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MacGyver (91flyer)
Registered Member
Username: 91flyer
Post Number: 297
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 74.193.225.134
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, March 29, 2009 - 2:10 am: | |
Ok... First, yes... I'm the guy that drove the 60 foot bus from MN to LA! ;)
So... a few things are in order, since I haven't posted in a very LOOONG time now.
First... I didn't go to Iraq. I ended up moving to Atlanta, GA, then later to Madison, WI, then again back to Bossier City, LA. Yeah, a great big CIRCLE. :: rolls eyes ::
By the time I got back... Despite having sprayed everything down with a nice coat of oil to prevent rust... The 60 footer had a great deal of rot.  It was so rotted in fact, that most of the latch catches on the doors had simply fallen off... The damage was too extensive to even THINK about repairing... So... What's a guy to do?
The engine and drivetrain still functioned perfectly... No problems. I did the pre-trip inspections before starting her, and checked things out once she was running. Once she was running again, and the system was full up with air to 120#... No rear suspension and a valve of some sort in the center section was stuck and leaking air like crazy when pressurizing the parking release system... The leak was so bad, in fact, that at idle it would pop the release knob within 10 minutes, and pop it within 3 with the engine off. Sigh....
So... I ended up basically trading the 60 footer for another bus. The "new to me" bus is a 1970 GMC PD4905... Pretty much what I really wanted before I found the 60 footer. I actually would have liked a SceniCruiser, but... They're a bit more difficult to find. And since it was an "even trade"... No money out of pocket for the swap.
The 4905 is partially converted already... But... I intend to strip most of what's there and redo it. Some of it I'll leave, like the ceiling work... I see no real need to strip that. The carpet is in BAD shape, and it's a gawd-awful blood-red and badly worn and stained. So, I'll rip that all out and put in better carpet in the bedroom areas and use a cheap stick-tile for the rest of it except the bathroom... Not sure what I'll do there yet...
One of the reasons I'm going to strip most of the interior is because it HAS no bathroom... No plumbing of any kind. The bedrooms are in the wrong places, and I couldn't fit any bathroom fixtures through the narrow hallway anyway. So... That's what I'm going to do with that!
If anyone would care to see the bus... Click the following link... More pictures to come:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/36522796@N04/sets/72157615513357791/
Ironically enough... I'm leaving this coming Saturday (Apr 4 09) by way of Greyhound and arrive on-site Apr 5th. I'm in Bossier City, LA... The bus is in South Florida near Ft. Myers.
And yes... it's another bus that I haven't seen in-person... So... Nothing new on that front!! LOL!
And before FF and JMaxwell start up with their theories on whether I'm being truthful or not again... Yes. I'm telling the truth. :p (Yes, I remember what was said on thread http://www.busnut.com/bbs/messages/233/9372.html )
Not sure if I'll have inet access while I'm driving back or not... I might from my phone... iPhones are handy at times. 
Soooooooooooo............... Questions next.
The 60 footer had an automatic transmission... It got 5mpg average from MN to LA. The 4905 has a Spicer 4sp... Not sure of the rear end gearing, highway or transit. The guy I'm buying it from doesn't know.
Is there an easy way to tell what the gearing is? Is it stamped somewhere?
And it does have an air leak at one of the rear valves on the driver side... The air leaks ONLY when the parking brake is released (push the knob in so the brakes release)... And it's coming from a valve near the can...
What is this valve? Is there an easy way to "fix" it? Will the typical brake release cycle (release brakes, floor it for a bit, release) possibly unstick this valve?
Is there a way to get lubricant into it to free it up? What is this valve called? Where would I be likely to just get a replacement to take with me? How difficult will it be to replace this piece if I can't unstick it? What's a new one cost? Can it be rebuilt? Should I rebuild instead of replace?
I don't know if the brake system is Spring or not, so I can't answer that question right now... I can once I'm there...
He states this is the ONLY place that there's an air leak... I doubt it, since the coach is so old... but who knows? Maybe. I'll give it a thorough look over before I even move it.
Anything specific I should check on the 4905 that are known issues?
-Mac
(Message edited by 91flyer on March 29, 2009) |
MacGyver (91flyer)
Registered Member
Username: 91flyer
Post Number: 298
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 74.193.225.134
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, March 29, 2009 - 2:32 am: | |
Not sure what happened with the links... You'll just have to cut/paste.
-Mac |
MacGyver (91flyer)
Registered Member
Username: 91flyer
Post Number: 299
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 74.193.225.134
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, March 29, 2009 - 4:10 am: | |
I should probably mention that I *HAVE* ordered the service manuals for this particular coach... I just don't know if they're going to arrive before I leave on the 4th or not... Hopefully they will... It'd be nice to have 'em before I actually drive this bus.
Does anyone happen to have the PDF's for the 8v71 that's in it? The Spicer 4sp tranny? If so, I'd be interested in obtaining them. I've looked for torrents and such, but no luck. :: shrugs ::
I'll find 'em eventually I suppose, but I'm sure someone out there has 'em already.
-Mac |
FAST FRED (Fast_fred)
Registered Member
Username: Fast_fred
Post Number: 728
Registered: 10-2006
Posted From: 69.19.14.37
Rating: 
Votes: 1 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, March 29, 2009 - 5:56 am: | |
When we finish the VL 100 conversion the Sportscar of coaches my 4106 (9mpg for over 50,000 miles) will need to find a new home.
If you are interested in a conversion that still can make movie money (stock looking from outside and filming in drivers area) and has basically empty bays for your goodies , contact me.
Full conversion set up to cruise a couple , with top notch DOT style maint for a decade.KISS on all RV systems.HUGE number of spare body parts , some NOS .
Nope, I'm heavy in bus campers so its a Ca$h deal, unless you have a "Grand Sturdy" Dutch cruising boat or a LSA to swop.
Located only 50 miles from Ft Myers out RT 80 to Ortona. Come take a look.
FF |
MacGyver (91flyer)
Registered Member
Username: 91flyer
Post Number: 300
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 74.193.225.134
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, March 29, 2009 - 6:12 am: | |
Heya FF! I figured you'd razz me over my remarks... I'm surprised ya didn't! ;) All in jest my friend... ^.^
Unfortunately, I'm already committed to the 4905.. And chances are, you're not selling your 4106 as cheaply as I got the 4905 for. ;)
But, I'd still love to see pix of your coach just to see. I get all kinds of ideas from just looking at other conversions, as I'm sure MANY folks do.
And yeah... KISS is the only way... Expensive complicated systems that need constant repair just aren't worth the time, effort and money. I actually intend to build my own water tanks rather than buy premade ones... I already have the treated plywood for them... Just have to get the fiberglass and sealant. I have a prefab plastic one that's like 100 gallons that I intend to use for the drinking side already.
Cheers!
-Mac |
George M. Todd (George_mc6)
Registered Member
Username: George_mc6
Post Number: 765
Registered: 8-2006
Posted From: 64.55.111.6
Rating:
Votes: 1 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, March 29, 2009 - 7:12 am: | |
Mac,
Your bus would have come with DD3s, and an air leak while released would be from the lock line, or a failed diaphragm in the inversion valve.
The easy way to determine whether you have springs or DD3s, is to count the number of hoses going to the brake cans. Two=springs, 3=DD3s.
The release line would be charged on spring brakes when they are released. With DD3s, the parking cylinders are charged, and the lock line is discharged while parked, a release charges the lock line so it will mechanically release the application, and discharges the parking cylinder.
There is nothing in the pneumatic portion of the air system that can be lubricated, or will leak because of no lube!
Regards,
George |
macgyver (91flyer)
Registered Member
Username: 91flyer
Post Number: 301
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 74.193.225.134
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, March 29, 2009 - 7:31 am: | |
Hmm... Well, that presents a new problem then. Looks like something will need replacement, or rebuilding.
I did find out that the production number of this particular bus is #030... 30th off the line. Would have been really cool to have 001, but I'm sure someone has that in a museum somewhere. ;)
So... An inversion valve... How much does one of these cost? Where can I obtain a replacement?
Edit: Oh yeah... Which valve is this likely to be for this coach? TR2, TR3 or TR4? I'll get the guy to send me some pix of it to be sure... I've got the inversion valve specification PDF from Bendix to compare to...
-Mac
(Message edited by 91flyer on March 29, 2009) |
Jack Conrad (Jackconrad)
Registered Member
Username: Jackconrad
Post Number: 1000
Registered: 12-2000
Posted From: 71.3.75.244
Rating:
Votes: 1 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, March 29, 2009 - 8:22 am: | |
Mac
We are about 35 miles north of Ft. Myers, just off SR 31, south of Arcadia. Let me know if you need any help or a place to do repairs/inspection. Jack |
macgyver (91flyer)
Registered Member
Username: 91flyer
Post Number: 302
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 74.193.225.134
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, March 29, 2009 - 9:28 am: | |
Jack, thanks... Ya never know what's going to break on these older buses once you get moving, no matter how well you check everything out... Old parts just seem to have that tendency!
Though, hopefully... I won't have any problems (but I know I will, it's just the way it is!) But, if ya want to meet up, just to visit and BS, I'd be happy to meet up with ya somewhere along the way!
I'll be posting my intended route plans in the coming days if anyone else is along the route that'd like to just visit for a bit. I'm in NO hurry to get back, and intend to enjoy the trip! I'll probably stop at the beach a few times along the way, simply because it's been years since I've been on the coast, and I really enjoy the water.
Hey, maybe some of us in the areas I'm passing through could just meet up at the closeby beaches along the route? Impromptu busmeets!! ^.^ Why not?!
-Mac |
Luvrbus (Luvrbus)
Registered Member
Username: Luvrbus
Post Number: 680
Registered: 8-2006
Posted From: 74.32.92.133
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, March 29, 2009 - 10:12 am: | |
Mac, I like the Eagle front cap on that bus gives it class. lol good luck |
Patrick levenson (Zubzub)
Registered Member
Username: Zubzub
Post Number: 74
Registered: 5-2007
Posted From: 70.53.181.243
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, March 29, 2009 - 12:52 pm: | |
Nice looking bus I hoped it treats you well. |
joe granzier (Joegranzier)
Registered Member
Username: Joegranzier
Post Number: 19
Registered: 3-2008
Posted From: 69.250.215.101
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, March 29, 2009 - 3:47 pm: | |
fast fred
Tell me about your 4106, what is your time frame for selling and what kind of money are we stalking about?
Joe |
Tony LEE (T_lee)
Registered Member
Username: T_lee
Post Number: 53
Registered: 11-2007
Posted From: 195.23.220.206
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, March 29, 2009 - 6:16 pm: | |
If you have DD3s, do the check for holed diaphragm before rushing in to replace the valve as the leak within the brake shows up as a leak from the valve.
MCI have service notes on fault finding the DD3 - but I think the check involves pinching off one of the three hoses and see if the leak stops. Could be on either side so need to check both DD3s on the drive axle. |
RJ Long (Rjlong)
Registered Member
Username: Rjlong
Post Number: 1522
Registered: 12-2000
Posted From: 98.192.173.82
Rating:
Votes: 2 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, March 29, 2009 - 8:39 pm: | |
Macgyver -
FYI, PD4905-030 was delivered new in April of 1970 as fleet number 331 to George H Kuss, dba Valley Transportation, based in Oxford, CT.
Since it's a New England Rust Belt Bus. . . and GM used a LOT more steel in the Buffalos compared to the 4104s and 4106s. . . let's just say that you've got a LOT to inspect on this vehicle besides just the leaking brake lines.
Open the exterior compartment underneath the driver, and check the door framing. Ditto the engine tailgate. If they're corroded, chances are excellent that you'll also find quite a bit around the "D" windows, the driver's window, the rear window, the upper vista windows (possibly hidden under the front cap), etc.
As for the gearing, 99.9% chance the rear axle's stock, which for the 4905s was 4.375:1. Top speed at 2100 rpm will be just a smidgen over 70 with 12R22.5 tires, and your fuel economy with the Spicer will be in the 6 - 8 range, depending on lots of variables. Seven is a safe number, or simply figure on fueling every 500 miles - you don't want to run out and "enjoy" repriming one of these beasts!
This coach will also have a "wet clutch", and quite possibly an air throttle. If so, be prepared to get very, very frustrated, until you've got 3,000 or more miles under your belt in the beast. BTDTHTS. This might help:
http://www.busnut.com/bbs/messages/12262/16204.html?1167073154
Highly recommend that you stop by Jack Conrad's place just outside Arcadia after you pick up the 4905. Jack & Paula are very personable, and he's got a decent shop to help with minor repairs. And if you're not careful, he'll talk you into coming to his big New Year's Eve bus party, too!
Good luck!!
FWIW & HTH. . .
|
macgyver (91flyer)
Registered Member
Username: 91flyer
Post Number: 304
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 74.193.225.134
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 30, 2009 - 2:37 am: | |
Whew. Lots of responses while I was away!
Ohhhkay.
Luvr! I like the caps as well... I had the opportunity to get a stock equipped one for about $500 more than this one with the seats stripped... It was in about the same condition as this one, but I decided to go with this one because it already had the caps I liked, and it has some "freebies" already in place. I can reuse probably 90% of the wood that's already in place (the walls, for instance... I'll just move 'em to my desired locations)... And from the pictures, this one *seems* to have less rot and fewer dents that I'll have to fix. The other one I had looked at was dented up fairly bad, but not TERRIBLE... I just saw more potential for this one than I did the other for fewer bucks.
Patrick... Thanks. I hope she does too. I've learned that they treat you as well as you treat them. My poor 60 footer went neglected while I was out trying to just survive as the economy declined... And she paid me back in kind. I was sorry to see her go, but I think I got a fair trade for her with this 4905...
Tony! Yeah, I've ordered the service manuals and such for this bus already. Should be here about Wednesday. I'll be going over everything before I even leave the driveway. Since I'm not in a hurry to get back (between contracts right now... aka, unemployed...) I'll have plenty of time to fiddle and replace the obvious stuff that's bad... Hoses, brake cans, inversion valves, etc...
RJ! Hey guy! Long time! How ya been? How the heck do you do a history lookup like that? I'd love to learn! ^.^
I kindof figured she was a New England bus for some reason... It was a guess based on some of the rot I saw in the pics and what the guy I'm buying from described.. But I can tell you with absolute certainty, it's not anywhere near as bad as what my 60 footer ended up with. That poor thing was almost entirely made of steel and just in the time she sat she basically rusted to nothing. It was a sad sight.
This guy seems to have treated much of the rust himself, but I intend to weld in replacement panels for the spots that are too far gone (I have a welding shop just down the road from me that's very good at what they do, and reasonably priced)...
As for the windows... I intend to remove most of them and have them sealed up and welded over to resolve the known issues with them. They aren't BAD I don't believe, but I don't have a need for that many windows, and the more I can get done to reduce corrosion now, the better off I'll be in the long run.
I had anticipated 60mph tops with anywhere between 5 to 8mpg, so it seems I wasn't too far off of my guess. I'll certainly let ya'll know the blow-by-blow details when I get back, as I did with the 60 foot trip. ^.^
And, even if she will go 70... I don't think I'll be going that fast. As I said... I'm NOT in a hurry to get back. I intend to enjoy this trip, as I see it more as a vacation than much of anything else with the bonus of having a new bus to tinker on.
I also had already looked at the post you mentioned, so I'm prepared for the frustration to be had... But thanks for reminding me. :p ;)
And last... JACK!!! Check your email! ^.^ Once I get down there, I'd like to stop in "just because" and visit for a bit. I don't know if I'd be able to make any New Year's parties this coming year, but... Nothing says I wouldn't be able to the year after!
-Mac |
FAST FRED (Fast_fred)
Registered Member
Username: Fast_fred
Post Number: 730
Registered: 10-2006
Posted From: 69.19.14.42
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 30, 2009 - 7:52 am: | |
I can reuse probably 90% of the wood that's already in place (the walls, for instance... I'll just move 'em to my desired locations)..
ON the 06 there is a bit if difference as you move from front to rear , so bulkheads (walls) may need a bunch of trimming to fit well.
Or just glue rug over the gaps ,
Do it your way!And ENJOY!
FF |
macgyver (91flyer)
Registered Member
Username: 91flyer
Post Number: 305
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 74.193.225.134
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 30, 2009 - 9:13 am: | |
Heya FF! Yeah, I figured there'd be variations... Not too concerned with them though. I have a nice table router that I plan to use for trimwork. I've got some nice carbide trim bits to work with too... So the gaps (hopefully) will be easy to cover up if there are any. The walls will be recovered with something else... I'll probably go with a light birch type color for the front living area.
The bedroom has to be dark. I can't stand sleeping in a white room for some reason... Drives me NUTS... No pun intended. ;)
-----
On a side note, my current route (roughly) is this:
http://maps.google.com/maps?f=d&source=s_d&saddr=pine+island,+fl&daddr=34266+to:36360+to:7 1111&hl=en&geocode=&mra=ls&sll=29.649869,-87.561035&sspn=6.423109,14.238281&ie=UTF8&ll=27. 391278,-82.144775&spn=3.282022,7.119141&z=8
Anyone else along that route that would like the company of another nut?
-Mac |
George M. Todd (George_mc6)
Registered Member
Username: George_mc6
Post Number: 767
Registered: 8-2006
Posted From: 76.91.197.153
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 30, 2009 - 11:01 am: | |
Mac,
I don't want to be picky about posts, but:
Above, I said "The lock line is charged while released, the parking cylinder is charged while parked."
You said "the air leak is only with the brakes RELEASED," which means that the leak is coming from the lock line, which doesn't have a diaphragm.
Air coming out of the rear brake relay valve WHILE PARKED, is a leaking parking diaphragm.
Good luck,
George |
macgyver (91flyer)
Registered Member
Username: 91flyer
Post Number: 306
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 74.193.225.134
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 30, 2009 - 11:12 am: | |
Hey George... What I meant by released is that the button is pushed down, and the bus rolls freely...
Meaning, that the brakes themselves are "released" from the drums and the bus can move... Not while it's parked and the brakes are locked in the park position.
Oy.. Sometimes, it's difficult to get the proper terms and methodolgy in play to make sure the details are clear... But, that's my fault I suppose... I'm not an expert at anything when it comes to buses... Or air brake systems. But, at least I have a general understanding of how things are supposed to work, eh?
The last time I had to work on an air brake system and actually repair it was on a skoolie, which used spring brakes. DD3 is a new beast to me... The spring brake problems I had on the skoolie were, in fact, holes in the diaphrams on two of the cans... I simply replaced them and took the old ones apart to see how they worked.
It was quite interesting to see just how simple the internals of them worked... And to see what, exactly, went wrong. They were 1/4 full of oil, which degraded the rubber and caused them to perforate. I'm HOPING that this isn't the problem with the one that's leaking on this new bus... But, if it is, at least I've already gone through replacement once on something else...
I'm not afraid to tackle new challenges such as this... I'm eager to learn how everything works, and what it takes to repair things when they need repairing. At the same time, I'm also very interested in preventative maintenance to make sure things just keep working. Since I've not had a chance to physically inspect everything yet, I'm expecting to find more things that need to be done than just the leaky brake system, and I'm not expecting that _any_ maintenance has been done by the previous owner.
If the oil is black as night, then that'll be something else I get done before I leave the city with the bus as well... I'm expecting it to be black, so it won't be a surprise if it is. Hopefully, the previous owner kept her up with proper maintenance though... It would be nice.
-Mac |
RJ Long (Rjlong)
Registered Member
Username: Rjlong
Post Number: 1523
Registered: 12-2000
Posted From: 98.192.173.82
Rating:
Votes: 1 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, March 31, 2009 - 12:37 am: | |
Mac -
How the heck do you do a history look-up like that? I'd love to learn!
Well, all you'd have to do is look over my shoulder as I thumb thru the binder I have on the bookcase next to my computer desk. . .
And, even if she will go 70... I don't think I'll be going that fast.
Ha, Ha. . . Yeah, right. 4905s have a tendency, when you least expect it, to be sitting on the governor in 4th, because they're such a sweet ride. BTDTHTS2!!
If the oil is black as night, then that'll be something else I get done before I leave the city with the bus as well... I'm expecting it to be black, so it won't be a surprise if it is.
Two-stroke Detroits can turn fresh oil black w/in 1,000 miles sometimes! Nature of the beast. Be sure to bring along (or have access to) seven gallons of straight 40 wt CF-2 oil, if you're going to change it. Jack or Fast Fred can give you a source nearby. . .
As for the windows... I intend to remove most of them and have them sealed up and welded over to resolve the known issues with them. They aren't BAD I don't believe, but I don't have a need for that many windows, and the more I can get done to reduce corrosion now, the better off I'll be in the long run.
One of the great features of the 4905 as a revenue service coach, and one of the PITAs for the conversion folk, is/was the stadium seating in the front. And that stadium seating is also why there are two "D" windows on either side.
Now, before you go and close them in, think again, but this time, think in terms of sitting in the driver's seat, driving down the upper RH branch of a "Y"-shaped intersection, and you need to look over your right shoulder to see what's coming down the LH side of the "Y" - and you cannot see it looking out the door window alone. That first "D" window is also used as a guide when making RH corners, so you don't take off the pedestrian's toes with the rear duals.
One other thought: Natural lighting for the coach from windows, especially combined with light-colored paneling, will tend to make the coach feel bigger inside. You might want it "black" in the bedroom to sleep, but what about during waking hours? A little cross-ventilation on those mild days when you don't need A/C, perhaps? Or, heaven forbid, you need an emergency escape path at oh dark thirty and you cannot get out the front of the coach? Far better to darken the bedroom with window treatments, than seal up a tomb. . .
FWIW & HTH. . .
|
macgyver (91flyer)
Registered Member
Username: 91flyer
Post Number: 307
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 74.193.225.134
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, March 31, 2009 - 1:34 am: | |
RJ...
I seem to have a problem with not being entirely clear with my intentions.... lol...
I have no intention of covering or removing ANY windows in the front living area itself... In fact, in the living area, if possible... I'm going to actually install LARGER windows to increase not only natural lighting, but also to increase my visibility.
My 60 footer had such HUGE windows, and they proved to be exceptionally useful for seeing what was beside me... But only within the first 15 feet or so... After that, it was just too distorted. And that was without walls in place.
Now, something else I intend to do, at some point, is to put in a 4 way camera system... Cameras on each side of the coach at the front, at the roof line pointing down and back to give me full wide angle visibility. One in front, pointing at an angle where I can see what's DIRECTLY in front of the bumper, and one on the rear set up the same way...
As for the bedroom... I do prefer absolutely zero light, but I intend to (somehow) build in an escape path. Whether that's a hidden 'hatch' of sorts in one of the partition walls or something else, I'm not entirely sure yet... I'll have to work out some designs. Same goes for the bathroom area...
I'm not sure if the 4905 had a rear escape hatch like I've seen in other buses, but if it does not I would like to build one in somehow. Perhaps taking a hatch from another bus, or fabricating one entirely from scratch. I prefer to have multiple escape routes "just in case", so I do completely agree with you in that regard.
The stadium seating in front seems to have been levelled out with a boxed pedistal type system that evened the floor up, except for the staircase leading up into the living area from what I can see in the pictures I've been sent. I don't have ALL the pictures I've received up on the flikr site yet... There are a couple that I haven't posted yet that show much more detail of the front living area as it's currently configured.
On my way out of town, I'll be snagging several gallons of each type of fluid I need. I simply can't take it with me when I leave this coming Saturday morning because Greyhound won't allow those fluids to be transported... And even if they did, the extra costs involved with them transporting them would just be impractical!
As for ventilation and cross-ventilation... I'll be making 'pass through' type ventillation between the wall partitions so that air flows within the bus, and I'll be adding some solar driven exhaust fans to allow air to be drawn in and through the bus...
I still have a great deal of things to plan for and design, and I'll be taking my time as I do... And running all my ideas across you guys who've already done all this... There's ALWAYS a "better" way to do any single thing, but... At the same time, "better" isn't always "cheap", which is where I need to stay in this conversion at this time... CHEAP, but quality work and maintainable livability... That's my ultimate goal.
Since I'm working with a shoestring budget, I need to make this work, while making sure things aren't going to just fall apart within a six months or a year.. Whatever I do needs to be able to stand up to fulltiming for quite some time! I'm just glad I already have the next year's worth of insurance paid already. ^.^
So, hopefully I've explained my ideas a little better and have set your mind at ease about my window intentions. Currently, the windows are practically useless as they've almost ALL been boarded up inside by the previous owner, except for the front living area! The windows that aren't boarded up entirely rear of the forward living space are just little square viewports looking through the original windows...
Overall, it's not what I have in mind for the finished interior... I don't like how it's currently done.
Now, if the rot isn't as bad as I'm already anticipating on the windows, I may just go ahead and leave them all in place, removing the rust that exists, grind the necessary areas clean and fill with lead and reshape the sills and reinstall.... Then, use a 90% mirrored tint on the windows rear of the forward living space... This may be my ultimate solution... I won't know until I can get a good closeup view of everything...
But I'll certainly keep ya in the loop with my intentions as I lay things out in the design process.
As always, I appreciate the input and the sanity checks! I'm ALWAYS open to constructive criticisms, in all that I do! So thank you... It wouldn't be a good learning experience if I were closed minded and dead set on doing something only one way and ignore other possible alternatives...
After all, the last thing I want to do is ruin this beautiful example of mechanical harmony... Not to mention putting someone's life at risk for doing something that may be obviously idiotic and ignoring someone's criticism that could potentially avert a disastrous outcome tooling down the road and possibly killing a family just trying to get to the ball game in the next town... I simply couldn't live with that kind of mistake. I've known people who have made those kinds of mistakes... I don't intend to become one of those statistics!
-Mac |
FAST FRED (Fast_fred)
Registered Member
Username: Fast_fred
Post Number: 735
Registered: 10-2006
Posted From: 69.19.14.18
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, April 01, 2009 - 6:54 am: | |
"I intend to remove most of them and have them sealed up and welded over to resolve the known issues with them. They aren't BAD I don't believe, but I don't have a need for that many windows, and the more I can get done to reduce corrosion now, the better off I'll be in the long run."
As a NYC native , with many long hours in the Electric Sewer I urge you to reconsider.
After you GET to a campground , don't you think a nice breeze and bit of daylight would be nice?
Do it your way , but consider the options,like liveability.
FF |
macgyver (91flyer)
Registered Member
Username: 91flyer
Post Number: 308
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 74.193.225.134
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, April 01, 2009 - 7:06 am: | |
lol... FF... My very last post expanded on this very statement... I'll remove some of those in the back, that would otherwise be behind a wall and replace them with smaller RV type windows most likely... It just depends on how badly rotted the window frames really are once I can get to them...
"It Just Depends" on a few things right now.
-Mac |
FAST FRED (Fast_fred)
Registered Member
Username: Fast_fred
Post Number: 736
Registered: 10-2006
Posted From: 66.82.162.12
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, April 01, 2009 - 3:24 pm: | |
Remember all GM coaches are "beer cans' aircraft style monocoque style construction,
Changing out windows is fine, changing the SIZE of windows in a complex exercise in aircraft engineering.
If you visit Jack , perhaps he will take you past the coach yard where a fine Senicruser sits with a broken back, but nice BIG picture window.
Its really sad as it seems to have been a nice camper.
"There's ALWAYS a "better" way to do any single thing, but... At the same time, "better" isn't always "cheap", which is where I need to stay in this conversion at this time... CHEAP, but quality work and maintainable livability... That's my ultimate goal."
There is always a long complex and expensive way , weather its "better" is in the eye of the builder.
Would you rather change a plug in to a socket or purchase an Automatic Transfer Switch and attempt to maintain it?
Would you prefer the installation and annual service of an Automatic brake air drier system , or just put 50c worth of alcohol in a jar when driving below freezing?And pull a chain every week.
Better ?? You chose! DO it YOUR way!!
Complex and expensive is for wimps!
KISS is for thinkers.
And a heck of a lot more fun hobby !
FF |
john w. roan (Chessie4905)
Registered Member
Username: Chessie4905
Post Number: 1383
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 71.58.110.9
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, April 01, 2009 - 6:01 pm: | |
KISS is for thinkers..... yeah, right Fred; say it your way. |
Keith Wood (Ft6)
Registered Member
Username: Ft6
Post Number: 96
Registered: 8-2008
Posted From: 75.208.179.90
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, April 01, 2009 - 7:29 pm: | |
"If you visit Jack , perhaps he will take you past the coach yard where a fine Senicruser sits with a broken back, but nice BIG picture window."
I hope the perpetrator was given a pistol, a bottle of booze, and one bullet . . . |
Buswarrior (Buswarrior)
Registered Member
Username: Buswarrior
Post Number: 1528
Registered: 12-2000
Posted From: 76.69.143.72
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, April 01, 2009 - 8:51 pm: | |
Yup, I agree with FF.
The coach will be amongst the first to catch the setting in of dementia if KISS is your design strategy.
An auto everything coach may require thinking to build, but it requires none to operate.
May not be good for keeping our gray matter exercised as the years advance?
perhaps we need to establish a Busnut Home for the Aged
I mean besides on here...
happy coaching!
buswarrior |
macgyver (91flyer)
Registered Member
Username: 91flyer
Post Number: 309
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 74.193.225.134
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, April 02, 2009 - 4:54 am: | |
^.^
I'd forgotten about the unibody construction... Woulda seen it once I looked at it. :: shrugs ::
Alright. Bigger windows... Bad idea.. Still going to go with a cheap camera system eventually for visibility...
And yeah, I prefer KISS methods wherever possible... I'm not rich, and certainly don't have money to blow on automatic everything... I certainly don't mind emptying air tanks and pulling chains. It took me forever to find the aircocks on the 60 footer.. I'm hoping they'll be easier to find on the 4905.
As for a Scenicruiser with a broken back... Yikes. That's just terrible. I wonder if it can be fixed... or if it's even WORTH fixing...
-Mac |
FAST FRED (Fast_fred)
Registered Member
Username: Fast_fred
Post Number: 738
Registered: 10-2006
Posted From: 66.82.9.57
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, April 02, 2009 - 7:07 am: | |
"An auto everything coach may require thinking to build, but it requires none to operate."
Operation is automatic....
BUT when it dies the trouble shoot , parts bill (IF NOT TOSS OUT) and repair time is all time without either the system or ca$h for the service tech to fix it for ya.
Simple stuff is EZ to repair ,with local parts, the complex "Automatic" stuff usually requires a trained person.
KISS works , but you loose bragging rights at the bar for HORROR STORIES.
FF |
macgyver (91flyer)
Registered Member
Username: 91flyer
Post Number: 310
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 74.193.225.134
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, April 02, 2009 - 8:54 am: | |
LOL... FF, I love your input, you've always got something amusing to say. ^.^
I don't think I'll really lose bragging rights for horror stories though... There's plenty to be had when dealing with a bus that's what? 39 years old!? Unfortunately, mechanical things don't age as gracefully as organics seem to... Things tend to just BREAK rather than gradually wear down and just stop working...
I prefer simple though... It's easier to fix.
-Mac |
FAST FRED (Fast_fred)
Registered Member
Username: Fast_fred
Post Number: 739
Registered: 10-2006
Posted From: 69.19.14.20
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, April 02, 2009 - 4:20 pm: | |
Unfortunately, mechanical things don't age as gracefully as organics seem to...
That's why they invented Preventive Maint.
UN Happily for most folks the concept takes a long while to sink in.
Do you replace the air bags , and paint the mounts (only a 1/4 century old ) before they die?
Lazy folks WILL cause its so much easier in the back yard between trips , than out on the road , with air freight and a kid "mechanic" that has never seen under a bus in his life.
Sadly there are no bragging rights to a good level of PM,
People ask , "how was the trip" my favorite response is UNEVENTFUL !!!
But its boring, (happily).
FF |
macgyver (91flyer)
Registered Member
Username: 91flyer
Post Number: 311
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 74.193.225.134
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, April 03, 2009 - 1:11 am: | |
Preventive Maintenance. Yup... But, even with perfect PM, things still wear down and break...
And since I don't know the history of this bus, or what's been done to it... Or, more importantly... What HASN'T been done to it... It's going to take quite some time going over everything when I get it back here to the house.
The good thing is that I have copies of ALL the manuals for this coach now... They arrived today in the mail! I'll be taking them with me on my laptop (they're scanned PDF's). Expensive to obtain... But I can't think of anyone that would say anything other than "Money Well Spent".
I obtained my documentation from here: http://www.coachinfo.com/Manuals/Coach/GMC/4905PD.html
They have lots of other coaches too... I like the fact that I didn't have to buy paper copies... If I damage a printed copy, I can just reprint the damaged pages.
And yeah... "Uneventful" is a great thing when you're driving around in a coach older than yourself! ^.^
I'm sure I'm going to find plenty of stuff that hasn't been done to the coach in YEARS that should be done, at a minimum, once a year. I'm prepared for it though... Perhaps I'll be pleasantly surprised though... You never know!
-Mac |
FAST FRED (Fast_fred)
Registered Member
Username: Fast_fred
Post Number: 742
Registered: 10-2006
Posted From: 66.82.9.23
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, April 03, 2009 - 7:01 am: | |
Start with the brakes and wheel bearings and seals , the folks at the bottom of the hill will LOVE
"Uneventfull, as will your insurance carrier.
DA Book specifies a huge and complete lube procedure , do them ALL 1000 miles apart to start.
FF |
Buswarrior (Buswarrior)
Registered Member
Username: Buswarrior
Post Number: 1532
Registered: 12-2000
Posted From: 76.66.16.254
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, April 03, 2009 - 11:29 am: | |
Yup, every fool gets out and sees if it will go....
The smart ones make sure FIRST, that it will stop.
happy coaching!
buswarrior |
macgyver (91flyer)
Registered Member
Username: 91flyer
Post Number: 383
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 74.193.225.134
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, May 04, 2009 - 9:53 pm: | |
Well, deconstruction of the interior has begun. After pressure washing her, I found more rust under the grime than I wanted to see... Sooooooo.... It's time to see what kind of damage I'm REALLY looking at.
I know for sure that one of the windows is shattered and being held together with the window tint... The driver's side rear window "emergency" release has been tripped and refuses to re-engage (bar is completely gone).. The lower edge of nearly every window is bubbled and I have at least three MAJOR rust areas that are in need of fairly immediate treatment...
So... I've started disassembling the interior today. I've nearly got the middle dark-room torn completely down... The ceiling is going to be an absolute NIGHTMARE. Whoever did the work on the ceiling NEVER intended for it to come back out... Ever. It's held in by THOUSANDS of flat-head screws with snaps to hold a decorative cover on them. Man, I'm so going to need to find my drill for that... But I don't intend to remove that part any time soon anyway.
I'm more concerned with what I'll find behind the walls... What I can see through the "windows" cut in them looks pretty bad. I'll get it fixed, it's just going to take time.
I know of one spot under the exterior skin that is really bad, as it's pushing the skin out... But it's the only spot I can see that's THAT bad. The rest is mostly surface rust, and rust where the seams of the sheet-metal come together. I'll probably just get the grinder after it, grind it all out and hit it with my wire welder to fill it back in and tidy the seams up. Then fill in the deformities with lead and paint over it... That should take care of those areas...
I have one thru-hole rust spot that'll need a patch, and another area above the drip rail that's fairly big that I'll probably cut out and weld a new piece in to fix.
I'll take pics and progress as I go... It's going to be slow.. Unemployment really sucks. heh.
-Mac |
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