| Author | Message | ||
| David Dulmage (Daved)
Registered Member Username: Daved Post Number: 285 Registered: 12-2003 Posted From: 174.136.114.96  Rating: N/A |
I recently went for all new tires on my coach. The tire shop that installed them stripped one of the studs on the drive axle and I ended up sending it to my bus mechanic who replaced four of them on that hub. I also had an oil change, oil filter replacement and lube. The bus shop also replaced the fuel filters and transmission filter. The bill wasn't ready when I picked up the coach, but I just received it in the mail on Friday. The total bill was $1500.00 ($280.00 in parts, not including engine oil - I supplied that as they don't have single weight in stock) - the rest was labour and taxes). It was somewhat higher than expected. Does that seem like too much? | ||
| Rob Williams (Subarurob)
Registered Member Username: Subarurob Post Number: 9 Registered: 10-2006 Posted From: 24.71.245.28 Rating: N/A |
I think an itemized billing at probably $100(?) an hour is in order. That makes about 11 hours to do the work. I smell a rat. Rob | ||
| Luvrbus (Luvrbus)
Registered Member Username: Luvrbus Post Number: 1293 Registered: 8-2006 Posted From: 184.12.169.239 Rating: N/A |
Doesn't seem that bad to me for the work preformed I have replaced a few studs on the drive axle not something you do in a few minutes | ||
| Brian Evans (Bevans6)
Registered Member Username: Bevans6 Post Number: 91 Registered: 5-2009 Posted From: 65.92.48.78 Rating: N/A |
I had all the studs replaced on one rear hub. They took the drum off, the axle out, the hub off and pressed the old studs out. then they reversed the process and put it all back together. Not the work of a few minutes, not counting the other work. I think I would have had all ten replaced if it was out, but no reason not to just change the ones that were broken. Probably two guys working most of a day. Brian | ||
| Dal Farnworth (Dallas)
Registered Member Username: Dallas Post Number: 754 Registered: 7-2004 Posted From: 98.20.60.176  Rating: N/A |
Hey Clifford, did you ever notice that bus conversion owners are like little birds that sing.... CHEEP CHEEP CHEEP. | ||
| Gary Seay (Gdude)
Registered Member Username: Gdude Post Number: 80 Registered: 6-2010 Posted From: 216.67.42.138  Rating: N/A |
I just got done replacing all 10 studs on my right side drive axle. When I was in there, I replaced the seal and wiper ring just because I was there and didn't want to go back. Like already said, there is a lot of work with very heavy parts. Jack it up, pull wheels, pull axle, remove hub, remove drum from hub, press out studs, clean parts, and do everything in reverse. In my case, I had to deal with the seal and wiper ring. All this work took me a good portion of a day. I would say with all the servicing preformed, it is probably correct. (Not a deal but probably going rate) | ||
| David Dulmage (Daved)
Registered Member Username: Daved Post Number: 287 Registered: 12-2003 Posted From: 174.136.114.96 Rating: N/A |
Thanks for the answers. Converted coach ownership is definitely not for the faint-hearted. I ordered ten new studs but the shop miscalculated their stock (they didn't have the right ones) and MCI only shipped four. It would have made sense to change them all while the hub was off. I'm sure you can understand my pain, having just replaced eight tires with new ones, no re-treads, not because the tire treads were worn out, but because of their age and weatherchecking. I was expecting about 4-5 hours for the stud replacement plus additional labour charges for the oil and filter changes. Unlike many of us at home, a shop like this has all the equipment to handle heavy parts, so they should be a little more efficient than a do-it-yourselfer. Over more than 10 years, my mechanic has never given me anything much more definite in the way of an estimate than "Don't worry about it. It won't be that much." That usually means $500.00 plus parts. Dave D | ||
| Gus Causbie (Gusc)
Registered Member Username: Gusc Post Number: 1389 Registered: 11-2005 Posted From: 72.156.194.7  Rating: N/A |
What Gary said. That was the hardest physical job I ever did on the bus, I won't do it again!! The bill does not seem out of line for the work involved. Since most of your bill was labor it is unfortunate they didn't change all while the wheel was off because the other studs are most likely ruined also. I will never again let a tire shop tighten my wheel nuts, I now carry my own air wrench and will do it myself. Those monster air wrenches they use can flip the bus over!! | ||
| john w. roan (Chessie4905)
Registered Member Username: Chessie4905 Post Number: 2179 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 71.58.71.157  Rating: N/A |
Find out what their hourly rate is.Find another shop to do your work. Do they primarily work on coaches or semis? If they work on semis, they usually charge a great deal more, especially if it is a large shop with a lot of work coming through. There may have been more time involved with issues that might have cropped up and more might have been done that is not listed.Do they have a pit to make the work easier. Was this done in Canada? Were you billed in American dollars? I would suggest that the next time that you discuss the work you would like done and ask for an estimate range. They can easily go over it, but you'll get some idea.Occasionally, people are charged a lot to hint that they don't care to work on your/ anybodies coaches | ||
| David Dulmage (Daved)
Registered Member Username: Daved Post Number: 288 Registered: 12-2003 Posted From: 174.136.114.96 Rating: N/A |
I live in Canada and the charges are in Canadian dollars. The shop owner is a bus mechanic. Most of the work the shop does is on trucks. They were not all that busy at the time I left my bus and I had mae an advance appointment. I do get a sense that there is a feeling that "If he can afford a coach, then money is no object". I'm going to ask for a time breakdown. Strictly speaking it's a legal requirement anyway. | ||
| David Evans (Dmd)
Registered Member Username: Dmd Post Number: 635 Registered: 10-2004 Posted From: 69.114.3.22  Rating: N/A |
These are tough things to deal with. Because of the missconceptions of the work and costs, its probably getting harder to find a truck repair shop to work on a bus and it might be the same for RV shops i dont know. dedicated coach repair shops? Do they want to work on RV's? We have owned our coach 15 years and had good dealings with 3 repairs shops and only one where we were not happy. Communication is key. Everyone needs to be on the same page. I have my own plumbing company and its a oneman band. I let people know up front the projected costs with a reminder that after we open up the walls or floors it can turn to a can of worms and the then we have to re=evaluate what we have to deal with. MOST people understand this. SOME people dont seem to get this concept. If the undercarriage is rusted for instance it will take longer to work on the coach drivetrain. The shop has overhead and good employees are expensive to keep on many levels. Throw in your standard govt regs and taxes it adds up quick. No way we can really judge. | ||
| David Dulmage (Daved)
Registered Member Username: Daved Post Number: 291 Registered: 12-2003 Posted From: 174.136.114.96 Rating: N/A |
The consensus seems to be that the charges may not be that much out of line. I'll as tactfully as I can ask for a breakdown of the labour for my own satisfaction. | ||
| FAST FRED (Fast_fred)
Registered Member Username: Fast_fred Post Number: 1613 Registered: 10-2006 Posted From: 76.195.75.94  Rating: N/A |
I just got done replacing all 10 studs on my right side drive axle. When I was in there, I replaced the seal and wiper ring just because I was there and didn't want to go back. Like already said, there is a lot of work with very heavy parts. This is a description of Preventive Maint (PM) concept . When repairing most anything nearby that has wearing seals or parts DO IT!!! Think of it as insurance that pays you back tax free! | ||
| David Dulmage (Daved)
Registered Member Username: Daved Post Number: 292 Registered: 12-2003 Posted From: 204.101.119.243 Rating: N/A |
Absolutely. It's a lot cheaper to replace the seal ($29.00)than to have brakes contaminated or have a bearing burn out and ruin the axle housing or worse. As for your drive axles wheel stud replacement, about how many hours total did it take? DaveD | ||
| Gus Causbie (Gusc)
Registered Member Username: Gusc Post Number: 1391 Registered: 11-2005 Posted From: 72.156.194.7 Rating: N/A |
I forgot to mention, I also replaced all the seals, it would have been crazy not to considering all the work involved. Figuring the hours is a shot in the dark, amateurs like me don't have all the equipment shops do so it is apples vs oranges. | ||
| Buswarrior (Buswarrior)
Registered Member Username: Buswarrior Post Number: 2132 Registered: 12-2000 Posted From: 174.89.177.190  Rating: N/A |
Anyone priced all that shop equipment? Jack/hoist of some sort, jack stands for under the coach, a hydraulic press, the carriers for dragging the drum and hub off, the big 1 inch air gun, and the life of the sockets... We all need to be paying towards their acquisition and replacement. And taxes have nothing to do with the shop trying to cover its costs and make a profit. The guys closer to the business end see nothing wrong with the bill, so you are ok. happy coaching! buswarrior | ||
| David Dulmage (Daved)
Registered Member Username: Daved Post Number: 295 Registered: 12-2003 Posted From: 174.136.114.96 Rating: |
Just to set the record straight. I've been a businessman for close to 40 years and while there have been lean times I have generally been pretty successful at it. I have a pretty good feel for what it costs to run a business. Both my sons are in the automotive business and have had their own shops. My oldest son is an independent mechanic, and his shop rate is about 60% of what dealers or automotive chains typically charge. Both my sons have somewhere in the range $30,000.00 to $40,000.00 in small tools, that doesn't include large equipment or hoists, paint booths, compressors and the like. Add building costs, heating, environmental charges, insurance, non-recoverable taxes, etc. and its easy to see why the shop rate is what it is. On the other hand there is no problem in getting a bill from his shop that clearly details, parts, hourly rate and totals for each major aspect of a job. It's necessary for his own accounting as well as maintaining the goodwill of his repeat customers. I have 4 vehicles plus two trailers on the road, not including my wife's car and they all receive comprehensive preventative maintenance as well as repairs. I don't skimp on things like that. Pardon me if I'm being too sensitive here. The issue isn't necessarily about shop costs, it's more about being able to rely on a published shop rate and to have confidence about what is being charged. It's unfair to paint converted coach owners as uninformed and cheap just as much as it would be unfair to paint garage owners as incompetent and dishonest. To be frank I was surprised at the nerve I apparently struck when I started this post. I was just hoping for a comparison and I can't help but feel I and coach owners in general have been dumped on. | ||
| David Dulmage (Daved)
Registered Member Username: Daved Post Number: 298 Registered: 12-2003 Posted From: 204.101.119.243 Rating: N/A |
After the first invoice I got a revised one that was about $190.00 higher. I did some investigation and found that the typical shop time for replacing studs is 6-7 hours. I contacted the shop owner and he was at a loss to explain why the charge was for 14.4 hours (this included 3 hours to service the bus (oil change & oil filter, transmission filter and fuel filter changes). He thought about 7 hours for replacing the studs was right and reduced the bill but in the end only by about 1-1/10 hours. Total bill, including parts (but not the oil) and taxes was still $1,599.94. | ||
| R.C.Bishop (Chuckllb)
Registered Member Username: Chuckllb Post Number: 1638 Registered: 7-2006 Posted From: 97.212.175.210  Rating: N/A |
Ain't this a FUN "Hobby"????.....  (See the post I made a couple of days ago under Advice and???? re a 4106 dilemma...) It is UN-BE-lIEVE-ABLE what things are "going for" these days. I am glad I have our coach. I don't mind paying for "service", but I abhor rip off. In that same thread John Roan had it about right from my point of view. A couple of years ago I had a long and requested...(yes requested by him after an excessive bill he had presented me earlier)...conversation with the guy that owns the facility (I talked about in that thread), regarding "hobby coaches" and "for profit" coaches..... after he heard me out he agreed; therefore the reason for the "discount" on my bill. He assures me he does the same for others now. (don't know if his mechanics feel the same) Only the LORD knows on both counts. I can see BW's point, but I disagree in many ways. I have been in "service" businesses all my life. Yes, machinery, tools, and humans were a part of each. BUT.... The customer always was first....the source of my business and the employee's paycheck. Takes all the "joy" out it, huh??  Very interesting thread. Thanx for bringing it up, Dave. Off my box now. FWIW RCB (Message edited by chuckllb on December 16, 2011) |
