| Author | Message | ||
| John that newguy (Unregistered Guest) Rating: N/A |
In an earlier post (LH rotation vs RH rotation), it's become reasonably apartment that I am not alone in my lack of knowledge regarding all the details of the mechanics of various buses. In fact, at the local truck garage, I asked the "how to" question and was informed by the otherwise -very knowledgeable- diesel guy, that he'd have to check the manual for the bus in question. So.... The question of "how to reset the auto-kill" on various buses, would be of great help to all "newbies" to any bus make or model. How many of us have driven buses during our earlier years, but never played the mechanic to them? (I never did). So, for all if us that have either just acquired our "dream" (or nightmare), or may be about to drive it home for the first time....... Should it decide to die (due to lack of oil, water, overheat, low air, etc..), en route... and we somehow manage to locate and resolve -that- immediate problem... What are the methods of resetting that automatic engine stop system for the different makes and models? | ||
| Ojhn Htat enwguy (Unregistered Guest) Rating: N/A |
Uhm... reasonably apparent, not apartment.. | ||
| TWO DOGS (Unregistered Guest) Rating: N/A |
low water shutdown.....add water or...maybe I didn't understand the question | ||
| Stan (Unregistered Guest) Rating: N/A |
I have very limited experience with computer controlled engines, so the following applies to the older non computer types. Most busses have a low oil pressure and a high water temperature shut down system. The high temperature system will reset automatically when the temperature goes down. The low oil pressure shut down is bypassed by the start circuit so you can restart the engine but it will stop again if the oil pressure is still low. You can bypass the shut down system to get the bus into the breakdown lane but instructions are specific to each make and model of bus. Two stroke Detroits with solid injector racks also have a flapper valve in the air horn above the blower. This is tripped by the emergency switch at the dash in case of a run away engine, or sometimes just trips by itself. It is reset by turning the lever on the side of the air horn until it latches in the cam. If you drove for a bus line, I can't imagine them not giving their drivers this information. | ||
| Gary McFarland (Gearheadgary)
Rating: N/A |
I'm not sure what we're talking about, I thought maybe the mousetrap. Gary | ||
| FAST FRED (Unregistered Guest) Rating: N/A |
Most times the "auto shut down" or similar is an OPTIOn on a coach, and may or may not be there. Hound has some special options that charter fleets seldomeselected. ANY of the installed auto shut down , and the ways (sometimes) to overrule them are in the specific books from the mfg. Hence the opinion to get Da Book & READ Da Book, perhaps even before getting the coach. FAST FRED | ||
| BrianMCI (Unregistered Guest) Rating: N/A |
When I bought my coach, the loss of oil pressure part of the auto shut-down was causing the engine to die after the system built air. This really didn't make sence to me, because if an exterior oil line broke while the engine had been shutdown with no air pressure and the bulb for the low oil pressure light was burned out... by the time the shutdown had air, the engine would be a goner ...In any case we examined the situation and since oil pressure was good on the mechanical gauges, we decided that perhaps the problem was that the oil pressure sensor was bad. We changed out the sensor, but unfortunately, that wasn't the problem. Eventually, we had to plug off air to the shutdown cylinder and drive it home like that. Reaching in and around the moving blower belts in the middle of the night so as to operate the shutdown lever at every stop, was a little unnerving. In the end, it turned out to be that the wiring between the sensor and the shut-down module was bad. After replacing those wires the system appears to be working flawlessly since. Brian | ||
| TWO DOGS (Unregistered Guest) Rating: N/A |
reaching in ????....YUK...put it in gear,foot on brake, let out clutch slowly.. | ||
| BrianMCI (Unregistered Guest) Rating: N/A |
I am aussuming that what I posted is what the thread is about, because there really isn't a simple way to reset a engine shut-down system... You have to repair the faulty component in the system whatever it is, the shutdown module will then reset itself. My coach is MCI 96A3 but most engine shutdown systems work the same way. I rented a reasonable apartment once... a long time ago (grin) Well, it was more of a CONDO than an apartment, but it was reasonable. | ||
| BrianMCI (Unregistered Guest) Rating: N/A |
Silly Two Dogs, can you say Allison transmission? Brian | ||
| TWO DOGS (Unregistered Guest) Rating: N/A |
silly brian...can you say trouble... if you are too lazy to shift...you need to stay home | ||
| Marc Bourget (Unregistered Guest) Rating: N/A |
Don't be troubled, BrianMCI 2D may be experiencing the typical post-coitial intolerance that typically infects us men after we resolve our glandular congestion! Seems like, aside from an air valve problem, 2D had a great time in Alberquerque! (sp intentional) ROFL! Marc Bourget | ||
| TWO DOGS (Unregistered Guest) Rating: N/A |
.................  | ||
| Marc Bourget (Unregistered Guest) Rating: N/A |
You devil, you! | ||
| Marc Bourget (Unregistered Guest) Rating: N/A |
Actually, If I were runnig true to form, I ought accuse you of being Politically "incorrect" a D***head and an engineering a**hole because you failed to consider that someone who has an auto can't do what a stick'er can! Onward and Upward Marc Bourget | ||
| TWO DOGS (Unregistered Guest) Rating: N/A |
automatic guys are retarded.. | ||
| Derek (Derek_l)
Rating: N/A |
Hell yeah, they're so much nicer coming down big hills in the city where you can't use your engine brake.... Oh, wait. What? | ||
| TWO DOGS (Unregistered Guest) Rating: N/A |
see what I mean ??????? | ||
| John that newishguy (Unregistered Guest) Rating: N/A |
*&^%$%$#. I leave for a minute and a fight breaks out. Can't youse guys control yerselves? (HAR) Anyway.... The fella' in the post (way back there - - regarding LH vs RH engines) ended up with a question on how to reset the auto-kill, after an engine's been dumped. It seems he has an engine that was in an overheated state, and before he could get it off the road, it had "shut down" by itself. He asked about a new engine, figuring the old one was no good....since he couldn't restart it... And my suggestion that -maybe- the auto-kill isn't reset and possibly he doesn't need an engine, but to only reset the system. SO.... FF's advice, that each manufacturer has their own little quirky method of resetting their own system may apply.... And that's why I thought that the vast experience of the many owners of the very many makes and models, might want to post instructions on how to reset the auto-kill for their particular make/model bus. Having a nice, concise list to print out, would be a damned nice thing to carry around, wouldn't it? Ahh.... so.... what were the remedies again? (thanks in advance) | ||
| BrianMCI (Unregistered Guest) Rating: N/A |
Two Dogs, you really are funny, in an ape-like red-necked not very bright sort of way! <grin> Brian | ||
| BrianMCI (Unregistered Guest) Rating: N/A |
Besides the fact that killing the engine with the clutch is a horrible idea, I mean. Brian | ||
| TWO DOGS (Unregistered Guest) Rating: N/A |
sticking your arm in a running engine is STUPID | ||
| Stan (Unregistered Guest) Rating: N/A |
John the newguy: I thought I explained the reset issue quite clearly in my post above. If you want to know how to over ride the safety shutdowns, that is a different thing. Can you make your question more specific? | ||
| John that newguy Rating: N/A |
There's no way I can make the question more specific, Stan. Your comment: "Two stroke Detroits with solid injector racks also have a flapper valve in the air horn above the blower. This is tripped by the emergency switch at the dash in case of a run away engine, or sometimes just trips by itself. It is reset by turning the lever on the side of the air horn until it latches in the cam. " When you say "also have", are there other things that should be reset in order to restart the engine? It would clear things up if you could read the original post regarding "replacing a lh with a rh engine". If the poster cannot restart the engine due to a failure to reset it after an auto-shutdown, knowing how to do that would save him $$$$ and time. You could be of great service to him, with a detailed explanation. | ||
| Gary McFarland (Gearheadgary)
Rating: N/A |
Stan's answer is appropriate. So is what your Mechanic told you. There is no magic answer. Gary | ||
| John that not-so-newguy Rating: N/A |
I simply asked if all those that know what the specific instructions to reset the auto-stop are for their model, could post it here for all to see. Doing so could be very helpful to all those "newbies" without manuals. Stan commented: "You can bypass the shut down system to get the bus into the breakdown lane but instructions are specific to each make and model of bus. " I have a manual, the time, $$$ and patience to figure it out for myself. I posted this request for information for all those that are likely as curious as the guy that posted that question on the thread I noted. The information would be valuable to anyone dealing with buses and bus owners, to have on hand. | ||
| Gary McFarland (Gearheadgary)
Rating: N/A |
Dude. there is no one answer. My Cat has only the engine monitoring system that shuts down when preset Oil pressure or coolant temp exceed predefined limits. Even that type of system will vary with each system. A 2-stroke DD has a mousetrap to kill the air to the blower in addition to the above. A newer detroit will have DDEC and all of it's complexities. Just like your Wrench said, and he is not an "Otherwise" very knowledgeble, but an actual professional. Every system is different, in operation and application. What is the problem we are trying to solve here anyway? Gary | ||
| BrianMCI Rating: N/A |
Yes, well you might think it's stupid Two Dogs, but since the emergency shut-off wasn't working, what would you suggest I do? Pray for it to stop? Stop being such a sissy, I stick my hand into running engines all the time, it's part of the job, Bub Brian | ||
| John that get'nolderguy Rating: N/A |
Once again, one of these threads becomes comical. Fully understanding that there's "no one answer", I requested input from each individual that may know about their particular vehicle make/model. Real simple: You own a vehicle with a "cat", and you post what it takes for -you- to reset the auto-stop device on that vehicle. Even if it's enough to get the vehicle off the road, the information would be handy to anyone that has a copy of it (sooner or later). The "wrench" I spoke to would likely tape a printout to his toolbox cover. And no, Stan. No company(s) that I had ever worked for would consider having the driver "fix" the vehicle. If it stopped, it sat until a repair vehicle got to it. The driver's responsibility is to his passengers; their safety and comfort. Didling with the mechanics while leaving the passengers unattended is not in anyone's best interest. That's the way all the companies in the Northeast (that I am familiar with) operated. If they're different wherever you are.... well.. Brian / TD - I had to reach between the belt to get to, and turn down, the air throttle after it was tightened errantly causing the engine to go full-tilt upon starting. The shutdown did not work (front or rear) and there was no other way (aside from stuffing rags into the air intake), to shut it down or reduce it from a full-tilt roaring condition. Sometimes ya' gotta' do whatcha' gotta' do and just hope the guy upstairs will be in a good mood when ya' do it. | ||
| Stan Rating: N/A |
John the newguy: Apparently you never drove a DD 2 stroke for Greyhound. Their drivers sat in the breakdown lane on a regular basis waiting for the high temperature shut down to reset automatically. They didn't phone for help every time the engine overheated. They were expected to know what the safety shutdowns did. They were also expected to know how to get it into the breakdown lane. | ||
| Gary McFarland (Gearheadgary)
Rating: N/A |
It's the premise of this entire thread that is comical. You want us to create a cheat-sheet for automatic shutdown procedures for every drivetrain in every type of installation imaginable. Ostensibly to serve as a troubleshooting guide for Imaginary users having imaginary problems on imaginary busses. IMO there are enough questions to answer and problems to solve without having to imagine new ones for users that haven't asked. I'm not sure what your goal is here other than to get everyone to talk to you. Gary | ||
| John that newguy Rating: N/A |
I never drove for the Hound, Stan. I did drive for Huntington Coach (their Long Island Railroad contract) and Intercounty Motor coach (Babylon, LI). The RR buses were fishbowls, and Intercounty had Eagles for most work. I have worked for other companies through the years, with 4104, 4106, MC5, MC8, MC9, etc. (I part-timed for numerous companies through the years) I never sat in a breakdown lane, or ever suffered a breakdown. Nor was I ever taught how to reset a tripped auto-kill. It was never within the scope of any training I remember having. And knowing many Hound drivers, not one would suggest dipping into the mechanics of the bus, if it should quit aside the road. If I owned and operated buses, Stan.... The last thing I'd want, is a driver to be poking into the engine compartment. It would then be my responsibility to teach that driver - and train that driver, to be a mechanic - and all safety operations that go with that turf. It's difficult enough to find drivers that have a decent driving record and experience. "Drive the bus and leave the repairs to us", is the general motto. And Gary.... You really should spend more time converting, than criticizing. It's unfortunate that personalities and clashes of the same, may keep information from being posted that could be of help. |