| Author | Message | ||
| Christopher Goodwin (Cgoodwin)
Registered Member Username: Cgoodwin Post Number: 65 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 71.212.53.189 Rating: |
I want to install a small electric air compressor to recharge the air tank for my doors, anyone have advice based on experience? (Neoplan Cityliner with air operated doors front and rear) I have also considered using the road AC compressor as an air compressor to run air tools... hide a tank under the bus and recharge it while driving or with the engine running. | ||
| Nick Badame Refrigeration Co. (Dnick85)
Registered Member Username: Dnick85 Post Number: 150 Registered: 2-2006 Posted From: 70.211.241.132 Rating: N/A |
Hi Christopher, The only draw back I see of using the A/C compressor for air is if you ever had a problem with your engine, you would be left out cold for a way to make air to air up your Bellows or air tools for repairs. The one great thing about this hobby is that you can do everything "Your Way" except for electrical and propane of course........ Good Luck Nick- | ||
| George M. Todd (George_mc6)
Registered Member Username: George_mc6 Post Number: 225 Registered: 8-2006 Posted From: 76.168.69.233 Rating: N/A |
Chris, Many people install an electric compressor, and there are lots of reasons to, including being able to leave a campground quickly and quietly in the early morning. I would not recommend trying to use the bus A/C comp as an air compressor, due to oil return issues. Oil circulates with the Freon, and the comp is designed to get that oil back with the returning Freon. As an air comp, you will get more oil in your air than an air compressor puts out, which isn't nice. Is your comp equipped with a clutch, or is it continuously driven, and unloaded when not used? (Lack of oil in the unloaded types is disastrous!) Sorry to rain on your campfire, George | ||
| john w. roan (Chessie4905)
Registered Member Username: Chessie4905 Post Number: 630 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 71.58.117.21 Rating: N/A |
My 4905 has a smaller Craftsman air compressor unit secured in the middle of the rear bay out of the way. Has an oilless pump, so no maintenance concerns about changing pump oil or oil in air system. Tank is 12 or 20 gallons, and operated from switch in driver's area. Tied into coach air system for keeping the suspension aired up when boondocked all winter by previous owner. Works real nice and you can hardly hear it run. Saves airing up the coach without running the engine. Make sure you provide easy access for draining the moisture from the tank. Don't know if previous owner ever did this... I drained about 2 gallons from it when I got the coach. Really nice item to have. | ||
| Christopher Goodwin (Cgoodwin)
Registered Member Username: Cgoodwin Post Number: 66 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 71.212.53.189 Rating: N/A |
So really any 40 tp 100 psi compressor should do it for the doors and suspension. Do most people use 120vac units? Should it be tied into the outlet line from the engine compressor so it can recharge all systems? Any idea what CFM is typical? | ||
| john w. roan (Chessie4905)
Registered Member Username: Chessie4905 Post Number: 633 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 71.58.117.21 Rating: N/A |
I went out and checked...1HP motor, direct drive oilless compressor mounted on top of tank; has a 12gallon tank. Runs off 120volt when plugged in or off inverter. It's one of those Sears Craftsman units with wheels and handle. Wheels are removed and bolted to floor with some rubber noise isolation. Can be shut off when not in use or left on and pressure regulator on unit will cut out when not calling for air.I think it is 4.0 cfm. Check the Sears catalog to get an idea, and shop around for a comparable setup at your price.Takes up very little room and isn't heavy unless 12 gallon tank is full of air.  | ||
| James Robinson (Jjrbus)
Registered Member Username: Jjrbus Post Number: 91 Registered: 12-2000 Posted From: 76.1.180.218 Rating: N/A |
Most of what I have seen are the small 120 volt units about $100 compressors, oil or oiless. I prefer the oiled but some swear by the oiless. In my opinion 40 psi would be just about useless, you could not air up a bike tire with it. My compressor is rated at 3.8 cu ft per minute @ 90PSI. Is adequit for most things. Will pump up a bus tire but takes a while. I am not familiar with your bus, but it would be best to tie in close to bus compressor, so air will go through dryer. On the MCI the line from compressor goes to a "Ping" tank, that is where I tied mine in. Mine is installed in engine comartment. I left the quick disconnect on compressor and used DOT tubing with shutoff valve to connect to ping tank. This way I can disconnect bus and use air hose as needed. HTH Jim | ||
| Sean Welsh (Sean)
Registered Member Username: Sean Post Number: 583 Registered: 1-2003 Posted From: 67.142.130.37 Rating: N/A |
Chris, Once again, as a fellow Neoplan (with air operated plug door) owner, I have to chime in. We are on our fourth electric air compressor for this application. Now, admittedly, we also have an air-operated toilet, adding to our overall usage, but I think you will have similar results. Our first try was a small 1hp Senco air-nailer compressor. It had very low current draw, but it was noisy (and, mind you, it comes on at all hours of the night), and it ran for a long time (several minutes) each cycle. http://www.senco.com/con_rem/ViewTool.aspx?toolid=175 We finally ditched the Senco and went to a Porter-Cable oil-free pancake model, 150PSI max, from Lowe's. This gave up the ghost within two months -- just not up to the duty cycle, I guess. Lowe's exchanged it, and the identical replacement ran for about six months with, ultimately, the same result. Porter-Cable fixed it under warranty, but I had had enough. http://www.porter-cable.com/index.asp?e=547&p=6193 (Similar model -- mine's discontinued) We now have a Hitachi conventionally oiled compressor. http://www.hitachipowertools.com/store_item.php?iID=556&arrPath=1,9,49,p556, We chose this model specifically because it was oil-lubricated and powered by an induction motor (vs. universal motor as are many cheaper compressors). So far, this has proven to be the best solution for us. It was a bit pricey compared to the other models, and it has a bigger inrush start-up current when it kicks in, but with 5.3 CFM @40psi and 4 CFM @100 psi, it runs for less time. It's a 135 psi unit, and we have the output regulator dialed down to around 90, which is plenty for the door, the toilet, and to keep the air bags up. This model also has dual quick-connect outputs, so I don't have to disconnect the umbilical to the bus when I want to plug in an air tool. FWIW. -Sean http://OurOdyssey.BlogSpot.com | ||
| Christopher Goodwin (Cgoodwin)
Registered Member Username: Cgoodwin Post Number: 67 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 71.212.53.189 Rating: N/A |
Thanks Sean, did you read my other post regarding motorcycles on the end of the Rooftop ac off alternator thread? | ||
| Sean Welsh (Sean)
Registered Member Username: Sean Post Number: 586 Registered: 1-2003 Posted From: 208.178.75.194 Rating: N/A |
Yes, just answered it. --Sean | ||
| Chuck Newman (Chuck_newman)
Registered Member Username: Chuck_newman Post Number: 204 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 71.130.233.12 Rating: N/A |
Sean, Did you plumb your compressors into the wet tank or dry tank? Does one need a check valve on the output of the electric compressor? | ||
| Debbie and Joe Cannarozzi (Joe_camper)
Registered Member Username: Joe_camper Post Number: 4 Registered: 10-2006 Posted From: 76.237.140.211 Rating: N/A |
Ours is a Daton oilless and is hooked into the accessory tank. I think before you install it you should take a squirt bottle of windex add 2 shots of dish soap, this makes it thick and sticky, and go around the ENTIRE BUS squirting every fitting every air bag every hose you can and get it to hold air as best you can first. You will be amazed at the results. Cheep simple and very rewarding. Ours used to cycle every hour when we bought the bus and after this soapy water process we wake up to 90 lbs, when its summer that is, now our compressor only kicks on only when accessories are used. I still do this every so often and it really pays off. This will put years on both compressors. Deb and Joe 86XL | ||
| john w. roan (Chessie4905)
Registered Member Username: Chessie4905 Post Number: 638 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 71.58.117.21 Rating: N/A |
Mine is plumbed into line going the main tank since it has it's own tank and most water will accumulate there. Haven't seen a problem with this setup. I would recommend that every coach owner plan on installing an air drier, as it will help eliminate a lot of the air brake and leveling problems that consume many of the posts on this forum. Just had to share that- not because of the added compressor. You might like to add a check valve in the comp. output incase of a massive air loss in the coach system someday; could come in handy.If your comp. is rated at 100 psi. and coach pumps up to 125, the comp. pop off valve is going to blow. I adjusted mine to about 135 so it isn't a problem. Make sure you have it on a separate switch, so you can shut it off if you don't want it to run when you aren't around or whatever. | ||
| Sean Welsh (Sean)
Registered Member Username: Sean Post Number: 590 Registered: 1-2003 Posted From: 71.129.84.239 Rating: N/A |
Chuck, We used a line that had already been installed by the original converter, so I can't say for sure. I think it goes to the first dry tank (just past the dryer). There is a protection valve in the line -- open in both directions, unless there is a sudden pressure loss. So if I open the drains on the portable compressor tanks, for example, the bus does not lose air. Also, the little compressor can not air the bus up from dead empty, as the protection works both ways. As long as there is pressure on both sides, everything works. We used to have a small dryer between the compressor and the bus, but it never accumulated anything -- all the moisture condenses out in the metal tanks of the compressor. I empty them about once a week or so -- not as often as I should, but it's a pain in the butt. -Sean http://OurOdyssey.BlogSpot.com | ||
| john w. roan (Chessie4905)
Registered Member Username: Chessie4905 Post Number: 642 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 71.58.117.21 Rating: N/A |
Sean- Bendix makes a lowcost moisture ejector that dumps the moisture everytime the compressor cycles. BTW, that's one impressive coach you have! One nice advantage if the compressor can supply sufficient air, would be if your main air compressor quit out in the middle of nowhere, like happened to someone a few posts back. It would help you to get to a place to get the engine driven one repaired, or at least provide enough air to get your coach off the road. | ||
| Stephen Fessenden (Sffess)
Registered Member Username: Sffess Post Number: 704 Registered: 1-2002 Posted From: 67.142.130.50 Rating: N/A |
I have a Thomas compressor to install in my bus that will produce 100 PSI but at low flow. It is a continuous duty compressor for Oxygen generation for medical use. It is very quiet. I have not installed mine but I did a lot of research before buying it. It can run off a 1000 watt inverter if there is no AC. If interested use Thomas in the search for a compressor on Ebay and you might find one. VERY QUIET. I had planned to use it to air up suspension quietly in campgrounds. It would probably take close to half an hour to do it. | ||
| Jason Whitaker (Jeepme)
Registered Member Username: Jeepme Post Number: 42 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 216.17.255.130 Rating: N/A |
Stephen, Are you talking about a compressor like this? http://cgi.ebay.com/THOMAS-AIR-PUMP-115-VOLT-MODEL-107CE20-906-WORKS-WELL_W0QQitemZ1201427 97784QQihZ002QQcategoryZ46548QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem or this? http://cgi.ebay.com/THOMAS-INDUSTRIES-MEDICAL-AIR-COMPRESSOR-607CA22_W0QQitemZ230152286419 QQihZ013QQcategoryZ3193QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem thanks, Jason | ||
| Paul Lawry (Dreamscape)
Registered Member Username: Dreamscape Post Number: 44 Registered: 5-2007 Posted From: 64.40.223.242 Rating: N/A |
When I broke down last year in Palm Springs, I was sure glad I had my small twin tank compressor on board. I lost my compressor on the Detroit and used the small one to get me off I-10. I have not plumbed it permanently yet, but plan to do so in the future. Good Luck, Paul | ||
| Christopher Goodwin (Cgoodwin)
Registered Member Username: Cgoodwin Post Number: 73 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 67.40.193.222 Rating: N/A |
Any symptoms before the compressor failed??? | ||
| john w. roan (Chessie4905)
Registered Member Username: Chessie4905 Post Number: 643 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 71.58.117.21 Rating: N/A |
-Once one has a compressor go down on the road, they will appreciate having an auxillary unit on board. Also can assist regular one when changing a tire on the road with an air wrench. | ||
| Paul Lawry (Dreamscape)
Registered Member Username: Dreamscape Post Number: 45 Registered: 5-2007 Posted From: 64.40.223.242 Rating: N/A |
I heard a click coming from the electrical panel next to the driver. Looked at my gauges and saw the air pressure was dropping and not rebuilding. Not knowing what to look for (at the time) I assumed my governer was bad, replaced with new. Not the problem at all. After a fellow busnut (luvrbus) stopped by with an exact duplicate of mine, he tore my old one apart. The key was sheared, all else looked good. I'll fix it and have a spare. | ||
| Sean Welsh (Sean)
Registered Member Username: Sean Post Number: 594 Registered: 1-2003 Posted From: 71.129.206.247 Rating: N/A |
"Bendix makes a lowcost moisture ejector that dumps the moisture everytime the compressor cycles." Is that something that can be retrofit onto a twin-tank? As I said, my problem is not moisture in the lines -- just accumulation in the tanks of the portable compressor. "One nice advantage if the compressor can supply sufficient air, would be if your main air compressor quit out in the middle of nowhere, ... at least provide enough air to get your coach off the road" I do have a hose and a direct fill port to the main tank, so I can, indeed, get the coach going if the main compressor is down. I just need to use the hose to fill the main tank until the two-way protection valve opens, then the electric compressor can keep the bus topped up. I also have an emergency tank, which provides enough air to release the spring brakes no matter what. This allows one to at least move to the side of the road (or off the train tracks, or whatever) should the spring brakes come on due to loss of service air pressure (or other failures). -Sean http://OurOdyssey.BlogSpot.com | ||
| john w. roan (Chessie4905)
Registered Member Username: Chessie4905 Post Number: 646 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 71.58.117.21 Rating: N/A |
I think the company is now Allied Signal, but it connects into the tank drain outlet with a signal line to cutout to activate it. I've seen some that don't use a signal line. Simple to hookup. | ||
| john w. roan (Chessie4905)
Registered Member Username: Chessie4905 Post Number: 647 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 71.58.117.21 Rating: N/A |
Sean; sent you an e-mail on the moisture ejector | ||
| mark (Coolbus)
Registered Member Username: Coolbus Post Number: 65 Registered: 7-2006 Posted From: 71.54.200.151 Rating: N/A |
John, I am also interested in the moisture ejector you refered to. Can you post the info here or email the info directrly to me? I have a small 110v air compressor with a similar setup on my bus which also collects a lot of water! Thanks alot, Mark | ||
| Stephen Fessenden (Sffess)
Registered Member Username: Sffess Post Number: 706 Registered: 1-2002 Posted From: 67.142.130.13 Rating: N/A |
Jason,neither of the compressors are the same as the one I have but the nebulizer compressor certainly has the specs to run 100 PSI and air up in about 30 minutes on low power. I could not power air brakes in the event of a DD compressor failure. In order to be a medical product it has to be pretty reliable. | ||
| Arthur J Griffith (Arthurseagle)
Registered Member Username: Arthurseagle Post Number: 35 Registered: 8-2006 Posted From: 72.236.102.240 Rating: N/A |
I bought a moisture ejector about ten years ago from Harbor Freight and installed it on my shop air compressor. It has worked great. Every time the compressor cycles off it spits out any accumilated water. Very happy with results. ARTHUR | ||
| john w. roan (Chessie4905)
Registered Member Username: Chessie4905 Post Number: 651 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 71.58.117.21 Rating: N/A |
Mark, e-mail on the way! | ||
| Jason Whitaker (Jeepme)
Registered Member Username: Jeepme Post Number: 43 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 216.17.182.241 Rating: N/A |
Thanks for the tip Stephan. I think I'll keep an eye on ebay and try to pick a simular one up. |
