| Author | Message | ||
| OOPS Rating: N/A |
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| James Maxwell (Jmaxwell)
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OOPS: And all this about what? | ||
| OOPS again Rating: N/A |
There have been a number of inquiries regarding Sam Walker and Walker Coach Thought some facts would be helpful in answering those inquiries factualy | ||
| Buswarrior (Buswarrior)
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Oops, we need a log-in to access that site | ||
| Sean Welsh (Sean)
Rating: N/A |
Oops, Lexis is a (very expensive) pay-for-use site. No doubt the computer you are using is subscribed to the service and has a cookie for it. None of the rest of us can access the content via the links you are posting. Perhaps you can summarize the results for us here, or cut-and-paste however much of the relevant sections Lexis/Nexis will allow you to based on their terms of use. -Sean | ||
| OOPS Rating: N/A |
Does any one have Ian's email address and I'll send it to him and he can post it | ||
| OOPS Rating: N/A |
Never mind I have sent it by email to the bossnut | ||
| Jack Gregg (Jackinkc)
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If you log on with your registered name you can edit your own posting! | ||
| James Maxwell (Jmaxwell)
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Sean: Precisely. My wife was a registered user until abt. 5 yrs. ago and the monthly bills were astronomical then. Nevertheless, since it had to do with Sam Walker, most of us probably don't want to hear it anyway and more than likely would not believe it if we did. Enough has been said concerning him to convince any rational person that it can't all be lies. | ||
| Ian Giffin (Admin)
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| Jim (Jim_in_california)
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For those of us not bankruptcy lawyers, what do these documents mean? | ||
| captain ron (Captain_ron)
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Jim, you'll know soon enough when you get the same letter from the state of california's attourney telling you they went bankrupt.  | ||
| John that newguy Rating: N/A |
It appears that in past years, Walker filed for bankruptcy and then possibly changed his mind about actually going through with it. Notice his attorney filed the document(s) in 1996, 2002 and 2003.... and each carries the "status: dismissed". The reason for the filings to have been dismissed can be due to the filer's request, or failure to file a plan for reorganization... or numerous other reasons. http://www.wiw.uscourts.gov/bankruptcy/ch11info.htm "WHAT IS CHAPTER 11 BANKRUPTCY? Chapter 11 is typically used for business bankruptcies and restructuring. It is not commonly used by individual consumers since it is far more complex and expensive to pursue. It allows businesses to reorganize themselves, giving them an opportunity to restructure debt and get out from under certain burdensome leases and contracts. Typically a business is allowed to continue to operate while it is in Chapter 11, although it does so under the supervision of the Bankruptcy Court and its appointees. WHAT IS CHAPTER 13 BANKRUPTCY? Chapter 13 Bankruptcy is also known as a reorganization bankruptcy. Chapter13 bankruptcy is filed by individuals who want to pay off their debts over a period of three to five years. This type of bankruptcy appeals to individuals who have non-exempt property that they want to keep. It is also only an option for individuals who have predictable income and whose income is sufficient to pay their reasonable expenses with some amount left over to pay off their debts." I wouldn't assume any foul play by Walker. He didn't go "belly-up"; He never went "bankrupt"; he's still in business, and apparently he's still paying his debts.... | ||
| OOPS Rating: N/A |
Walker Coach did in fact go 'belly up' (chapter 7 liquidation in 1996) (see who was pres. etc.) and it is reasonable to assume that Mr. Walker has had Bankruptcy problems in Pennsylvania (his current den of iniquity) since at least 2001 and 2003 A person/company who has filed for liquidation with over $1.7 MIL in liabilities and NO assets is commonly referred to as someone who is 'runnin on deposits'. The mere fact that a petitioner has NO assets shows that a scam is evident. If you look at Sam's current site he misrepresents his inventory, location, etc. If you are a legitimate business and going 'out of business' you still have some assets to throw into the pot. He had ZERO, NADA, SQUAT. Sounds legite to who? He never owned ANYTHING. Have you ever heard of a PONZI SCHEME? I can provide you the 'FACTS' concerning Mr. Walker, but it is up to you to decieve yourselves. You know the story about the horse and the water right? Go ahead, give him your money,and make his day. My conscience is clear. Let Mr. Walker respond. I'm sure Ian will give him adequate room to answer the assertions contained within this post. OOPS I did it again | ||
| Jim (Jim_in_california)
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All I know is, there are more complaints regarding that guy than any other conversion shop...hell, than *anybody* in the bus biz. | ||
| FAST FRED Rating: N/A |
"Have you ever heard of a PONZI SCHEME?" Sure, its called "Social Security"! And the scheme promoter has guns to force you in!! FAST FRED | ||
| John that newguy Rating: N/A |
I don't see any "liquidation" in '96 in any references on this page. The fact that there are "assets available for distribution" (or not), means little to a customer and more to a creditor. I personally know nothing about the quality of Walker's work, but from the original poster's comments, I would feel safe to assume there was satisfaction with the quality of Walker's work. The fact that he doesn't keep to a schedule, is a management problem. The fact he can't seem to keep his books straight and has trouble collecting his debts, is a bookkeeping and a management problem. I'm not sticking up for Walker; I know nothing about him, his work, or his credentials. But to post on a public forum, information based on partial knowledge or heresy, is libelous. Walker would have good reason to attempt to take action against what can be doing irreparable financial harm to his business. The notation: "This Data For Informational Purposes Only" does not mean it was intended to be posted in/on a public forum to be used as a hammer to destroy a business already floundering. I'd be a bit cautious before continuing the pseudo-legal rhetoric, and stick to comments regarding Walker's quality of workmanship or the timely fashion he may have neglected to do his work in... (right, Niles?) | ||
| David Hartley (Drdave)
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The question now is who was this Oops character? Please note that all civil and personal court filings are Public information and readily available by search by anyone from anywhere. Bankruptcies are Federal and all can be searched Free of charge or by subscription to a low cost access service as are any action,complaint or civil suits. Local city,state and regional legal records are usually available through the local clerk of the circuit courts websites or public accessable in person at the clerks office or even library. So be careful what you present publically, It could be your own personal nightmare. I wouldn't be surprised if the Oops person were someone connected with the subject and fishing for excuses to litigate. | ||
| Don/TX
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You are right there David, I recently went to the court and went thru all the records of an acquaintance who declared bankruptcy, yet kept his BUS, cars, lots of valuable stuff. After going thru the records, it was simple, he just did not declare them, and slid right on thru the sorry system! I am puzzling over why Walker would file and then it be dismissed. Must be some sort of ploy to keep creditors from claiming his property (then dismiss it when they go away)? Gotta be a reason in there somewhere, anybody close to the court want to go take a look? | ||
| David Hartley (Drdave)
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A case can be dismissed for failure to comply with the paperwork rules, Time delays and many other unseen reasons. I would guess that is what happened. Do a quicky filing, Fudge on the paperwork and 3 months later it gets thrown out but that 3 months breather is sans creditors and collection agencies. Sell everything and run while they aren't looking..Nice trick... The other guy, He may not have declared the extra stuff or had it in someone elses name. Seen that happen and the rules say they want past 1 to 2 years records, However some slickies can get stuff through anyway. It used to be that in Florida if you declared bankruptcy the feds pulled all of your motorvehicle title records and if you hadn't listed them the agent for the court would/could make some serious charges for lying to the feds. The fact is, The less money you have the harsher the feds are on you. If you are rich and just trying to avoid creditors you could get away just about scott free. The new laws are supposed to make that harder to do but the lawyers will find a way around them as usual but only for the rich.... | ||
| John that newguy Rating: N/A |
David- "but that 3 months breather is sans creditors and collection agencies. Sell everything and run while they aren't looking..Nice trick" As long as we're all airing our opinions... When you file for bankruptcy, your creditors beat a fast path to your door to grab whatever they can before the court decides to grant you your right to claim bankruptcy. It can be hazardous to your economic health, especially if you really want to remain in business and are trying to negotiate with your creditors... yeah, it puts a flame under their bush, but it's a risky move and never recommended as an "easy fix". Walker has remained in business and is apparently paying his creditors and employees. Why don't we stick to knocking Walker's inability to do a good quality job? Or are there no complaints about Walker's workmanship? If not..... Why the BS regarding his financial problems? Did you stop flying when the airline filed chapter 13, or stop shopping at KMart? | ||
| David Hartley (Drdave)
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Creditors are "Stayed" immediately from colletion efforts upon filing the papers. They are notified and allowed to submit their claims. I don't want to argue about this anymore. Otherwise if the creditors were able to run in and take stuff Boeing would be taking back their planes, But they can't because they are "stayed" upon the filing. That's all I am going to say about the subject. Right or wrong, I don't really care, Life is too short. | ||
| John that newguy Rating: N/A |
Good points, Dave. And yeah, life is short. For the avid reader of legal mumbo-jumbo: http://www.alperlaw.com/chapter_13.html http://www.moranlaw.net/stayrelief.htm | ||
| OOPS Rating: N/A |
Sorry to post and leave the country. I'm back. Jtng: Below are cases filed, in Desoto county only, prior to the first BK, where Walker or Walker Coach offers a hint of Bankruptcy. Whenever a defendant hints of Bankruptcy in any civil action, that action and any and all other pre-judgement actions pending in all cases are stayed until released from the Bankruptcy Court. A defendant does not have to actually have filed for Bankruptcy to invoke the stay, but there is a responsibility put on the defendant to file or attempt to file within a reasonable time. There is however, no requirement to pursue the case, and once any creditor or Plaintiff finds out that the defendant has declared $0.00 (zero) assets, there is no reason for them to pursue any action against the defendant, much less Bankruptcy, as there is zero chance of them obtaining a judgement which is leviable. It's called being JUDGEMENT PROOF and will kill a lawsuit straight away as the usual reason for the lawsuit is to recover damages or property. You are also a little misinformed about the differences between chapter 7,11,13 Bk's. You MAY file in any of the 3 chapters but will either be dismissed or changed to the proper one by your motion or on the motion or finding of the court. Mr. Walker may well have initially filed under chapter 11, reorganization, but it is his responsibility to reorganize himself or his company, not the courts or his creditors. The person filing chapter 11 must assemble a reorganization plan and get it accepted by a certain percentage of their creditors, then bring it to the court for its approval. Would you bother negotiating reorganization with a company with multiple pending lawsuits, over 1.7 mil in declared debt, and NO ASSETS? And buses undergoing conversion, such as the Grigsby's, ARE assets, and I'm sure that little tidbit is of great interest to them. Chapter 13 is commonly refered to as the CRAM DOWN, where a petitioner has an income or ability to pay something, not the case with Walker. Most 13 filings include dropping loan amounts and payoffs by getting property appraised for less than the payoff and getting the court to cancel all interest if regular payments can be scheduled or the accepting of a cash settlement as payment in full. Chapter 7 is liquidation and usually only allows for the retention of $2000.00 of non-exempt assets. Petitions filed under the other chapters can be forced into Chapter 7 if they cannot meet the requirements contained within those chapters. BELLY UP is not a legal term and Walker may not have completed his Bankrupcty action, but he did go BELLY UP. More than likely he failed to pay his attorney, who probably then withdrew, and after a period of time the court summarily 'dismissed' the case in order to clear the docket. Evidently Sam couldn't even COMPLETE his Bankruptcy. All the info I have posted is Public Records info, although I do have other information which I shall retain, and there a is more, much more. I hope the above is sufficient for your needs, if not, you are more than welcome to travel to the courts mentioned and ask the clerk to revue all the records. I already have enough information for myself. One last thing, the TRUTH is 100% defense against any action for libel. http://www.desotoclerk.com/dpa/cvweb2.asp?ucase_id=61236347 http://www.desotoclerk.com/dpa/cvweb2.asp?ucase_id=98268964 http://www.desotoclerk.com/dpa/cvweb2.asp?ucase_id=59263034 http://www.desotoclerk.com/dpa/cvweb2.asp?ucase_id=38335693 http://www.desotoclerk.com/dpa/cvweb2.asp?ucase_id=90984320 http://www.desotoclerk.com/dpa/cvweb2.asp?ucase_id=88495184 http://www.desotoclerk.com/dpa/cvweb2.asp?ucase_id=34889740 http://www.desotoclerk.com/dpa/cvweb2.asp?ucase_id=19563812 http://www.desotoclerk.com/dpa/cvweb2.asp?ucase_id=2474618 http://www.desotoclerk.com/dpa/cvweb2.asp?ucase_id=43620500 http://www.desotoclerk.com/dpa/cvweb2.asp?ucase_id=19090595 http://www.desotoclerk.com/dpa/cvweb2.asp?ucase_id=4226989 http://www.desotoclerk.com/dpa/cvweb2.asp?ucase_id=62586019 http://www.desotoclerk.com/dpa/cvweb2.asp?ucase_id=58834092 http://www.desotoclerk.com/dpa/cvweb2.asp?ucase_id=32454794 | ||
| John that newguy Rating: N/A |
Well "oops"... My pal "hinted" in court of impending bankruptcy in Massachusetts, and was swamped with demands for payment and court appearances. He filed for bankruptcy and even though the "stay" was then published, some of his creditors got waivers quickly and took what they could. A truck garage in Brattleboro, VT ruined my Winnebago engine. They had filed for bankruptcy just prior to the damage. The VT attorney I hired to seek a waiver, did so and forced the garage to pay. When a company files bankruptcy, it does not limit all claims against them. Been there; done that. And yeah, $12k plus attorney fees in my favor. I don't know what Walker's problems are, nor do I care. I'm not trying to give him support, nor trying to tear him down. I have not thus far, read anything declaring his workmanship and quality of product to be inferior. I have not read anything regarding him taking a customer's money and not producing the work product in return. Why would Mr. Walker's financial difficulties be of concern to anyone seeking Mr. Walker's product? I asked earlier, if you stopped shopping at KMart when they filed bankruptcy, or stopped flying on any airline that may have filed..? Companies file for bankruptcy as part of a reorganization plan. If you are a creditor, you may reason to worry. Why should a customer care? The bottom line Mr. Oops... If Walker is trying to reorganize to keep his business afloat and his customers satisfied, why broadcast his financial woes as reason to avoid doing business with him? Why push him into the ground? The original posting was regarding a bus nut's's plight with trying to get his bus finished. Helping dig Walker Coach's grave will be more problematic to our bus nut friend, not be of help. That's my opinion. | ||
| Jim Stewart (H3jim)
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JTNG While shopping at Kmart, they do not ask for a large deposit, say 50%, and then promise to have the goods for you in 6 months. Buying something from a bus converter, especially when you advance $, their financial condition is an important consideration. If they are not solvent, they can't really make good on their promises, and it greatly increases the risk of doing business with them. If you own a coach or even any parts that are in his shop, and the creditors come to lock down the place, you have to be there and bring proof that the aformentioned items are yours, otherwise they are liable to be included in business assets and disposed of. Worse, if yo dont have title, but you have paid large sums, now you are just in line with everyone else. I don[t really relish the idea ofhiring an attorney to get a $12k judgement in my favor that I now have to figure out how to collect. Better to just avoid it all in the first place, and do business with someone who is financially sound and ethically beyond reproach. I don't enjoy lawsuits, almost everyone loses. Typically a bus nut's bus is one off the largest assets he /she owns outside of their home. I for one cannot afford to take such undue risks. I had talked early on in my search and seriously considered going back to talk to Sam and give him money. I read of the Grigsby's and say to myself, there but for the Grace of God go I. Further, I like to do business with businesses that I can form relationships with, and I know that 5 years from now, I can still go and get advice and parts. Probably not with Walker. I believe that a company's finances, especailly a bus converter, are highly important to the decision whether or not to use them. While I prefer to be nice, and build up things and people rather than tear them down, its teh fools that handle these kind of investments without full knowledge. By suggesting that its bad to share this 'cause if people know, that they will not do business - shouldn't we let each individual decide that for themselves? Fully informed and all that. If you want to help Sam, write him a check. Thank you OOPS for posting the information. People do need to know, in my opinion. Sharing information of all kinds that help us Nuts is what this forum is all about. |