| Author | Message | ||
| Jim (Jim_in_california)
Rating: |
Hi all. There's an EBay bus that failed to meet reserve and is now open, I can get it for $13k: http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=4543918765&rd=1&sspagename=S TRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&rd=1 Niles pointed it out to me in this thread: http://www.busnut.com/bbs/messages/4693/9919.html?1113969682 It turns out the thing is exactly 6'4" tall inside, which means a lot to me  . (It's some sort of "adult model" versus skoolie maybe.) And I could have a full 6' long (by 8' wide) garage "tacked on" no problem given it's current short length and minimal rear overhang - stretch it to 35' and it would be just like a 35' Wanderlodge. This would net me the best possible garage and living layout in a 35ft overall platform. I *really* like that. Flaws: tachometer doesn't work (all other gauges do thank God) and the fridge is wonky (maybe an easy fix, maybe not. It also needs a better battery bank and inverter/charger but that's a given with any older conversion. The propane genset is mediocre. The biggest real flaw to me is that the milage is only about 8mpg and according to the owner, does that regardless of standalone or towing up to the 6,000lb he regularly pulls. Top speed is 72, it's more comfortable around 62 - 65. As it was probably a gasser at one point, odds are the rear axle gears haven't been changed (5.36 per frame tag) and the Cummins in front of an Allison 4sp is almost certainly straining (maybe even over-revving?). So...first, does anybody know exactly which motor this might be and know anything about it's reliability? Second, am I right in thinking this bus would benefit big from 4.11 or so gears in the rear? Third, would I be better off with a gearvendors thingie behind the tranny, or just swap the rear end gearing? The bus is currently at 20,000lbs and I doubt I'd be adding more than 2,500 complete with add-on box in the rear (aluminum tube frame, aluminum skin), better batteries and a bike. What are the odds I'll be able to nudge 10mpg with gearing changes? Any other comments about this puppy? My alternative is to hollow out the back bedroom of a 4104 or similar into a garage (with side hatch) and turn the front couch into a dedicated bed with pillows for daytime "couch use". That gives me a smaller main bed, less choices for guest bed, etc. This Bluebird does have a queen-size rear bedroom (a bit tight, but decent) and a pretty good overall front living area, and THEN I'd add a garage without messing with any of that. | ||
| Bill K Rating: N/A |
I think this is the same motor I have in my Dodge 3500 pickup. I have it cranked up to 350hp not sure what the tork is. but sure does work good in my truck, May be a little small for you application. | ||
| David Hartley (Drdave)
Rating: N/A |
Looks good for the money, But there are a couple of drawbacks, Not tough ones but drawbacks. It's a front engine bus, Lots of noise up front, The generator is a 3,600 rpm noise maker that would drive you and neighbors deaf. The rear end gear ratio is 5.36:1 which would have to be changed. It's good for mountain climbing and drag racing but not efficient on the highway. You could change the rear-end to a two speed if needed since it is a front engine bus. It's not recommended to wind a 5.9 at 3,000 rpm all day long. That ratio kinda tells me it was a Gas powered rig at one time. For what you are thinking this might be what you want so that you can extend the rear frame rails and add a rear door and ramp. You might be able to add 6 or more feet to it but would have to be careful about too much weight rear of the axle. Frames are made of Steel, Not aluminum! If you do it be safe and sure and use steel for the extension. Forget tearing up a perfectly good 4104 as they are hard to come by and cutting into the GMC rear area is a bad move any day. Things tend to fall apart if you weaken the structure. Have fun.... | ||
| Jim (Jim_in_california)
Rating: N/A |
>>It's a front engine bus, Lots of noise up front,<< Yeah, I'm well aware of that but as you realized later, my need for a rear "garage" means a puller is FAR better suited. If the noise is too crazy I'll pad the doghouse cover inside and out until it's shut up enough . I also know the genset is crap. Probably do a Honda EU2000i or similar (combined with solar and a good battery bank) unless I can get a SMALL watercooled diesel going driving a quality alternator. Either way I can get a new genset so small that it can share the space with an inverter/charger. I've been wondering what to do with the old genset. Making a propane-powered motorcycle out of it has some appeal but the "issues" involved in a crash (-=BOOOM=-) make that a bad idea . The seller says the genset motor seems to have an unused gas carb too...might be a dual-fuel setup. I may just stick it on EBay. I want to see how fuel-efficient it is on propane though, if it does OK I might just try and muffle the hell out of it...pad it's box internally and use a "Twodogs commemorative" electric fan(s?) to move fresh air in and out... >>The rear end gear ratio is 5.36:1 which would have to be changed. It's good for mountain climbing and drag racing but not efficient on the highway. You could change the rear-end to a two speed if needed since it is a front engine bus.<< Yup, about what I've been thinking. It appears the engine is an early Cummins 6BT, good torque, known to be very reliable but only about 160 - 180hp in stock form. May have been tweaked a bit, probably has if the thing can do 72 right now. Redlines at 2,600 but it's happier down near 1900ish. Already figured I'd be re-gearing. Swapping to an airshifted 2sp rear end is intriguing but I'd probably do OK with a straight 4.11 or maybe a 3.90. I had already figured I'd have the main steel frame rails extended back 6ft. Then on top of that, one option would be to take a regular ramped cargo trailer, pull the suspension and frame, chop the back 6ft off and drop it right onto the new frame extension! Mate the forward edge to the rear of the bus, link the trailer's lights to the bus rear tail/stop lights, use the trailer's ramp for loading and be done with it. Or fabricate an all new box back there. Either way, once the main frame rails are in the box itself can be aluminum. As to weight balance: first, this was originally a gasser. Second, the Cummins 6BT weighs about 1,100lb. Third, this bus is already abnormally short behind the rear axle from standard Bluebird practice which is a 35ft overall with this same wheelbase. (Another data point: there's a guy selling a 34' version of a bus much like this one, with about the same weight motor up front (Cummins 504NA V8) and his weight distribution was 10,000lbs front and 12,000lbs rear. Again, that bus could actually benefit from 2,500lb near the rear bumper.) Upshot: there's a significant chance the weight balance is screwed up NOW towards the front, and adding weight back of the rear axles will actually help, at least so long as the rear tires are rated high enough to take their proper load. (Another data point: there's a guy selling a 34' version of a bus much like this one, with about the same weight motor up front (Cummins 504NA V8) and his weight distribution was 10,000lbs front and 12,000lbs rear. Again, that bus could actually benefit from 2,500lb near the rear bumper. Betcha this 29' is even worse and long term may be abnormally wearing the front tires!) As to the 4104: actually, they mostly had a rear escape hatch on the driver's side just forward of the engine. Putting a slightly wider one in probably wouldn't hurt anything structurally, esp. if you used quality grade 2" round aluminum tube as a frame with small gussets each corner. Such an escape hatch is sometimes seen on 4106s for that matter and it's engine weight is even higher. Still, I'd rather not go this route if I can help it, and this Bluebird has the best potential as a "garage model 35' anything" that I've seen to date. ------------- One good thing about this puppy: it's got a low-power-use 11,000btu rooftop A/C for the front and a 13,500 in back. With the bedroom door closed the front does OK; if you open the bedroom door the rear can do OK on the whole unit, or use both if it's REAL hot. Which means with a decent alternator on the Cummins driving a quality battery charger and then battery to inverter, I should be able to run the front A/C unit while going down the road. | ||
| FAST FRED Rating: N/A |
"Which means with a decent alternator on the Cummins driving a <<<quality>>> and then battery to inverter, I should be able to run the front A/C unit while going down the road." Perhaps you mean "quality voltage regulator' for the big alt , not battery charger. The inverter for air cond should be a sine wave unit , and a quality one will have a fine (120V) batt charger built in. FAST FRED | ||
| Jim (Jim_in_california)
Rating: N/A |
You're right, a quality REGULATOR off a good alternator. My bad. I'm also aware that a pure sine will drive an air conditioner motor much more effectively than a mod sine. | ||
| Phil Dumpster Rating: N/A |
It's a Blue Bird All American with a 4 inch roof raise and possibly 5 feet chopped off the rear. Very well done, I might add. Blue Bird made their busses in many different lengths and configurations, so it's possible it came from the factory that way. A top speed of 72 miles per hour is just about what most diesel powered school busses did from the factory back then, so it might not have been a gas powered bus originally. With a good sound proofing job, the noise from the front engine isn't as bad as you think it would be. What is a big problem (I used to drive these, so trust me on this) is the heat against your right foot during the hotter parts of summer. The ones I drove had Cat 3208 engines in them, which put an exhaust manifold right next to the engine room wall, so that might have made a difference, but keep it in mind. Eight miles per gallon is what you can expect for a vehicle like this. It's heavy and unless it accelerates like a bat out of hell now, changing to taller gears will slow down the acceleration and might not improve the top speed all that much, not to mention putting more stress on the running gear. It probably doesn't have a lockup torque converter, if it's the original engine and transmission. Changing that would probably have a far greater impact on fuel economy than anything else. | ||
| Mike (Busone)
Rating: N/A |
Good point Phil Dumpster about the lock up converter. If it has an AT545 you might want to upgrade to a MT643 which does have a lock up converter. | ||
| Jim (Jim_in_california)
Rating: N/A |
Phil, excellent point re: lockup converter. There's good reason to believe that the chassis is all-stock (no lift, no rear end chop) and that it WAS a gasser originally. One there's the frame age (1973), another there's the frame stamp showing a 5.36 rear end. Plus, if this motor is a 6BT (and from various pics I've been looking at it's the strongest possibility) the motor didn't exist until the late '80s making the conversion newer than the current owner thinks. He IS sure it was an auto tranny from day one (no possible clutch pedal mount). There's a fair chance the tranny is original. IF that's the case the rear end gears would more or less have to have been swapped out. Once I find out what the ratio is, if the tranny is a non-locker as I too suspect and if the rear end ratio is halfway rational, then yeah, the tranny is the place to drop a few grand and go to the MT643. How many gears in a 643? One bit of good news: the 6BT has the exhaust on the right, not the left. (Actually, being a V8 the 3208 has exhaust both sides...the 6BT is a straight six, exhaust right.) | ||
| RJ Long (Rjlong)
Rating: N/A |
MT-643 is a medium-duty truck four-speed Allison automatic with a lock-up torque converter. FYI: AT = Auto Truck, or light-duty truck (3/4 ton pickups to ton & a half rigs.) MT = Medium Truck HT = Heavy Truck | ||
| Jim (Jim_in_california)
Rating: N/A |
Right. Well it sounds like the plan is "if it's an AT545 go to the MT643, if it's got an MT40 or 643 with lockup go visit Gearvendors". | ||
| Phil Dumpster Rating: N/A |
Diesel powered school busses were around in 1973. Just because it had 5.36 finals doesn't necessarily mean it had a gasoline engine. Remember these were not intercity coaches. The highest sustained speeds for a school bus application in 1973 were typically 2 lane rural country roads, 50 to perhaps 60 miles per hour. Most school busses were geared for a top speed of around 70 miles per hour from the factory. Some districts and companies would spec a lower top speed as a way of keeping their drivers from exceeding a certain speed. Fuel efficiency was just not part of the equation when it came to deciding the final drive ratio. Blue Bird favored GM's 366 engine for the gasoline powered All American, and coaches so equipped were geared such that that engine would be spinning close to 4000 rpm at 65 mph and sounding nice and tight while doing it. They also burned gasoline at 3.5 to 4 miles per gallon for a 40 foot All American. Most had vacuum governors on them to keep engine revs from exceeding 4200. This has changed now that fuel cost is something to be considered. Todays school busses are geared with the goal of keeping the engine at an optimum speed and taking care of the speed limiting functions through the powertrain controller. Changing the final drive ratio to something taller (say, 4.11) will increase your top speed, but it will also hurt your acceleration and your hill climbing ability. Make sure the tradeoff is something you can live with before you spend the money. If you don't mind shifting, an RT0-910 or RTOO-910 would be almost perfect for this bus, and you'd probably break the 10 miles per gallon mark quite easily. | ||
| Brian Brown (Fishbowlbrian)
Rating: N/A |
Looks like a nice, solid little bus there. Bluebirds are built like tanks and highly regarded as RVs in the WL line. The small wheelbase and spring ride wouldn't be for me, but your hauler needs will probably trump the ride. A thought: You might also be able to squeeze on some 11 or even 12R22.5s on the wheels and get some extra MPHs due to their larger diameter. Cheaper than a rear end swap. Good luck, BB | ||
| Jim (Jim_in_california)
Rating: N/A |
A Roadranger 10 would be a kick-butt tranny in this thing. Linkage would be tricky but it has to be possible - consider that a Crown mid-engine with a Roadranger needs a shift linkage backwards, and what you'd need for this would be similar except shorter. | ||
| RJ Long (Rjlong)
Rating: N/A |
Mid-engine Crown does NOT need reversed shift linkage - it is similar to a cab-over tractor. A pusher coach needs the reversed linkage. RoadRangers are fun, but you'd quickly tire of it in Sacratomato traffic. Plus, IF the time ever came when you had to sell the rig, there's major resistance to manuals nowadays. FWIW. . . | ||
| Jim (Jim_in_california)
Rating: N/A |
Wait, you misunderstood: I'm not talking about a *reversed* linkage, I mean the linkage is routed backwards towards the tranny which either way is physically behind the driver. I didn't mean "backwards" as in "reversed", I meant it in terms of "position". Although...well looking at pics of the Blue Critter's driver's area, there's no room to put a shift stalk between the doghouse cover and the driver's seat. But what you COULD do is cut a small hole in the floor over the tranny's normal shift stalk position, put the usual rubber doohicky on it, and then run a long shift rod that curves up and forward hovering over the doghouse area. No "linkage" per se, just an abnormal shift rod. Or...put the shifter ON the doghouse? OK, either way it'd look weird. But it'd work OK. And between the manual and the overdrive, betcha a healthy 2mpg or better milage increase is possible. The bus itself ain't real heavy - 20,000 on the scales now. Now granted, if it's got an MT643 now in good shape, the next logical step is probably a gearvendors box. As to long-term resale value: first thing, I'm building for MY needs. That said, if fuel prices keep climbing, a full liveaboard rig that can do at least 10mpg instead of 7 or 8 would be worth quite a bit to me or anybody else. | ||
| Phil Dumpster Rating: N/A |
Stick shift All Americans had the shift lever between the engine house and the driver. It's a tight fit but it works after you get used to it. Too many people try to think of "resale" value of a coach. Look, you'll never out of a coach what resources you put into it, so why even try? Put resources into a coach to make it the way YOU want it, and consider anything you could get back if/when you sell it a nice bonus. If you want 10 miles per gallon or better out on the open road, then the Roadranger would be the best way to go about it. With a gear for every occasion, you'd also outperform most any other automatic transmission you could put in there. Another thing to consider is whether the cost of putting a different transmission will sufficiently offset the cost of the extra fuel you'd burn if you kept the same running gear. If you plan to be on the move all the time, then you'll come out ahead eventually. If you plan to stay parked most of the time, then you'd probably never break even. | ||
| Jim (Jim_in_california)
Rating: N/A |
>>Another thing to consider is whether the cost of putting a different transmission will sufficiently offset the cost of the extra fuel you'd burn if you kept the same running gear. If you plan to be on the move all the time, then you'll come out ahead eventually. If you plan to stay parked most of the time, then you'd probably never break even.<< Yeah, I understand that. I *think* I will indeed be on the road enough to justify. For one thing, I'm just sick of flying. Last flight to LA for a political speech somebody stole a pocketknife out of my checked bags...$50 worth, but it's the *principle*. Checking firearms when travelling has gotten even worse. Yes, there's a special procedure where you can put a lock on the bag but the procedure is "special" enough that it basically tags the bag for theft. I've about had it. TSA can bite me. Driving the rig to events and dry-camping on some local activist's driveway for a few days will in many cases be cheaper than flying+hotel. | ||
| Mark R. Obtinario (Cowlitzcoach)
Rating: N/A |
BB has made a lot of different versions of their All American School Bus. Until they came out with the TC1000/2000 line of buses in the late '80's, if you didn't want a conventional you got an AA. Having a bobtail, particularly on a shorter wheelbase, wasn't that uncommon. And the 76" headroom was a very common option. For many years BB, like many other bus body manufacturers, used vendor supplied chassis. GM, IHC, OshKosh, and National come to mind. By the early '70's, many of the vendors were no longer making chassis. In other words, the chassis under this particular bus may or may not be a BB chassis. If the bus came from the factory with a GM engine, the most common GM engine in school buses of that vintage was the big block V-6, the most common being the 401/478. With 5.35 gearing that would have given that bus a top speed of about 60 MPH, very typical of school buses of that vintage. If the bus came with an IHC engine, the engine most likely was the 478 V-8. It would have had the same top speed but wouldn't slow down on the hills like the GM V-6. If the bus came with a Ford engine, the engine most likely was the 429/504 V-8. Again, about the same top speed with the 504 and it wouldn't slow down on any hill. It just couldn't pass a gas station. Typical fuel use was 1-2 MPG with an automatic. In a bus that size with the big block gas engines I doubt the AT500 series transmission was used. It more than likely had the MT600 series from the factory. With the 6BT Cummins in it, the fuel mileage more than doubled so the conversion was well worth the expense. If it is dialed in at 160-180 HP, it can be tweaked upwards quite a bit just by adjusting the fuel pump. It really doesn't like to cruise at more than 2600 RPM. Best cruise speed would be in the 2100-2300 RPM neighborhood. Which means if you want the top speed you are going to have to change the rear gears. 4:11 may be a little long legged. 4:23 or 4:34 would be just about ideal--long legged enough to keep up with the traffic and still have some hill climbing ability. I am thinking that going to a longer legged rear gear may put you into the 10 MPG neighborhood. I have seen many BB TC2000 with the 6BT Cummins/automatic school buses average 10+ MPG in route service and over 12 MPG on trips. Mark O. | ||
| Jim (Jim_in_california)
Rating: N/A |
I see. OK. Well the first step will be to ID the tranny. If it's a "locker" of any sort (the whole MT6xx series?) then I'd agree the solution is either rear axle or Gearvendors with rear axle being cheaper almost all of the time. I'd be willing to bet it's being spun up near the top of the 6BT's range, hence the milage. | ||
| Jim (Jim_in_california)
Rating: N/A |
Oh, another thing: the current owner crawled around under there and looked for the plate on the tranny. No joy. Any other guidance as to where it might be? Failing that, is there any clear way of identifying a "locker variant" from the tranny shape/protrusions or whatever? We know the thing is a 4sp already... | ||
| RJ Long (Rjlong)
Rating: N/A |
Jim - An MC-8, for example, came with a 275 hp 8V71 governed at 2150 rpm, 12R22.5 tires, and a 3.73:1 rear axle, weighs about 30K average. Top speed about 75 mph, climbs the Grapevine at 32 mph in 2nd gear, fuel mileage about 6 with the HT-740 Allison. Point is that a rear axle in the 3.90 - 4.10 range might just be right for that BB's powertrain, especially if you can bump the HP up to 200 - 225 easily. Keep the "garage" light (I liked your idea of using a cargo trailer's box), and you should have a real workable solution. | ||
| Jim (Jim_in_california)
Rating: N/A |
Yeah, that's about what I'm thinking. Maybe 4.30ish range to be safe...have to see where the tach is now and what's really in there. Tires are another thing to factor in. >>Keep the "garage" light (I liked your idea of using a cargo trailer's box), and you should have a real workable solution.<< Let's go one better: one possibility is to extend the BB's frame rails backwards six feet and put the rear end of a cargo trailer on...the "forward edge" of the trailer would be cut to match the BB's profile and framed with aluminum tube, and then on top of that do a continuous rubber hose as a rain gasket similar to how BART and other light-rail trains are linked together. That way you're not punching any holes at all in the BB's current outer skin. The "garage" would be simply resting on the frame rails and could even be removed fairly easily if necessary. All of the trailer box's rear lights and bumper can be retained. Pull the bulbs in the BB's rear lights for when the box is in place. Shouldn't weigh more than 700lb, carrying capacity in travel should be at least 1,000 to 1,500lb...enough for a 500lb sportbike, a 250lb small dirt bike, moderate tools and a Splendide . | ||
| RJ Long (Rjlong)
Rating: N/A |
And if you simply bolt the extentions to the existing BB frame rails, the whole "garage" could be removed easily. . . | ||
| David Hartley (Drdave)
Rating: N/A |
And you could use jacks for a slide-in camper to lift the box off when you don't need it. | ||
| Phil Dumpster Rating: N/A |
One way to find out if the torque converter locks is to fix the tach and then drive it at around 50 miles per hour and see if you can vary the RPM of the engine without changing speed. I have never seen a post-1968 gasoline All American with anything other than the 366/427 GM big block engine. An AA with the GM v6 would be so underpowered. I've driven conventionals with that engine and they are not designed with mountain passes in mind. As far as diesels go, they seemed to use mostly Cummins and Cat, with the Detroit 8.2 also later on. Never saw one with a Detroit 2 cycle in it. Probably forbidden by some noise regulations. Their conventional busses were just bodies bolted to truck frames and could have anything the truck manufactuer supplied. | ||
| BusJunky Rating: N/A |
Ive sat back and read this entire thread on this piece of junk Bluebird that you say you are considering buying to travel and do your political ventures around the world. the mechanical intentions that you say you have for this bus are rediculous and no one with finacial smarts would do such foolish thing. your on going manor in which you state ( and then I will this, and then I will do that, and then I will change this and then I will change that) sound more like well thought out dreams than reality. I sell millions of dollars worth of coaches a year and I wish I had a dollar for everytime I have heard a bunch of BS from people who contact me to inquire about coaches that I have listed who dont have a dime to spend. its nothing more than a waste of time and money. I also want to say that im not trying to offend anyone here at this board most of you really know your stuff and that is the reason that I come here to read everyday I am not a member and I very seldom post a comment. I am simply a bus junky I have made my living from it for many years. and i will for many years to come. | ||
| niles steckbauer (Niles500)
Rating: N/A |
Hey Bus Junker - I've never made a living selling buses - I do own a very nice one though - I also sell and contract the construction of single family residences in Florida - and my partners and I have sold/built more than 14 thousand of those - we have never canabalized our customers in the way you just did - you didn't offend - you just showed your ignorance - Niles Steckbauer PCH/ Precision Crafted Homes State of Florida CRC-058150 I posted my credentials - why don't you post yours? | ||
| niles steckbauer (Niles500)
Rating: N/A |
Excuse me - left off - FHA/HUD Certified Compliance Inspector Florida ID # X283 http://www.sunbiz.org/scripts/ficidet.exe?action=DETREG&docnum=G00231900186&rdocnum=G04299 900121 https://entp.hud.gov/idapp/html/insp1.cfm amongst others ........ | ||
| Jim (Jim_in_california)
Rating: N/A |
Busjunky: Bluebirds are a damned good conversion starting point. They're tough and simple. HUGE numbers of Wanderlodges are still running around from the '60s for God's sake. Front-engine specimens from the late '70s/early '80s sell for about $30k in good shape, WAY more than any other sort of motorhome of that era barring a Newell or the best (diesel) Barths. This thing doesn't appear to be the lemon you describe. Yeah, I wish I knew the tranny type, no question there but the basic concepts, the frame, the motor type, how much weight you can add to a Bluebird frame, etc...none of it is at all nuts. People take Bluebird school buses in the 35ft range, chop the WHOLE roof/walls structure off from the rear bumper to about 5ft in front of the rear axle and make car haulers out of them...often putting WAY more stress on the frame back there than I'm considering. Go to any non-pro-level racetrack and you'll see a dozen of these things, operating just fine for years as low-bucks barn-built race car haulers. The frame rails are identical to a Class7 commercial truck, the sort of thing people bolt a 26' cargo box to and carry 20,000+ lbs - on top of the vehicle weight. It sure as hell won't be a Prevost but...yeah, it'll work. A *large* number of people on this board have quite nice (and reliable) rigs with less than $20k into 'em. I'm factoring another $7k or so for the extension. The only part that's looking unlikely is the "10mpg goal". Prolly 9 if I'm lucky, and I can survive 8. And yeah, I've been looking a while. Sigh. Money got delayed. The first $5700 did just get released yesterday though, the additional $72k coming probably Monday (the smaller chunk comes from Alameda County, the big chunk comes from the state - each got a slice of the $2.6mil in Diebold money so each owed part of the bounty). | ||
| FAST FRED Rating: N/A |
"A *large* number of people on this board have quite nice (and reliable) rigs with less than $20k into 'em." Not sure how large that group actually is , I am very experienced in yacht construction and know how to build strong & simple interiors. Yet I'm certain the costs excede $20,000 on my coach with loads of used "finds" (noisemaker ect) and about 1500 hours of play. "Make a list and check it twice!" and you may see a larger number than you think. Then toss in a few grand to bring "whatever" back to good mechanical condition , and another grand or two just for tires. FAST FRED | ||
| Jim (Jim_in_california)
Rating: N/A |
Fast Fred: no disagreements on the possibilities re: extra costs, and the tires comment is well taken. But I've got slack in the budget for such. You're also building your own vs. buying an existing project. In today's market the latter seems to be the route to a better value. | ||
| Mike (Busone)
Rating: N/A |
Who pissed in your cereal? Please tell us the name of your business so we all can avoid you nice attitude like the plague. | ||
| BusJunky Rating: N/A |
Just responding to a couple of your comments. first of all as for Niles your credentails speak for themselves HUD/FHA when I think of those two abbreviations in conjucntion with home builders I think welfare. so you keep building your walfare houses the US taxpayers sure do appreciate it. also Niles I dont see a pic of your so call H340 that you claim you own on your profile I wonder why that is. now moving on to Busone you dont have any pics of your bus on your profile either you and Niles must be in the same boat. oh and Busone it would not matter if you knew the name of my dealership anyway because it is highly unlikely that you could afford anything that I have for sale. last but not least Jim you misunderstood me when I said that the blueBird was a piece of junk, I meant that BluBird not all BlueBirds. That blueBird You are looking at is no way in any form or fashion a BlueBird Wonderlodge it is simply a homemade RV. I know this because I have sold several wonderlodges. | ||
| niles steckbauer (Niles500)
Rating: N/A |
Uh...Err... Bus Monkey - you still didn't post your credentials - you lousy piece of worthless flesh - Be sure to come and visit me in Fla - I'll be glad to take you and show you my bus ...... after I take you out back and beat your ever luvin ass - now shut the f*** up - Oh ... and have a nice day Niles | ||
| Jack Conrad (Jackconrad)
Rating: N/A |
BusJunkie, I have seen Niles Prevost when it was at Bussin' 2005. Along with about 189 other buses, including many that post regularly on this board. Yes, it is a beautiful bus. How about a photo of your bus? Jack | ||
| BusJunky Rating: N/A |
Niles,Niles,Niles know whos showing there ignorance? are you sure you dont build mobile homes for a living? because that kind of talk sounds kinda trailer parkish. you should not threaten people you know nothing about, didnt your father teach you anything? wanting to resort to violence over differnces of opinion shows your true ignorance.to Mr Conrad I appreciate your input and your interest in my personal possessions,but you assume to much at no time on this or any thread did I make reference to having a coach outside of the inventory that I have for sale. you should pay more attention in the future. | ||
| artis Rating: N/A |
Just ignore him and he will go away.....no fun without a reply | ||
| Phil Dumpster Rating: N/A |
Please don't feed the trolls... | ||
| Phil Dumpster Rating: N/A |
Dear abuse@comcast.net, The customer who owned the lease on IP address 68.82.237.217 on Saturday, May 14, 2005 at 6:36pm Eastern Daylight Time has been posting inappropriate messages on the bulletin board system found at http://www.busnut.com/bbs. These messages include insults and personal attacts aimed at longtime users of this bulletin board. We respectfully ask that you take whatever steps are necessary to prevent this user from disrupting this bulletin board system in the future. Shall I send it? | ||
| Jim (Jim_in_california)
Rating: N/A |
Busjunky: I'm well aware of the difference between a factory Wanderlodge and a "Wanderclone" on the same basic chassis/body/suspension. It's about $15k, put one way. That said, a homebrew bus conversion on any frame type CAN be good, or it CAN massively suck wind. Trust me, if I get indications that this one sucks, I'm walking. (Actually I'm setting up a "Plan B" in North Texas, I can Greyhound to that if the Kansas critter ain't happenin'. But I see no reason to distrust it at this point and the damned thing has a taller interior clearance height than genuine Wanderlodges of that period though to at least 1982/1984 era - they run 6'3" max. One inch doesn't sound like much. Unless of course you're exactly 6'4" yourself...like I am (sigh). | ||
| Jim (Jim_in_california)
Rating: N/A |
Phil: no, I don't think so. If I understand "Busjunky's" point of view, he's simply anti-home-conversion...a member of the set that says "pro-built or it's total worthless crap". I mean...he hasn't said that *exactly* but he respects "real" Wanderlodges, seriously disrespects "Wanderclones" built on the flat-nose All American chassis. So...what would he think of a homebrewed...I dunno, Buffalo, MCI9, take your pick? Does anybody else here have a similar generalized opinion of ALL home-brewed conversions? | ||
| FAST FRED Rating: N/A |
"Does anybody else here have a similar generalized opinion of ALL home-brewed conversions?" Everyone learns by experience, the backyard guy or the factory. The 10th conversion is gona be "better" from EITHER. Of course "better " to the factory may only mean cheaper & quicker to build . Better to the backyard guy will mean Better for HIS SERVICE , as some great Ideas dont work as well in reality as the contemplation. An example would be a bathtub , seen in first timers conversions , but seldom after that. FAST FRED | ||
| Jim (Jim_in_california)
Rating: N/A |
Heh. Well no bathtub in this thing. But if that was the ONLY significant mistake in a homebrewed bus I was considering, I wouldn't think it was a disaster. The single biggest "homebrewer's mistake" hasn't been made with this Bluebird. That's where a guy gets a bus, rips the seats out and immediately starts filling in his stuff with no thought to the insulation, frame condition, it's got way too many windows, sometimes even flooring is funky under the carpets. The second biggest involves electrical. And thanks to my own prior experience and notes from this board, I think I know how to look at that. | ||
| Jim (Jim_in_california)
Rating: N/A |
As a follow-up, here's what I EMailed the guy today after a LOT of thought...hated to do it but there's just too many unknowns: ------------ Tim, I've been racking my brain on this and...basically...I can't afford to take the risks necessary to buy your bus. OK. Here's your situation. You don't know the following: 1) Engine - yeah, it's a Cummins 6BT-something but which variant and at which horsepower? Was it originally an intercooled turbo and now has the intercooler removed because it didn't fit the engine bay? That seems to be a possibility given where the turbo unit is. If so, were the injectors swapped and/or the motor re-tuned for the non-intercooled setup? Has the engine been hurt running it in a funky configuration? 2) Tranny - again, a mystery item. 3) Gear ratios. ANOTHER mystery. Which could be solved via the... 4) Tach never installed. It's not any one issue here that's the problem, it's the *combination* that's nasty as hell. You have no idea whether or not it's been over-revved ever since the Cummins was dropped in. The water pipes with the garden hose valves are not just weird, they're telling me whoever installed this stuff was a moron and maybe the kind of moron who would produce an over-revved, incorrectly tuned combination. (Tuned right and with the right gears through a lockup-in-high-gear tranny like the MT643, you should be getting 10mpg or better.) Sigh. I cannot recommend strongly enough that before you do sell it to somebody else, you take it to a truck repair shop that deals with Cummins motors. Find out the engine's model code and stated horsepower rating and whether or not it's supposed to be intercooled, find out the tranny type and number and find out the gear ratio. And THEN throw a tach on, which will tell you the bus' true maximum speed based on what I suspect is your redline (2600? - that's another thing to confirm). You may end up having to tell people the thing is limited to 62mph unless they take the 5.36 rear end and swap for 4.10s or whatever. You'll still be able to get $12k+ out of it, it's worth that. But it's not worth it to me to head all the way to Kansas not knowing what the heck I'm dealing with. Sigh. |
