| Author |
Message |
ron and patti (Hayleyscomet) (64.12.116.135)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 27, 2004 - 1:32 pm: | |
We are converting a 1996 prevost lemirage. We are trying to decide if we should keep the over the road air (it has the 134a and everything works fine) If we do keep it, (which we would like to) does anyone have any advice on how to change it for ease of converting. (We have ordered a manual but have not received it yet.) Thanks, Patti |
Marc Bourget (209.142.38.81)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 27, 2004 - 1:49 pm: | |
Dear Patti,
I don't think you want to change anything on the A/C or its distribution system.
Best to build around it.
A/C's depend on the flow of air mass. Restricting airflow can lead to complications in addition to poor performance.
Be careful not to restrict the total flow capacity while you're installing the features you wish to add to your conversion. It will be unfortunate if this causes you to compromise your ability to "do it your way" but then again, by keeping the Bus A/C you actually are!
Onward and Upward
Marc Bourget |
Deacon (204.184.224.17)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 27, 2004 - 2:07 pm: | |
Patti,
My opinion, keep the original A/C if working OK.
You will hear many claim the A/C is a high maintanance system, this is true in livery service, but keep in mind the constant use its put to traveling several thousand miles per month. A well sealed system properly maintained should not require much money wise in RV use.
So, the real question is, does it fit with your plans of conversion, bay space, duct work, horsepower drain, etc.? Only you can answer those questions.
John F. |
Marc Bourget (209.142.38.81)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 27, 2004 - 3:26 pm: | |
Also, What are your plans for A/C when the engine isn't running? Are you going to have two separate A/C systems?
Onward and further Upward
MB |
Michael Lewis (67.160.12.18)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 27, 2004 - 5:14 pm: | |
We wish our MC9 road air was up and working. It too was converted to 134 but was cannibalized for a/c and heater parts while we waited to pick it up from the dealer. Other than missing critical parts, it appears to be well serviced with some new hoses, etc. While we would love to have the OTR heat and air, right now, it is looking like it's maybe too expensive to get it working, but have decided to try.
Since we will be carrying two generators, we also have the option of dedicating one to a basment air system like the Coleman Mach. A second 3600 watt genset will support the house batts, 110v refer and some lighting and misc outlets.
Have not looked to see if we can use the original ducts for that system, but we were in a "stick" motorhome a weekend or so ago which had two things we loved. One was that super quiet Coleman air, the other was a adjustable queen air mattress. It was about 85 here in Seattle, and when I lay down in that cool bedroom, I almost fell asleep. It looks like the basic Coleman system is about $700 without shopping too much.
Michael |
ron and patti (Hayleyscomet) (24.108.180.196)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 27, 2004 - 5:18 pm: | |
Yes, we have purchased carrier airv rooftop units. The piping that runs along the floor I can design around, but the other units, especially the large one at the back of the bus will be more of a challenge. Once we receive our manual I'm hoping it will become clear if the large unit can be moved or removed. Patti |
Marc Bourget (209.142.38.81)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 27, 2004 - 7:26 pm: | |
Dear Mike,
Check Gumpydog's site for the condition of the Bus Heat/Air ducts.
Onward and Upward
Marc Bourget |
Geoff (Geoff) (66.238.120.74)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 27, 2004 - 10:01 pm: | |
I had a perfectly good working factory air conditioner in my RTS, but I ripped it out and put three roof airs (two ac/heat pumps, one just ac, all 15,000 BTU). I run one to two roof airs while driving and it works just fine, and I am not robbing my bus engine of 50 HP+fuel to run the factory ac. If you are going to spend the bucks for a good generator and inverter system you might as well use it while driving. Plus no maintenance on a second system.
--Geoff
'82 RTS CA |
Bill (65.150.213.44)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, August 28, 2004 - 6:10 pm: | |
Spend over 5 grand for a good gen. set that will use about 1/3 gallon per hour. And save on the high cost of over the road air repaires. And the cost of the extra fuil to run it. Just good savings as you will need roof or some other type off air conditioning when parked. Been there done that. This will probly get a big argument started |
John that newguy (199.232.240.132)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, August 28, 2004 - 9:34 pm: | |
I've been pondering the same thing with the MC9 I have. So I semi-decided
to leave the working bus air in and build around it. I can always take it our later
if it's all that bad. Right now, I can put ice on the windows in 1/2 hour in
90 degree weather.
When I see some guys installing two gensets with two mammoth inverters
and double capacity battery backups, I wonder what in all hell is so bad
with leaving that perfectly good bus air in... to be used while running
down the road, sitting in traffic or while parked for lunch.
Gensets require $$ maintenance. There is absolutely no argument that
would convince me otherwise. I've full-timed long enough long enough
to know what happens when the genset won't start; when that "special
part" breaks and there isn't a replacement until next whenever. And
carrying around two gensets for that special moment, when a guy isn't
full-timing... is really..... funny. But living/travelling in the south does call
for decent air conditioning, especially if you enjoy some semblance of
comfort while travelling in a tin can.
If the original AC needs too much work, or is in the way of something
critically needed, take it out. If it works and you can work around it...
I would leave it in. To me, it's the kool thing to do.
And that same system will provide more than ample heat..
I'm a firm believer in "doing it your way", but once it's gone; it's gone. |
ron and patti (Hayleyscomet) (24.108.179.61)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, August 28, 2004 - 11:01 pm: | |
Thanks John, I think we have come to the same conclusion. It's in good working order and has the 134a in it instead of the r12. Our mechanic tells us that the magnetic clutch on the compressor disengages when the air conditioning is not on and therefor, you have the option of not using that extra horsepower if its needed. Hopefully our bus won't be so heavy that the hills will bother us anyway. We're not sure why our bus has the over the road air, the drivers air, and then an auxillary air at the very back that turns on with a separate toggle switch. Patti |
John that newguy (199.232.244.127)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, August 29, 2004 - 7:19 am: | |
The MC9 we have, has a Welch auxiliary air conditioner. It runs on it's
own compressor and is totally separate from the bus air. The unit sits
in the rear wall of the bus. If you have that same auxiliary system, you
can consider yourself very fortunate. That system is around $2 grand.
I've been told it can be tied into the driver's air, if and when you desire
to do that. (http://www.welchindustries.com/auxacsys.html)
I'm still trying to find out if the small automobile-sized compressor can
be run with an electric motor. If so, it would be the best of all worlds.
But even not, the auxiliary system can be used without the bus air and
can provide plenty of cooling for normal travel. That may help an eventual
later decision regarding the removal of the main system.
The owner I bought my bus from, claimed that the auxiliary units were
installed and used to help cool the coach quick, prior to departure. Rather
than idle the bus for long periods while awaiting the loading of passengers,
the bus can be off until almost ready to load. Then both airs are run to
quickly cool the unit. He claimed either unit would keep the bus cool
enough on it's own. Here in 90+ Florida sun, I found that it's one of the
few things about the bus he was truthful about.
You're still going to need 110v air conditioning, however. To go with
roof airs or not, is the next planning maze for us. I would like to make
use of the existing ductwork, if possible and use a mobile home type
AC unit to feed it. Unfortunately, they all run on 220, narrowing the
chance of finding a decent inexpensive, or used, genset.
Isn't all this fun? |
John Rigby (24.174.238.253)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, August 29, 2004 - 4:02 pm: | |
John.
Does it also run off the engine? Boy Welsh looks to be very resonable with there replacement parts.
John |
John that newguy (199.232.244.167)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, August 29, 2004 - 9:51 pm: | |
The Welch compressor sits above the blower assembly and runs off
the fan pulley. The evaporator unit mounts at the rear, but can be put
anyplace. And the condenser/fan fits nicely on the passenger side rear,
next to the engine. And that too, can be anyplace.
With a bus full of people, it might not be satisfactory used alone,
although the previous owner claimed it was. I can tell you that with
an empty bus, I found the thing is too cold at it's high setting while
sitting in the heat of the Florida sun. It won't ice the windows like
the bus air, but it works fantastic!
I've been told by a number of sources, that it can be used to feed
the front driver's air also. I probably won't be doing that (yet), since
it would involve expelling the gas from both the bus system, and the
Welch system, to disconnect and re-route the driver's air lines to it.
Everything works great now and I'm a firm believer in "if it ain't broke",
etc. etc.
It's a fairly noisy system when run at the high setting, but probably
no more noisy than those damned roof airs when they're set on high.
On high, you can feel the breeze of the fan on the back of your head
while sitting in the front of the bus. That sir, is one helluva fan!
Now, if I can figure out a way to use that in a bay and feed the
ductwork..... hmmmm.... |
Johnny (4.174.91.233)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, September 01, 2004 - 1:04 am: | |
"I've full-timed long enough long enough to know what happens when the genset won't start; when that "special part" breaks and there isn't a replacement until next whenever"
Hey, I know this situation, too! What happens is I usually learn a few new words when my friend discovers it's 90 degrees & we have no A/C, & a few more when he sees my wife out jogging in said 90-degree muggy heat.
"You're still going to need 110v air conditioning, however."
John--not necessarily. I've found a source for 9800BTU 12V roof A/C units. An archive search should find the link (I'm lazy, it's 1am, & my dialup is running at 20K). |
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