| Author | Message | ||
| jjrsmp12 Rating: N/A |
All, 1980 Eagle Model 10. I sent Ian the pics of my alternator and am having him post it here. I though it was a generator until I saw the pics from the manual. It has F1 and F2 terminals labeled, and pos/neg large wires to the battery. Only getting 12.1V at thos terminals at 1000RPM. Voltage regulator only shows 1.5V? I may need to remeasure that. Any ideas? Thanks | ||
| jjrsmp12 Rating: N/A |
Trying to post image  | ||
| jjrsmp12 Rating: N/A |
Post 2:  | ||
| jjrsmp12 Rating: N/A |
The only number I see is 0131056...092. Also, short way of troubleshooting regulator would help Thanks in advance.. | ||
| TWODOGS (Twodogs)
Rating: N/A |
yep..it's an alt...with one belt missing,look in the phone book & find a place that builds & rebuilds alternators,have them run the test. | ||
| jjrsmp12 Rating: N/A |
Would the missing belt cause a voltage issue? I've got a spare belt. Tried to loosen the support bar, but alternator would not drop. Do I need to loosten the 2 large nuts attaching alt to frame? | ||
| jjrsmp12 Rating: N/A |
By the way, I disconnected the wires from the alt to the voltage regulator to see if regulator was an issue, and I still got 12.1V at altrnator at 1000RPM. | ||
| dickegler Rating: N/A |
It's a delco 50DN air cooled easiest is to remove it and regulator and taqke it to an alternator shop hth dickegler | ||
| jjrsmp12 Rating: N/A |
Yes that does help. How old do you think it is? I thought Niehoff was the factory alt? | ||
| Sammy
Rating: N/A |
Check the condition of the batterys FIRST.Isolate each battery from each other.Confirm that each battery is in a good state of charge before troubleshooting any electrical system. This would include: voltage readings,load testing,specific gravity tests.Check all cable connections including the "grounds" while performing these tests. | ||
| jjrsmp12 Rating: N/A |
Actually, I disconnected the wires from the alternator to the battery, and I have ZERO volts from the alternator. The 12.1V I previously read was from the battery charger I keep hooked up to the starter batteries. Do alternators just crap out like that all at once? | ||
| Sammy
Rating: N/A |
Alternators do not always just crap out all the time.Sometimes it's a regulator. Sometimes it's in the wiring from regulator to alternator.Don't buy anything until you check the system with fully charged batterys. You gotta charge and test your batterys first. Does your Eagle have the 2 battery cut off switches in battery compartment? I've found poor connections and bad switches on the Model 15's that I worked on. | ||
| gusc Rating: N/A |
Alternators should never be operated with no load, don't disconnect the battery lead with the alt turning. | ||
| Jtng Rating: N/A |
Judging by the rust on that connection, I'd personally try cleaning that first, before spending my $$$. | ||
| TWODOGS (Twodogs)
Rating: N/A |
TAKE THE BUS TO A ALTERNATOR SHOP...do not disconect things & run the bus...you are going to screw-up more than you fix | ||
| jjrsmp12 Rating: N/A |
Took batteries to local auto parts store for complete test and all were fine. I'll clean the terminals and check connections, then if I need to, I'll take to alternator shop. That bastard looks heavy,,,, | ||
| jjrsmp12 Rating: N/A |
Cleaned all cables and verified connections. Still no juice. I removed alternator last night and am taking to alternator shop today. Will keep you posted. Thanks | ||
| Richard Bowyer (Drivingmisslazy)
Rating: N/A |
An easy way to test most alternators is to remove the lead from the regulator to the alternator. With the engine running, use a jumper to apply battery voltage to the alternator terminal that the voltage regulator lead was removed from. At that time the alternator should be putting out maximum voltage. Probably in the 16-18 volt range. This will not hurt anything. Just do not leave it connected for very long. If you now have output voltage, then the alternator is OK and the regulator is bad. If no output voltage, then the alternator is bad. Richard | ||
| jjrsmp12 Rating: N/A |
Well, took alternator to shop. Checked out good. Looks like regulator possibly. What should voltage be on regulator? | ||
| Richard Bowyer (Drivingmisslazy)
Rating: N/A |
On all alternators that I am familiar with on a 12 volt vehicle there will be a 12 volt input/sensing voltage and an output voltage that will vary from 3-4 volts up to a maximum of 12 volts to obtain maximum output. It generally runs in the 6-8 volt range. As I indicated on my earlier post, take a known source of 12 volts and jumper it to the alternator input. The output should be 16-18 volts. That will not harm anything. Just do not leave it connected for more than a few seconds. It this test provides the output voltage specified, then you have either a bad regulator or the input voltage is missing. You might find that after jumping the 12 volts to the alternator that it will keep generating after you remove the jumper. This is called "flashing the field" and restores the magnetism to the field that is required to make the unit generate initially. After reconnecting the output lead, you might try jumping 12 volts to the regulator input. If no output, then you definitely have a bad regulator. Richard | ||
| Tom Caffrey (Pvcces)
Rating: N/A |
Richard, I know that residual magnetism plays a critical role in the operation of the old style car generator, but does it have any effect in these bus alternators that are called generators? Since I don't know how the brushless design actually works, I suppose that it could play a role. If that's the case, why is there a circuit to maintain a minimum charge rate? Why do modern regulators contain "keep alive circuits" so that other electric sircuits like a tachometer will work properly? We have some big alternators on our boat that have weak permanent magnets that are used to start them, but I thought that this was the exception, rather than the rule. Just curious. Tom Caffrey PD4106-2576 Suncather | ||
| Richard Bowyer (Drivingmisslazy)
Rating: N/A |
Most of the newer regulators on alternators have a source of DC supplied from the battery and they will start charging immediately since the excitation voltage is present. On my original alternator, it had to be putting out some voltage before it would start charging. I rewired so that 12 volts was present when I turned the ignition switch on and that solved the problems. Even AC alternators need the residual magnetism to get them started generating the first time. Generally happens when you take one apart and they sometimes loose their residual magnetism. BTW, the AC alternators and DC alternators are somewhat different in construction. The AC alternator has a separate exciter alternator that is a revolving armature design. DC excitation from the voltage regulator is applied to the stationary field which excites the armature which outputs AC voltage. This voltage is rectified by the revolving diodes to DC and connected to the revolving field. The field then excites the armature windings to generate the output AC voltage. The DC alternator does not have the additional exciter alternator. The DC control voltage from the regulator is fed directly to the revolving field thru a set of slip rings. This voltage on the field excites the stationary armature windings and creates an AC output voltage. This voltage is then rectified by the set of output diodes to charge the batteries. Probably more than you wanted to know, but so many people do not understand the operation of AC and DC alternators and generators that I thought I would take a few minutes to try and explain a little bit of the theory of operation. Richard | ||
| jjrsmp12 Rating: N/A |
Well, turns out it was a bad Voltage Regulator relay. Popped a spare in and whola, 13.8 volts. Thanks for all the help, it is appreciated. | ||
| John Harrelson (Jharl)
Rating: N/A |
i had simular issue when I got my 64 eagle in san diago. I flipped off the bat switch and the bus shut down. I started it agein and the bat was getting no voltage. I went to a delco shop and it turend out to be a shor in the diode pace in the air inlet above the alternator area. The sand blated clear coated it and put in new cable and removethe 40 year old crap. the buc charged great after that. I think that thchargin system on these eagle are rugged. I would lookup in the diode pack. if you do take things out to be tested take all of the componats in one visit saves time I did 3 trips and it cost me four dollard and fifty cents for the wire I would have pade a lot more. obte thode alternator are real expensive. | ||
| gusc Rating: N/A |
My understanding of alternators is that there is no residual magnetism since there are no magnets. All the field exication is by the wire coil in the field. The up side of this is that they can generate at low rpm and the high generated current flows directly from the stator windings instead of through brushes as in generators. | ||
| Richard Bowyer (Drivingmisslazy)
Rating: N/A |
There are several types of alternators other than those utilized in automotive applications. Some actually have permanent magnets installed and others are self excited with no external voltage regulator. http://www.georator.com/prod_perm_magnet.htm Richard |