| Author | Message | ||
| Jim (Jim_in_california)
Rating: |
Folks, I realize that the 671 engines themselves are likely to be available for 20+ years no problem. What about suspension parts? Airbags? Steering linkages? What's the situation with the availability of replacement Spicer manual trannies or at least rebuilt parts? Clutches? Electrical stuff? (Electical shouldn't be a big deal actually...once you have an alternator working, everything else is adaptable from later buses esp. if it's already been converted to neg. ground?) Put another way...other than windows and suspension bits, what exactly is specific to the frame and what is adaptable from other stuff? Is it possible to keep one running for 20+ years, or...will it be an increasingly difficult "scrounge job" to keep it alive? | ||
| FAST FRED Rating: N/A |
Body parts would be biggest hassle , but IBC makes ones that match physically but are diffrent "color" as they dont /cant annodize as GM could. The ONLY real difficult (to find and PAY for) item on an 04 is the rear end. Take care to not let it run out of oil and synthetic might help. Everything else is out there , just will have to be shipped , as much won't be at NAPA. A coach is like a battery , once really fully charged the unit will operate for long periods with nothing but charging. I am not claiming as idiots do " a Coach was made to go a million miles with only an oil change". But after a full regime of getting to the "postponed" maint. of the previous owner , the reliability is excellent. Buy Da Book , and DO all the lube and inspections that are recomended. Most times its a once in a lifetime job. EG when looking at the front wheel bearings , (while inspecting or renewing the brakes),install NEW seals and synthetic grease. DONE , for a long long time of RV use. 20 years from now body parts will be still in the specalists yards , so convienance will detirmine what price you have to pay. Alluminum monocoque construction is the finest and longest lasting in the coach world.(and so expensive its no longer done , even on most new aircraft). Being the lightest and stiffest it causes far less hassles than forever rusting steel tubing. The ability to transplant an complete engineered system such as a series 50 and 5 speed from a scrap transit will solve the "polution" problems if the 2 strokes loose their grandfathered status (very doubtfull) in the next 50 years. FAST FRED | ||
| Jim (Jim_in_california)
Rating: N/A |
>>Alluminum monocoque construction is the finest and longest lasting in the coach world.(and so expensive its no longer done , even on most new aircraft). Being the lightest and stiffest it causes far less hassles than forever rusting steel tubing.<< Yeah. That's why I'm considering one. That and the milage, the ease of engine access, how the motor doesn't protrude deep into the back room... Can a rear axle off a transit be adapted? Say, a 96" wide RTS? Another point: I'm seriously attracted to the lower middle aisle of the 4102/4103 (due to my height!) and a couple of nice conversions of same are on the market. (There's was a really cherry specimen on EBay recently, reserve wasn't met, I'm going to EMail the owner if the loot shows up soon.) Now I realize that the front glass would be problematic if they get bashed! I'd probably have to have a totally different window frame engineered in custom to take something like...hell I dunno, the flat sort of Crown glass maybe (4 pieces) or something equally weird but common. But beyond the glass, how mechanically similar is the 4102/4103 from the 4104? The other way to get the dropped center aisle is the really ancient 3751 with the squirrelly column-shift manual that's supposed to be a major pain to deal with. I think that bus runs spring suspension vs. airbags? What are parts like on those? There's a really slick specimen at HB, has a hardwood floor all the way across but the center aisle could no doubt be restored easily enough (cut the wood at least back through the kitchen, do linoleum in the channel...). Finally, what sort of suspensions do the 4102 and 4103 run? I know they have 4104 type shifters, are they otherwise mechanically more similar to the 4104 or the older 3751? | ||
| dickherrington
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4102 and 4103 have spring suspension, 671 and 4 speed spicer transmissions. 4104 has airbags, 671 and 4 speed spicer transmission. 4101,2,3 have problems finding windshield. They all go down the road really good if you are as good as they are. 3751 is not really ancient I am older than it is and I still go down the road really good. They are all mechanically similar. | ||
| Tim Hoskinson (Tdh37514151)
Rating: N/A |
3751 4151 does not have the drop aisle you speek of. The colum shift when in decent shape shifts easier than the floor shift of the 4104. And it is not directly in your way when entering or exiting the driver seat. | ||
| Jim (Jim_in_california)
Rating: N/A |
Huh. So...looks like it's the 3751 through 4103 that are all "basically the same bus" except for windows and shifter location. Interesting. Ummm...I was told the 3751 DID have a dropped center aisle? It's often floored over of course when people under 6'2" spec a conversion... Like I say, the 4101/2/3 glass situation doesn't scare me too much. Having a frame fabricated for some other type of glass won't be too hard. Any number of aluminum-skinned motorhomes in the 8' wide range would make an acceptable donor. Might look a bit funky but not too bad if done professionally. OR set it up for two pieces of flat glass, or one big flat piece "angled backwards" towards the top? And there's a pretty sweet 4102 out there converted but the center aisle drop retained. Should go for about $15k or so. | ||
| FAST FRED Rating: N/A |
There are many Canadian busses that were modified (factory) to accept FLAT glass. Its usually 2 pieces per side , so unless you are a busnut and KNOW what it looked like before conversion , its not noticable. Many coach operators consider windshields , replacement items like light bulbs and wiper blades. Fresh glass with no film of scratches is far easier to work with at night . Flat glass would be EZ and cheap to replace, even in the Yukon. FAST FRED | ||
| DMDave Rating: N/A |
Check out a 3703 model GM for the flat glass. its pretty much the same coach as a 4103. We love the look of ours. The leaf spring rides NICE! | ||
| Jim (Jim_in_california)
Rating: N/A |
Is the 3703/4103 style spring suspension sprung at both ends, or are there some airbags? At the front? | ||
| RJ Long (Rjlong)
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Jim - All the GMC parlor coach models PRIOR to the 4104 have steel spring suspension on both axles. This includes the models you're asking about. However, GM "tuned" the suspension for highway operation, as opposed to a skoolie's, which are primarily designed to flit about town. Beginning with the PD4104, air suspension became the dominant player, and has remained so for transit and highway coaches. Granted, the Eagle (and a few others) used the Torsilastics, but you rarely, if ever, see that design anymore. Skoolies, at least the "dog-nosed" ones, are still basically a box on a truck chassis with steel springs. (No offense intended to the Crown guys - they're the exception!!) Ride quality is generally not an issue with a skoolie, but you'd never get Mr & Mrs Bus Tour back on a tour coach if it was sprung like a skoolie!! Clear as the air after a March wind?? (Sorry, couldn't resist the pun. . .  ) HTH, RJ PD4106-2784 Fresno CA | ||
| Jim (Jim_in_california)
Rating: N/A |
Yeah, that helps. A lot. Only thing I'm still not clear on: did the 3751 have a dropped center aisle or not? There's a pretty sweet 3751 at HB right now for $15k...the blue one, although the red ain't bad although I dunno worth $10k more. If the 3751 can have a dropped center aisle restored, that's my top choice (mainly for looks and the easy replacement glass), otherwise there's a pair of 4102s floating around that definately have the drop and have a more normal manual shifter. My other option though is that weird 29' Bluebird in Kansas. Milage ain't as good although gearing tweaks might help. I can add a garage to it and big surprise, it's one of the few '70s era Bluebirds I've spotted that have an interior height to match MY height . Decisions . | ||
| Tim Hoskinson (Tdh37514151)
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The 3751 has the clutch, shift, and throttle linkages mounted under the center aisle and would be difficult to drop the aisle. I have seen no 3751 with a drop aisle and seen no book or pulication showing a 3751 with a drop aisle. I presently own two 3751 and a 4151 none of them had a droped aisle | ||
| Jim (Jim_in_california)
Rating: N/A |
Huh. OK, good to know. Thanks. There's a really sweet 4102 with the drop that's my backup plan if the Bluebird falls through. |
