| Author |
Message |
Jerry Liebler (165.121.32.139)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, June 04, 2004 - 12:49 am: | |
A few weeks ago I asked the board if anyone had tried portable air conditioners. I volentered to be the first as soon as I had my electrical infrastructure done. Well, they do work. I have a 12,000BTU/h and a 10,000BTU/h Sunpentown heat pump portable up front. I have them just behind the driver and copilot with the cold going forward. I have the hot exaust running out what used to be the fresh air intakes on the sides of the bus (PD4107) thru some duct adaptors made of styrofoam and duct tape. I also have drilled holes in the sides of the bus for condensate drains and there's plenty coming out of them. My electrical system is built around a Trace SW2512. The Electrical system has a 7.5KW Onan DKD diesel generator and a 50 amp shore cord with full auto transfer and generator autostart. My house batterys are 4ea L16's. I used the former ac blower circuits to tie the coach alternator to the house batterys when the 8v71 is running so I have 135 amps available from the bus alternator. The ACs held the temp inside the esentially uninsulated bus (no interior at all, gutted to the metal sides but the ceiling is still original and all original windows)to 72 while the outside temp was 82 today and it was very comfortable in the driver's area. The Trace reports they are pulling 14 amps total which agrees with their specs and means I can run both when the bus is running without draining the house batterys. It's much cooler in the front of my bus now than it was in my class A motorhome with 2 roof airs running, on the generator. To imobilize the roll-about portables I built a 3/4" high 'tray'out of 3/4" plywood and screwed it to the floor and I put a webbing strap around each unit and screwed it into the bus's wall. I made no attempt to supply outside air to the condensors and am depending on fresh air coming in the door as GM intended. I'm planning a long cross country trip shortly and will have an over the road evaluation in a couple of weeks.
Regards
Jerry 4107-1120 |
ChuckMC9 (Chucks) (66.167.165.153)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, June 04, 2004 - 10:11 am: | |
Jerry, many thanks for the update. Please continue the status reports during/after your voyage. |
Deacon (150.199.209.45)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, June 04, 2004 - 11:35 am: | |
Jerry, Atta Boy!
Its always good to see someone who will think out of the box, you have proved that the only way to know is 'just do it and see'. Keep us posted.
John |
Inquiring minds (199.64.0.252)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, June 04, 2004 - 11:44 am: | |
What do these units cost?
Where do you find them?
How big are they? |
John the newguy (199.232.240.134)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, June 04, 2004 - 12:21 pm: | |
http://www2.shopping.com/xPC-Sunpentown_WA_1200H_12000_BTU |
Deacon (204.184.224.42)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, June 04, 2004 - 1:55 pm: | |
I bought mine at Wal-Mart. Although I have not as yet used it in the coach my reasoning was, as a portable I can use it either in the house or the coach. Why buy something and have it sit in the coach most of the time, and buy another for the house?
I bought the 9K unit and intend to use it for the rear bedroom w/door in the coach. The plan is to use another larger one (maybe 2) in the front. The drivers compartment can use a seperate auto type AC system in the dash while driving.
Many times I sleep in a house trailer without AC all day and the temps can reach 105 degrees. If I turn on the portable AC and shut the beedroom door it cools to 72 in a half hour.
John |
Geoff (Geoff) (66.238.120.27)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, June 04, 2004 - 4:24 pm: | |
I can understand that these units will work in a bus, but I don't see that you are saving much money. Plus they take up a lot of interior space. I'll just stick to roof airs, thank you.
--Geoff
'82 RTS CA |
TWO DOGS (63.185.72.74)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, June 04, 2004 - 6:56 pm: | |
I saw them at home depo...maytag,500.00...just don't understand...you have to get rid of heat...guess I'm 'old school"...doesn't make sense.. |
Jerry Liebler (165.121.33.209)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, June 05, 2004 - 2:36 am: | |
Well, my curiosity got to me & I realized I have a wattmeter, it's in a General Radio 'variac' I aquied somewhere some long time ago. So I ran each of the portables thru the wattmeter. The 10,000 BTU/h unit is rated at 660 watts & my meter showed 650. It's right on the Spec so if it is moving the rated amount of heat it does have an EER of 15.2. Then I tried the 12.000 BTU/h unit, it's rated at 8 amps and 960 watts for a rated EER of 12.3. The Trace only has a 1 digit ammeter which does show 8 amps but my wattmeter showed just under 800 watts. I'd almost bet the 12,000 is also an EER of 15 but needs a bit of power factor correction as it is drawing 960 VA but only using 800 watts. My objective is to have a cooling solution on a 20 amp shore cord. I'd picked 2 of the 10,000 and one 12,000 for 32,000 BTU but 34,000 might be possible. I hardly consider 16" X 17" of floor a lot of space and at under 30" high (without casters) the can be worked into cabinets under counters etc. My bedroom unit will (when I get that far) fit nicely above the engine and can exaust thru the rear cap. I dislike the ugly look of roof units which are not all that energy efficient either and none of the 120 volt packaged split systems even mentions efficiency. And what roof unit can be installed in a bus with no modifications in 15 minutes and costs $529 delivered for a 12,000 BTU/h heat pump.
For Two dogs info, The heat is blown out a hose that looks like a flexible dryer vent, and it's hotter than what comes out of most dryers.
Regards
Jerry 4107 1120 |
TomNPat (68.130.37.159)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, June 05, 2004 - 11:38 pm: | |
Way to go Jerry.
Looked at them at Costco two days ago, but not ready to buy yet. They didn't have the intake & exhaust I want but they did utilize condensation to cool the hot coil.
Things are getting better on availability and I'm sure that price will improve also. Thanks for the report, keep us informed.
TomNPat |
Adame (129.82.52.225)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, June 06, 2004 - 1:52 am: | |
I saw one of these in operation at the local Homer depot. Very nice looking units indeed. Much cold air comes out the front. Much hot air goes out the exhaust hose, probably enough heat to heat water. The temp. differential between the 2 fans is very impressive. It's the volume of the exhaust air that bothers me. It works great in the store because there's a huge supply of (air conditioned) make-up air to displace the air which goes out the exhaust. In a bus that displacement air has to be let in from the (hot) outside for there to be any flow out the exhaust. So that hot makeup air dilutes the cooled air coming out of the air conditioner and the also the air which flows over the condenser. Maybe it's a toss up whether to use hot outside air through a dedicated path over the condenser, or to simply crack a window open and let the air mix.
Either way I suspect these units work better in the store display than they do in a bus. In fact they seem to work so well in the store that I'm probably going to have to buy one too. |
ChuckMC9 (Chucks) (66.167.165.153)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, June 06, 2004 - 10:22 am: | |
hot air goes out the exhaust hose, probably enough heat to heat water
Now *that's* interesting! Hmmmm...
Uh oh. I feel one of those harebrained invention phases coming along again. I'd better stop right now and get back to work I'm capable of. ;) |
James Maxwell (Jmaxwell) (66.81.39.248)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, June 06, 2004 - 12:57 pm: | |
Jerry: After reading Adams observation, I'm curious as to what is the source of the condensing air? I notice you discharged out the fresh air inlets but you didn't specify the source for condensing air. Is it from outside of or inside of the bus? If it is from inside you would be removing 1 btu from inside air for each 1 you put into it, not even accounting for mechanical and power factor losses and even with a SEER of 12 or better that is 10-15%. |
TWO DOGS (65.177.145.181)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, June 06, 2004 - 10:15 pm: | |
I guess a 4107 & an Eagle are lots different...the ducts running down each side are SUPPLY ducts...not return air... |
Dale MC8 (66.81.137.76)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, June 07, 2004 - 10:45 am: | |
Come on 2D, you know that what things are designed for and what they are used for are not always the same :-] Dale |
TWO DOGS (63.185.72.9)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, June 07, 2004 - 11:39 am: | |
know that....but if it's supply on a 4107 ,then the hot air is going back into the room...like I said..I'm refering to my Eagle...it has vents all the way on the bottom & then vents at the windows...yep...know that...I couldn't find a bathroom sink small enough to fit,so, I cut the orig. Eagle ones countertop into 45's & it works perfect |
Sam Sperbeck (204.248.119.254)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, June 07, 2004 - 12:50 pm: | |
Hi TWO DOGS,
One of us is confused! It could be me. I think what Jerry is saying is that he is using the fresh air inlets in the side of the bus that originally provided some fresh air to the heating and air conditioning blowers. If he has removed the duct that directed that fresh air to the blowers, he then has the holes in the side of the bus, exposed from the inside, to use as his discharge from his portable air conditioner with the homemade styrofoam ducts. If you are not familiar with the way GM introduced fresh air into their coache's HVAC system, I can see where the confusion came from. On the other hand, maybe Jerry is doing something different than I think and would clarify it.
Thanks, Sam Sperbeck
La Crescent, MN |
TWO DOGS (65.177.145.109)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, June 07, 2004 - 12:56 pm: | |
yep...I was confused...guess I shouldn't have said anything...only useing Eagle references...know they are different |
ChuckMC9 (Chucks) (66.167.165.153)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, June 07, 2004 - 6:11 pm: | |
"Never be afraid to try something new. A lone amateur built the Ark. A large group of professionals built the Titanic."
- Dave Barry |
mike4104tx (192.208.44.100)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, June 08, 2004 - 3:38 am: | |
I'm glad to hear some positive results from these portable units. We have one roof a/c in the front of our coach and one unit in the bedroom. We are in Texas and having the ability to plug one of these portable units in during July and August would truely be a blessing.
Thanks for the info and all the comments.
Mike |