| Author | Message | ||
| joe shelton (64.222.166.146) Rating: |
All the fluid-drive fan control system (thermo valve, tubing,...) has been removed from my 4106 so that the fan is moving max air at all times. I'd like to reinstall the system. Any suggestions on installation details and where I might find parts? thanks, joe 4106-2119 | ||
| Alan Baker (152.163.100.132) Rating: N/A |
I removed mine and installed a "hogs head" from a city bus 20 yrs ago. It improved my milage increased my oil pressure and cut down on my oil consumption. I say leave it alone Alan | ||
| Dwight (67.213.8.98) Rating: N/A |
Not sure what type fluid fan you have, Try here for the service manual on one of them. http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/RTS-bus-nuts/files/Service%20Manual/ Parts can be obtained from www.nimcobus.com | ||
| TWO DOGS (63.185.72.139) Rating: N/A |
just for something to think about: ..www.zirgo.com look at the one for 199.95 & the best temp. switch...zfsdg | ||
| joe shelton (64.222.166.146) Rating: N/A |
Thanks. Alon, What's a "hogs head"? TD, at zirgo.com I didn't see one for 199.95. saw one for 99.95 and one for 199.00. | ||
| Gary Stadler (Boogiethecat) (68.7.217.217)
Rating: N/A |
Oh here we go again.... how many times has "electric fans can (NOT) replace mechanical fans" been discussed? It won't work... ya just ain't gonna get 20 HP worth of air mover in a 12 or 24 volt electric fan no matter how hunky it is. I thoroughly agree on leaving the fluid drive off. I installed one on my first bus and ridded myself of it 6 months later in favor of a miter drive. Mileage, performance UP and HASSLE all gone. Gears & drive belts rock!! | ||
| Jim-Bob (12.46.52.74) Rating: N/A |
How can it be that when you remove the fluid drive radiator fan that is NEVER 100% coupled and drives the fan JUST ENOUGH to maintain correct coolant temperature and replace it with an always 100% coupled, belt & pulley drive you would get better performance AND better economy???? If that were so, every vehicle manufacturer including heavy trucks would rid themselves of the expensive, power robbing, performance draining clutch fans that have been used since the '70s. It just ain't so. Clutch fans are uncoupled on cold starts, allowing engine to warm up faster. They slip when subjected to throttle changes, allowing faster response. They pull ONLY enough HP to adequately cool the engine, reducing noise & improving economy. They engage & disengage very gently, so engine doesn't surge, improving driveability & passenger comfort. | ||
| Stan (68.150.152.113) Rating: N/A |
Many front engine vehicles never use the fan when in motion. The ram air is sufficient for cooling. A rear side mounted radiator is sitting in a low pressure zone and needa a lot of fan to move sufficient air. The thermostat controlled fan will run most of the time and the maintenance cost is more than what you save in fuel. I tried the electric fan route with up to four fans pulling and four fans pushing and could not hold temperature on level road. I think the fans I used were 2700 CFM each and I tried them in every possible configuration without success. | ||
| Buswarrior (Buswarrior) (64.229.208.54)
Rating: N/A |
Hello. The trouble is that we cannot see what is going on back there when we are driving. Basically, the fan is running flat out. More than enough commercial operations have long ago bypassed the thermostatic stuff with no penalty. Where the thermostatic controls are nice is pulling in and out of gravel driveways so you aren't whipping up a dust storm. On drive out, you aren't up to temp yet, and on drive in, it has cooled as you slowed and pulled in, or checked in as the case may be, the fan isn't sucking hard and the dust stays on the ground. And those of us in the northern climes can just engage the Webasto/Espar of our choice for the fast wram up if the controls are nfg. If money is tight, don't think you need to spend this money as a priority to replace the thermo controls. happy coaching! buswarrior | ||
| DrivingMissLazy (66.168.175.51) Rating: N/A |
I removed the hydraulic fan control from my Eagle and it was a serious mistake. The first time I got in cold weather, (below about 40 degrees), I could not keep the engine up to temperature, even with the radiator blocked with a piece of cardboard. Engine would only get up to about 110 degrees. Not even enough temperature to operate the drivers heater and defroster. Had to run my Webasto continously. I removed it and installed a fan with more blades to try and solve my summertime overheating problems and it really made little or no difference with that problem. Richard | ||
| BrianMCI96A3 (67.77.37.160) Rating: N/A |
I'm with DML and Jim-Bob on this... don't bypass thermostatic fan controls, repair them to working order if they have been disconnected. Among other things, the stress it puts on the fan can cause a destructive failure of the fan over time. ...And a fan blade detatching itself at high rpms is incredibly destructive. While it is true that we don't know prescisely what is going on in the engine bay going down the road in a rear engined coach, in a 10 wheeled dump truck with a Cummins in it the fan cycles on and off regularly. The idea behind the thermostatically controled fan, as Jim-Bob mentioned is to bring coolant to optimum temp fast, then keep it there, and to reduce parasitic loads on the engine and thus increase fuel economy across the board. A side benefit is increased engine life from a variety of factors... Thermosatic fan controls are a REALLY good idea with no real down side other than proper maintenance. Brian | ||
| Stan (68.150.152.113) Rating: N/A |
Brian's last sentence hits the target. The fan doesn't use any power when it is not running and may save some fuel at the expense of fan control maintenance. However, the fan does not provide engine temperature control. It is the last link in the cooling system. The DD engine book has excellent charts on how to set up the engine thermostats, damper controls and radiator shutter controls to bring the temperature up to normal and keep it there. | ||
| Jim-Bob (205.188.116.135) Rating: N/A |
Stan, while it's true that the thermostats impede or redirect the coolant until the engine is warm, the thermostatic fan allows faster warm ups and prevents overcooling. I have 2 GMs and 1 Eagle and none of them have shutters. The oldest (59) GM had 'em but they were removed decades ago. I too, like DML have experienced overcooling in both vehicles and marine applications. It's common where a really heavy duty cooling system can't choke down enough to get the engine warm or keep it warm in cold weather. But to each their own. My brother in law removes the thermostats from every vehicle he has owned. But he wonders why he has other problems afterward. | ||
| Stan (68.150.152.113) Rating: N/A |
I guess it depends on the bus design at the factory. I had three MCI coaches of different models and they all had rad shutters. Two of the busses were built for use in Canada and one came from Nevada so it would seem that MCI had both hot and cold weather in mind for the design. With two strokers there is not usually a problem getting enough heat. Two of my busses had standard MCI dual rads with shutters and dampers and one (MC-7 Combo) had a side rad with shutters only. | ||
| joe shelton (64.222.165.172) Rating: N/A |
Thanks. I live in cent NH so run alot in cld weather. Having overheat on hills but found the rad is shot so will fix that and see what. After reading all the above I am incline to reinstall the controls (I think). And what's a "hogs head"? joe 4106-2119 |
