| Author | Message | ||
| Douglas Tappan (Dougthebonifiedbusnut)
Registered Member Username: Dougthebonifiedbusnut Post Number: 82 Registered: 10-2004 Posted From: 75.69.223.64  Rating: N/A |
Hey All, I want to tow my F350 duelly and I guess I'd better get some sort of brake system for it. I have been towing my Jeep Wrangler forever and never worried about brakes as I have 3 axles but the duelly might raise some eyebrows so if anybody has done this lately I would love the info.I would go to the archives but the technology changes so quickly I think fresh info might be better. Thanks in advance | ||
| Bill Gerrie (Bill_gerrie)
Registered Member Username: Bill_gerrie Post Number: 238 Registered: 3-2006 Posted From: 216.198.139.38 Rating: N/A |
Doug I've used a system made by M&G Engineering. It is a cylinder that fits between the master cylinder and booster unit. It is operated by air pressure from the coaches brake system. I've used it for over 20 years on various vehicles and now have it on my pickup. You definately need extra braking on a heavy vehicle like a duelly. Remember the law of physics. Bill | ||
| R.C.Bishop (Chuckllb)
Registered Member Username: Chuckllb Post Number: 568 Registered: 7-2006 Posted From: 75.210.152.24 Rating: N/A |
Xl'nt link, Bill...a bit pricey, me thinks, but looks like a sound system. Thanx for the help!  RCB | ||
| ED Hackenbruch (Shadowman)
Registered Member Username: Shadowman Post Number: 112 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 70.1.166.0 Rating: N/A |
I have been using the Unified Tow Brake from U.S. Gear for 4 years and have been very happy with it. | ||
| Jack Conrad (Jackconrad)
Registered Member Username: Jackconrad Post Number: 986 Registered: 12-2000 Posted From: 71.54.29.215  Rating: N/A |
You might want to go to www.hitchtrader.com and look under "BUY" to see what is available in used components. This is where we found our M&G for 1/2 the cost of new as well as our tow bar base plates for an even bigger savings. I would like to tow our F350 crew cab dually (with a paint job similar to our bus), but my wife says the dually is hers and that custom paint job ain't gonna tag along in any diesel smoke. So we settle for towing our Grand Cherokee. Jack (Message edited by JackConrad on March 21, 2009) | ||
| Bill Gerrie (Bill_gerrie)
Registered Member Username: Bill_gerrie Post Number: 239 Registered: 3-2006 Posted From: 216.198.139.38 Rating: N/A |
Jack I thought that the diesel smoke and smell is what keeps us busnuts alive. Bill | ||
| Jack Conrad (Jackconrad)
Registered Member Username: Jackconrad Post Number: 987 Registered: 12-2000 Posted From: 71.54.29.215 Rating: N/A |
I don't mind the smell, but Paula says "no way is that smoke gonna get on my custom paint job!!" If momma ain't happy...... Jack | ||
| Bill Gerrie (Bill_gerrie)
Registered Member Username: Bill_gerrie Post Number: 240 Registered: 3-2006 Posted From: 216.198.139.38 Rating: N/A |
Jack Gottcha. We have to keep momma happy at all costs. | ||
| Len Silva (Lsilva)
Registered Member Username: Lsilva Post Number: 211 Registered: 12-2000 Posted From: 24.164.20.23  Rating: N/A |
Personally, I am of the opinion that a tow car should be a beater. They take a lot of abuse back there and I prefer it not be an expensive car. | ||
| Dan West (Utahclaimjumper)
Registered Member Username: Utahclaimjumper Post Number: 157 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 208.66.38.60 Rating: N/A |
I also use the M&G system without the emergency tank, works great, trouble free and well worth the money.>>>Dan (Jeep Liberty) | ||
| Jack Conrad (Jackconrad)
Registered Member Username: Jackconrad Post Number: 988 Registered: 12-2000 Posted From: 71.54.29.215 Rating: N/A |
We purchased our M&G used at www.hitchtrader.com. It came without the break-away components. I had a 12 volt air valve and a small pressure tank, so I purchased a check valve and a few fittings and made my own break-away system. We last towed our car last Monday on our way home from a Bluegrass party. Yesterday, we drove our Grand Cherokee to town to run a few errands, for the first time since getting home. When we got ready to leave our last stop and head home, we noticed the brakes were dragging. We drove about 1 mile to a friends shop. Both front brakes were smoking when we got there. He said "it must be your master cylinder". I asked for a 1/2" wrench and removed the air line to the M&G. The brakes released. I then checked the break-away switch that is installed in the air dam below the front bumper. Somehow it had got pulled partially out, energizing the valve and applying the brakes. Since part of the pressure had leaked out, it did not have enough pressure to apply the brakes fully. Live & Learn. If you have an M&G with the break-away option, check the break-away switch if your brakes start dragging (or drain the pressure tank). Jack | ||
| Buswarrior (Buswarrior)
Registered Member Username: Buswarrior Post Number: 1519 Registered: 12-2000 Posted From: 76.66.18.225  Rating: N/A |
Thinking on the keyboard.... Perhaps a pressure switch and activation light visible someplace.... Nice to see it on with every brake application, nice to see it go out on release... The electric brake controller in my SUV behaves sort of that way, positive indication of continuity and application. happy coaching! buswarrior | ||
| Tim Brandt (Timb)
Registered Member Username: Timb Post Number: 283 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 74.244.14.221  Rating: N/A |
On my Florida trip in December I met a busnut in a converted MCI and he had built his own using a air servo similar to what you would use for a clutch assist that just pushed the brake pedal in his toad. He had an air chuck right in the grill that he hooked into | ||
| ED Hackenbruch (Shadowman)
Registered Member Username: Shadowman Post Number: 113 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 68.29.11.169 Rating: N/A |
The system i use lets you know if the brakes are activated via a led light during normal usage or an alarm if the breakaway system engages.....found that out by accident one time, had the cable a little too short and made a really tight left turn which caused the cable to pull out and set off the alarm. :>) You can also adjust how much braking you want as you go down the road and has a lever for full on emergency braking no matter what level you have it set on normally. | ||
| Jack Conrad (Jackconrad)
Registered Member Username: Jackconrad Post Number: 989 Registered: 12-2000 Posted From: 71.54.29.215 Rating: N/A |
When we installed the system on our Grand Cherokee, I added a fFlashing red LED on the dash of the bus to show when the M&G was applying pressure to the master cylinder (service or break-away function). I guess I need to also install one of these red LEDs on the car dash. Jack | ||
| Bruce Henderson (Oonrahnjay)
Registered Member Username: Oonrahnjay Post Number: 375 Registered: 8-2004 Posted From: 4.88.106.40  Rating: N/A |
Is a toad braking system legally necessary (or just smart) for a 3200 pound VW? I already have rigged up a simple "pull-cord" breakaway alarm but by then it's probably already too late ... | ||
| Jack Conrad (Jackconrad)
Registered Member Username: Jackconrad Post Number: 990 Registered: 12-2000 Posted From: 71.54.29.215 Rating: N/A |
Bruce, I think the maximum toad weight without a break-away function varies by state. I think FMCA and Motorhome Magazine publish a state by state list of taod requirements, but I could not find it online. Jack | ||
| Chuck Newman (Chuck_newman)
Registered Member Username: Chuck_newman Post Number: 305 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 76.246.252.104 Rating: N/A |
Jack, "I added a fFlashing red LED on the dash of the bus to show when the M&G was applying pressure to the master cylinder (service or break-away function). I guess I need to also install one of these red LEDs on the car dash." Jack, how are you activating the red LED to indicate applied M&G service air? Do you have a pressure switch tee'd into the air line to the M&G cylinder? Also how does the LED sense a break-away condition? Thanks. | ||
| Chuck Newman (Chuck_newman)
Registered Member Username: Chuck_newman Post Number: 306 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 76.246.252.104 Rating: N/A |
Jack, second question: Your home brew break-away system gave me an idea. I have a tank and compressor already on the towed van for air horn and Firestone bags, tire fill, etc. With an additional air switch (for trip condition) and check valve into M&G cylinder, I already have the basic components for a break-away system. Have I missed anything here? | ||
| Jack Conrad (Jackconrad)
Registered Member Username: Jackconrad Post Number: 992 Registered: 12-2000 Posted From: 71.54.29.215 Rating: N/A |
I put a pressure switch in a T fitting on the M&G. The Flashing Red LED, does not detect a breakaway, it detects brake application by the M&G. This application should be related to a bus service brake application, but it could also be caused by the break-away cable accidentally pulling the pin on the break-away switch resulting in the toad being towed with the brakes applied. This could easily result in a brake fire. Your home brew system will need to prevent any air escaping into the busted air line going to the bus. Our system has a T in the line from the bus. One side of this T connects to the air tank T though a one way check valve. The other side of both of these Ts connect to the solenoid air valve. The 3rd line from the solenoid valve connects to the M&G. In normal operation, when the brakes are applied, air enters the "air in" line tee, part of the air goes from this tee through the solenoid to the M&G while the rest of the air goes through the check valve into the tank. IF the solenoid valve is activated by the break-away switch, the solenoid valve moves, closing the air intake from the bus and opening the passage from the tank to the M&G. Jack | ||
| Clint Hunter (Truthhunter)
Registered Member Username: Truthhunter Post Number: 83 Registered: 1-2009 Posted From: 24.129.235.190  Rating: N/A |
yes JC, very good to mention "tractor protection valve" when diverting coach brake control pressure to operate the toad brake system, even more important ( & always legally required ) than the break away which is generally manditory above a certain weight ratio (towing / toad )or above maximum towed weight without brakes (jurisdiction dependent). Wouldn't want to only have coach emergency braking system if something happend to the toad ! | ||
| Chuck Newman (Chuck_newman)
Registered Member Username: Chuck_newman Post Number: 308 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 76.246.252.104 Rating: N/A |
Thanks Jack for the information. I see some real versatility and $ savings in this configuration over the M&G break-away kit design. Of course a couple more questions: Do you use a dedicated wire in the towed cable for the signal voltage from pressure switch to LED? Is the standard pull type break-away switch mounted on the bus OK to use or something else less prone to long term water/corrosion effects? Thanks. | ||
| Jack Conrad (Jackconrad)
Registered Member Username: Jackconrad Post Number: 995 Registered: 12-2000 Posted From: 71.54.29.215 Rating: N/A |
I use a dedicated wire for the signal from the pressure switch. We use a 6 conductor cable to connect the toad to the bus. We use a standard break-away switch from an RV parts store that is attached to the front of the toad. We made up a cable using plastic coated 3/16 steel cable with a snap link on each end. We installed an eye bolt in the bottom of the bus bumper near the hitch to attach the other end of the cable to. Jack |