeee but have about 10K or more on them I like the ride and steering.
Just for what it is worth. 4905 Larry |
Gus Causbie (Gusc)
Registered Member
Username: Gusc
Post Number: 321
Registered: 11-2005
Posted From: 63.97.117.11
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, March 27, 2007 - 11:10 pm: | |
I put TOYO M122 11R22.5 14 ply steer tires on my 4104 last summer and really like them. The improved ride is to be believed and they are easy to find at truck locations.
Since your bus is heavier you may need 12" width but I doubt it. It all depends on the rated tire load capacity and your bus weight. Most conversions are much lighter weight than buses loaded with passengers and cargo. |
larry currier (Larryc)
Registered Member
Username: Larryc
Post Number: 70
Registered: 2-2007
Posted From: 207.200.116.13
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, March 27, 2007 - 11:31 pm: | |
Toyo is a very good tire. The 1100 is the height of the sidewall. Thats why 11R24.5 and 12R22.5 turn about the same RPM. There is nothing wrong with 11R22.5, they are shorter and you will loose about 5 MPH. If you are not running out of gear (top speed), you should be happy with them. You will be a little closer to the ground. The tread width is very close to the same or the same, on all the tires we have discussed. I see no reason to buy 16 ply unless you need the extra 500 lbs they are rated for. If I remember right 14 ply are rated at 6340 lb each. So if your steer or tag is under 12,680lb you will have rating to spare. Americas trucks all run 14 ply tires. We beat them up all day everyday. Private Coach duty is light by comparison. The Toyo 127 wears like steel and it does not have or need the tread depth that you find on some tires. That said, I feel lots of tread depth cushions your ride to a degree. If you buy used, look inside. Don't buy a tire if it even has a patch. A nail hole will pump water to the cords after flat repair. |
Steveggt (Steveggt)
Registered Member
Username: Steveggt
Post Number: 17
Registered: 12-2006
Posted From: 71.116.113.154
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, March 28, 2007 - 1:33 am: | |
Howdy RJMule!
Really quickly...the 11R22.5 is a very common truck tire. This tire size can be found at any truck stop. You'll notice a significant difference in price between the 11R22.5 and 12R22.5 with the 11R22.5 costing less.
I'm in the process of restoring a 4107, and we're going to 11R22.5's.
Good luck! - Steve |
James Robinson (Jjrbus)
Registered Member
Username: Jjrbus
Post Number: 48
Registered: 12-2000
Posted From: 76.1.180.218
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, March 28, 2007 - 7:58 am: | |
I'm doing the same switch! But if I could find 12Rs for $235/280. It would not be an issue. Thelowest price here in FL for 2 12R steer tires is over $800!!! That is mounted balanced taxs ect. And that is for off brand tires. Name brands are over a $1K.
To the best of my understanding to make this change. You need to have the bus weighted. to get a front and rear axle weight. Then check the weight rating of the tires. It varies by manufactuer. This weight is also needed to find the proper air pressure to run in the tires. This info is found on the manufactures websites.
Some of the 11R 14 ply tires have weight ratings as low as 6000 lbs! If your front axle is 12,500 you would be overloading these tires by 500lbs!
In reasearching this I found that there are different types of tires, Over the road type, reginol, ect. For my type of driving I would be better off with a reginol tire. It has a thicker sidewall which will take more abuse!
HTH |
Gus Causbie (Gusc)
Registered Member
Username: Gusc
Post Number: 330
Registered: 11-2005
Posted From: 63.97.117.32
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, March 28, 2007 - 11:38 pm: | |
Larry,
I'm pretty sure that the 1100 is the max width of the tire in inches unless something has changed lately. I don't know of any measure for the sidewall height except the aspect ratio on auto tires (50,60,70 series mostly today). The 265, 285 and etc series are widths in centimeters.
There is no standard designator for tire diameter, you just have to read the manufacturer's specs to find out. The same size tire for different mfgs can be different diameters, sometimes even from the same mfg. |
larry currier (Larryc)
Registered Member
Username: Larryc
Post Number: 73
Registered: 2-2007
Posted From: 207.200.116.13
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, March 29, 2007 - 12:26 am: | |
Gus, respectfully, you are wrong. The difference between a 11R22.5 and a 12R22.5 is 5 MPH at top speed. I don't see how a wider tire can make you go faster. Do you? |
Kyle Brandt (Kyle4501)
Registered Member
Username: Kyle4501
Post Number: 303
Registered: 9-2004
Posted From: 65.23.106.193
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, March 29, 2007 - 8:53 am: | |
If you go to http://www.goodyear.com/truck/pdf/databook/dimensions.pdf
You will see that;
- the 11R22.5 varries from 493 to 503 revs per mile.
- the 12R22.5 varries from 478 to 484 revs per mile.
So there is significant speed difference for the same size tire from the same manufacturer.
Generally speaking, the 12 is a wider tire. The minimum rim width for the 12 is wider than the 11. And the minimum spacing for duals is wider for the 12.
Bottom line, the size on the tire sidewall means little without the size/ load chart for that tire.
If one is buying a complete set of tires, I'd suggest finding out what sizes are redially available & go to the charts to see if one of them will meet your needs. The horror stories of the time & expense spent on the side of the road due to a flat result from using non-standard tires. We have the advantage of being able to run almost any size tire (space wise), we should take advantage of that.
As always, YMMV
(Message edited by kyle4501 on March 29, 2007) |
Gus Causbie (Gusc)
Registered Member
Username: Gusc
Post Number: 338
Registered: 11-2005
Posted From: 63.97.117.11
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, March 31, 2007 - 2:17 am: | |
Larry,
I've never quite figured that one out either, I just know that it is usually the case.Same goes for auto tires. Makes no sense to me?
Obviously the speed difference has nothing to do with the width and I didn't say it did. It seems that wider tires are larger all around and usually have a higher load rating.
Kyle,
I think, that unlike with diameters, the 1200 tire is always wider than the 1100 when mounted on the correct width wheel. At least that has been my experience. |
Cameron Jones (Crazy71)
Registered Member
Username: Crazy71
Post Number: 49
Registered: 12-2006
Posted From: 75.179.153.89
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, April 01, 2007 - 8:07 pm: | |
Seems to be confusion over the 11 or 12 part of the tire number.
I always thought it was the width of the tread....like 315(mm) is on a metric sized tire.
SO my question is....can I have 11s and 12s on the same coach at the same time..
What about 11R22.5 on the tag if the drive are 12R22.5??? |
Gus Causbie (Gusc)
Registered Member
Username: Gusc
Post Number: 340
Registered: 11-2005
Posted From: 63.97.117.13
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, April 01, 2007 - 11:59 pm: | |
Cameron,
I'm not confused about widths but you can call a tire dealer to confirm it. It is the overall width of the tire not the tread.
I don't know about tags but drive and steer tires do not have to be the same size. Tires on the same axle have to be the same diameter, not sure about the width though but would think it doesn't matter. |
Kyle Brandt (Kyle4501)
Registered Member
Username: Kyle4501
Post Number: 305
Registered: 9-2004
Posted From: 65.23.106.193
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, April 02, 2007 - 8:34 am: | |
If the tires on the same axle aren't matched (size & load capacity), you could get some handling problems. If they aren't matched on a dual, one will carry too much weight & that's not good either.
I'm thinking the width refers to the width of the 'shoulder' of the tire. Thing is, the shoulder is a difficult thing to locate on a tire, it's location varies due to tire construction. |
Cameron Jones (Crazy71)
Registered Member
Username: Crazy71
Post Number: 50
Registered: 12-2006
Posted From: 75.179.153.89
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, April 02, 2007 - 1:01 pm: | |
Hey Gus,
wasn't disagreeing with you. I thought the 11 or 12 was width...I was think thinking it was measured at the tread....but the widest part at sidewall makes sense...
I have had many jeep tires that were 31x10.5 and they would only come close to 10.5 if you measure at the widest part at sidewall bulge. |
john w. roan (Chessie4905)
Registered Member
Username: Chessie4905
Post Number: 515
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 71.58.117.21
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, April 02, 2007 - 8:54 pm: | |
on cars and light trucks, the tire is rated at the width across the sidewall at the widest point, not at the tread. This is why different tires of the same size have different tread widths. The uniform tire rating system that is used was either done by tire manufacturers or had their input when it was started. This gives tire manufacturers some fudge room to offer a cheaper tire with a narrower tread to save on material, thus keeping the price down. Check out a cheap car tire from a discount tire company and then compare it with a premium tire from a major manufacturer that is the same size with the same specs. Of course cheap tires have cheaper rubber, not as efficient a tread pattern and usually will crack sooner out in the sun. Also the as new balance usually isn't as good and out of roundness is worse too. BTW I have a 4905 that has set for 10 years with factory Firestone lease tires on it ( 12.75 x 22.5 ) that has set in direct sunlight and there are no cracks in the sidewalls. Tires themselves are probably 6 to 7 years old= 17 years.( Not my conversion ) I beleive that they use a better rubber on their own lease models, as a comparable Firestone commercial truck tire will develop sidewall cracks in a couple of years from setting. I'm not referring to the imported commercial tires that will be cheaper than domestics because their cost of manufacturer is is less overseas.The dilema for most coach owners is that they may only drive 3 to 6 thousand miles a year and have a hard time justifying spending 3 to 4 thousand on tires that should be changed every 7 or 8 years. |
Gus Causbie (Gusc)
Registered Member
Username: Gusc
Post Number: 342
Registered: 11-2005
Posted From: 63.97.117.25
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, April 02, 2007 - 10:22 pm: | |
Cameron,
No, I knew you weren't, sorry if I sounded argumentative. I mentioned checking with a dealer because another poster seems to be confused about width designations. Any dealer can clear that point up.
That 31x10.5 Jeep tire is an exception to most tire sizing? In that case the 31" is the tire diameter. It appears that very few tires use that measurement except oversize tires for offroad machines. Another mystery of the tire world! |
Cameron Jones (Crazy71)
Registered Member
Username: Crazy71
Post Number: 51
Registered: 12-2006
Posted From: 75.179.153.89
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, April 02, 2007 - 11:20 pm: | |
You're right on about crazy tire world.
Remember G78-14....That's what all of the cars had on them when I started wrenching on them..Bias ply...Hey....those steel belted tires always look low on air.....ha ha.
The Jeep tires....only a few sizes left that start with the diameter...they always fib a bit too the larger number too.
Never seen a 31 that was quite 31 inches tall...
I have a 12R22.5 on the right side tag and a 315-80 on the left tag...
The left is...well...bald...so I have to get something pretty soon...
I just need some old take off or something. I am thinking I will find an 11r22.5 easier. |
john w. roan (Chessie4905)
Registered Member
Username: Chessie4905
Post Number: 520
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 71.58.117.21
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, April 03, 2007 - 5:04 pm: | |
Nimco bus in New Jersey has takeoffs on alum rims cheap. Rims would need polished. |
Gus Causbie (Gusc)
Registered Member
Username: Gusc
Post Number: 343
Registered: 11-2005
Posted From: 63.97.117.53
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, April 03, 2007 - 10:09 pm: | |
Cameron,
A 315 is 12.4"(315/25.4)wide but for tags I would think that diameter is more important. I would think that different diameter tags would cause some hopping around but don't really know.
The 11R22.5 probably will be quite a bit smaller diameter but it all depends--
The 80 in the 315-80 is the ratio of width to height and the 315 is overall width in mm. In other words height is 80% of overall width. Truck/bus tires have been 80 just about forever except for the newer low profile. |
Cameron Jones (Crazy71)
Registered Member
Username: Crazy71
Post Number: 53
Registered: 12-2006
Posted From: 75.179.153.89
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, April 04, 2007 - 12:40 am: | |
I have thought about the tag diameter myself..
The tags are on manual valve releases....MC8.
When you have air to them, they air up to a set pressure adjusted surely by a regulator somewhere???
SO if it goes by pressure...I don't see why it would matter if you put a taller tire on....
Wouldn't it just hit the ground sooner and build pressure faster than a shorter tire.
Let's say we are talking 2 inches here..
if the tag air bags go to 30 psi....random thought here....maybe my above is wrong.
If the tag bag has 30 psi regardless....the taller tire might be pushing down harder since it hit the ground sooner....
AAAARRHGG...physics... |
Kyle Brandt (Kyle4501)
Registered Member
Username: Kyle4501
Post Number: 308
Registered: 9-2004
Posted From: 65.23.106.193
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, April 04, 2007 - 8:27 am: | |
The force for an air bag is nearly constant for a given air pressure. That is why they ride so smooth, a flat spring rate. If your tags are independent from each other, tire size from side to side won't matter enough to notice. If the tag tires are connected (movement of one effects the other), then different sized tires will have a bigger impact & may cause noticeable problems.
Then there are those of us that have dual tires on the tag axle. . . |