| Author |
Message |
Jerry Wilson
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, August 14, 2005 - 10:10 pm: | |
Hi, Everyone
This is my first post on this forum, but I've been reading "Listening" for about a year now. I used this forum to get info for buying a bus, which we did in Feb 2005.
We now own a 1966 4107 which we are converting to a motor coach. We are about half done and it is usable. We have had it on the road about 3 times. The bus drives great and all I've had to do is neglected "small" maintenance items.
The question is: are the air brakes on this bus with DD3 brake chambers able to, or can they lock up the rear wheels in an emergency stop? Mine will not. All brake chambers are working; no noticeable grease or oil on brake linings. I've checked the brake lining; it's ok. Adjusted stack adjusters; no air leaks except slight leak at application valve when you first push the pedal. No leaks at any other air valves or hoses. I have not had the drums off yet, but that is coming.
A collective brain storm will help steer me in the right direction. Are there any characteristics of this design that would cause ineffective braking in an emergency situation?
Thanks to all.
Jerry Wilson 4107-071 |
Don/TX
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, August 14, 2005 - 10:25 pm: | |
Do you mean by "emergency stop" floorboarding fhe treadle valve, or doing the push-pull thing? I have never driven one that would lock the brakes with treadle pressure.
I finally found out on mine that the rear wheel bearings were badly out of adjustment. This lets the drum tilt, adjusters "seem" right, but much brake action is merely moving the angle of the drums. The 4107 did not come with wheel bearings that were greased by the differential oil, they were to be removed and packed periodically with grease, and adjusted, a nasty task that is often put off. Yours may have been converted over to oil bath bearings, maybe it is still original. There can be many other things as well to cause poor braking. |
Larry
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, August 14, 2005 - 10:53 pm: | |
http://www.community.gov.yk.ca/pdf/airbrake_manual_english.pdf |
John MC9
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, August 14, 2005 - 11:56 pm: | |
Although I've never driven a bus in a manner where I had to
"lock the brakes", I do remember testing how the bus operated
and found that I could not lock the brakes and slide the rear
wheels on dry pavement.
That is an excellent condition, since loosing traction caused by the
locking of the rear wheels, would be disastrous in any scenario.
There is absolutely nothing worse than a rear axle skid. A harsh
down-gear on an icy surface, is something you'll do only once.
And you will remember it well.
If you drive your conversion like you have no brakes, you'll
be driving it like a professional bus driver, and you won't
have any problems at all..
You're driving an 11 ton vehicle; Respect it.
(an opinion) |
Roy Strickland
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, August 15, 2005 - 1:55 am: | |
Well, I'm VERY VERY amateur, but the 1978 GMC RTS II I bought the other day will dang sure lock up some of the tires... I think it was the front though. (And to prove I'm an amatuer, won't it be funny if someone comes back and says it should (on the front)... If that is indeed the case, I completely apologize)
I took my friend and his family for a ride this morning (it broke down with all of us in it... see the thread a couple before this one) and when we got just around the corner from his house, I was slowing for another corner (doing about 5 mph or so) and he asks "do the brakes work good"? I couldn't resist, I didn't even give it full pedal and some tires locked but I IMMEDIATELY released the pedal. I myself was pretty impressed, but this doesn't say much about EMERGENCY BRAKING. Just wanted to share my experience.
RS |
dougtheboneifiedbusnut
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, August 15, 2005 - 7:58 pm: | |
This topic raises it's ugly head from time to time, but in fact, that's a good thing.
Having been a heavy truck operator for 20+ years and also holding an A+P certificate I am more than casually familiar with air brake systems.I feel that anyone who operates a vehical with such a system should make it his or her obligation to become as knowledgeable about the system installed on their coach as possible, for their own safety,but nmore importantly, the safety of others.
I have on dry pavement locked up the trailer wheels while hauling 10k gallons of gasoline.
If all of the working components of your air brake system are in good working order your coach will stop, and stop in a hurry.
Air brake systems are desighned to send the greatest pressure to the rear wheels first and than at slightly less pressure to the axles forward of the rear axle til you get to the front axle for reasons that should be obvious.
So... If your front axle is locking up before any rear axle,you have a problem.Usually it's just a minor mechanical misadjustment, but sometimes broken parts which obviously will require attention now!
I've adjusted a whole bunch of brakes in my time both in the shop and on the road. I will be happy to share my experience with anyone who wants it. |
David Hartley (Drdave)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, August 15, 2005 - 8:00 pm: | |
An RTS with no extra weight on the front end will lock up the front tires. More so on wet roads and those icy wide white paint stripes at crosswalks and traffic stop lines.
I found that out the hard way with a load of passengers one night coming out of a hotel at disney when the front end jumped and chattered into a side slide on a painted crosswalk. Scared me and didn't do the passengers any good either.
Of the 20 or so RTS's that I drove weekly they all exhibited the same tendancy slide and lock up the front brakes. My own RTS did it to me a couple of times when I tried to stop too quickly and it wasn't a good feeling. Later on I found that my FLX 870 would do the same thing as I flew through a fast red light and slid to a stop in the middle of a 4 lane intersection.
Just be careful and carry plenty of clean shorts... |
Jerry Wilson
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, August 15, 2005 - 8:18 pm: | |
I am an experienced school bus driver in a conventional bus with hydraulic brakes. I have no previous experience with air brakes. Had a car pull out and suddenly stop and had to apply full brakes and steer to the largest hole. Fortunately, we missed all mailboxes & trees and we sustained no damage.
Under normal conditions the bus stops fine, but when called upon to stop suddenly, it slowed no sooner than when making a normal stop. As a school bus driver I had to make some emergency stops (thankfully,with no accidents). I know I need to gain some experience with air brakes, but surely the bus should've stopped sooner than it did???
I'm asking for technical advice on what to look for in regard to the lack of stopping power.
I appreciate all the comments you've given so far.
Thanks,
Jerry Wilson 4107-071 |
John MC9
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, August 15, 2005 - 9:03 pm: | |
Doug-
The very last thing you'd want, is the drive axle to lock and skid.
Skidding front wheels can be dealt with and controlled. Skidding
the rear wheels will put the entire rig in jeopardy and likely
out of your control.
It was demonstrated at a CDL training session, with a model
truck and a large rubber band. When the front wheels were
kept from turning and the truck tossed across the table, it
went in a fairly straight line. When the rears were kept from
turning, the truck spun around several times before flipping
over. Try that at home with your kid's toy vehicle.
I've only driven Brockway, Mack, and Oshkosh, for trucks,
but you could lock the fronts on ice, snow or rain, long before
the rears. Every bus I've ever driven, reacted the same (unless
using a very low gear or a retarder and you are well advised
to not use the Jake or retarder on slippery surfaces..)
I very seriously doubt any manufacturer would design a vehicle
to force the rears to lock before the front will. |
Paul Ghelli (57shadowdog)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, August 15, 2005 - 10:17 pm: | |
my 01 eagle takes for every to stop.
i drive an 86 peterbilt ever day 1.8 million miles to dated. it will stop in short space.
If pressed it will lock all the tires. But the bus takes two football fields. all brakes looks good. adjusted good. no air leaks. WHY !! |
Tim Jones (Torquester)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, August 15, 2005 - 11:03 pm: | |
The air pressure that is sent to each axle from the foot valve is the same. This means that every brake can on every axle will receive full system pressure with a full foot valve application. This is true for almost every vehicle on the road that that was produced within about the last thirty years. There are still some vehicles on the road that used a limiting valve which reduced pressure to the front axle to help prevent lock-up.
There is a slight time delay during the initial application which applies the rear axle before the front. This delay is accomplished by using different crack pressures in the relay or quick release valves.
So...you say..."my front brakes are 15" diameter and 4" wide and my rears are 16" diameter and 7" wide. If I send the same pressure to both why wouldn't the front lock first?" The answer is the size of the can and the length of the slack adjuster. The larger the area of the can, the more force is applied to the push rod. The longer the length of the slack adjuster arm the greater the mechanical advantge is for converting the lateral force of the push rod to torque which is applied to the s-cam. All of this mumbo-jumbo is engineered into the system to create a balanced system which has the rear axle doing the most work.
Now, to answer your question.....You had damb well better be able to lock up your brakes. If you can't, you have a problem and your bus is not stopping as well as it could.
hth, Tq |
Doug McCartney
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, August 15, 2005 - 11:15 pm: | |
Jerry,
It is not difficult to test the braking performance. To meet federal requirement for a bus it must meet the following stopping distance requirements. (CFR Title 49 393.52)
Service brakes:
At 20 mph to be able to stop in 35 feet
Emergency brakes:
At 20 mph to be able to stop in 85 feet
We have lines in our lot marked at 35 feet and 85 feet. In our transit fleet, at each service we test the brakes by driving 20 mph and making a panic stop. Then make another 20 mph stop using the parking brake. A good brake system will have no problem meeting these stopping distances.
If you have a RTS you may not meet the emergency brake requirements. Their cheesy driveline brakes have difficulty meeting these requirements and are considered a "parking brake" and not an "emergency brake". There is a loophole in the requirement that allows transit busses not meet the requirement. The same loophole allows RTS's to have a “parking brake" valve that does not set the brakes for low air conditions.
Doug |
ljensen
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, August 15, 2005 - 11:34 pm: | |
There are two different types of brake blocks (pads on the shoes ) soft ones for busses and hard ones for trucks if you use the wrong one you will get chader and a longer stopping distance |
mel 4104
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, August 16, 2005 - 10:56 am: | |
the condition of the brake components effect the brakes also . if you have bent or bowed drake shoes, woren brake pads,wring size rollers, flat spots on the s cams, the wrong type of brake pads as to hardness of the fiber or the wrong brake drums. rember that buses do not use the same brake drums that trucks use. a lot ofbuses have had the truck drums put on as they are easy to find as compared to the bus ones. also check fo uneven wear on the drums as they can become tapered due to bad sloppy shoes. as the drums have to get rid of the heat built up in the during braking to work. |
john w. roan (Chessie4905)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, August 16, 2005 - 6:56 pm: | |
Sometimes rear brakes get grease or oil soaked into them from a past oil seal leak and aren't thoroughly cleaned or replaced; as above...new lining and worn drums or cut drums without matching oversize lining, worn camshaft bushings allowing insufficient stroke of cams, worn axle spindle allowing drum to shift when brakes are applied; too hard or low coeficient of friction on lining; mis-adjusted brakes or incorrect slack adjuster to push rod angle bad valves, not allowing proper pressure to chambers; corroded internals in brake chamber etc....Get a BENDIX air brake handbook or other...information is good to know and understand. If you don't want to do the work yourself, get someone like LUKE to check it out as he'll show you where your problems are. |
Jon W.
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, August 16, 2005 - 7:23 pm: | |
The brakes on my Prevost are like new, are self adjusting and have ABS.
With all that going for me (including supplemental braking on the toad) stopping my GCW of about 54,000 lbs takes a country mile.
We and the idiots in cars that pull in front of us always have to be aware we just can't stop as fast as most vehicles on the road.
The information provided here has been excellent and is absolutely correct. |
niles steckbauer (Niles500)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, August 16, 2005 - 7:29 pm: | |
Jon - How do you feel about the ABS ? - I can appreciate the anti-lock when the road is slick, but it sure feels like if I could turn the ABS off on dry pavement my stopping distance would improve tremendously - Niles |
Jon W.
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, August 17, 2005 - 7:50 am: | |
Niles,
I am not sure how I feel about this because I drove my first coach (non ABS) for years in the snow country of western NY. Feeling the tail begin to slide sideways was exciting to say the least.
I haven't had the occasion to engage the ABS on my current coach so I can't even say if it has any impact on braking distances.
I think the only way we could improve stopping distances is to reduce our weights. These coaches are heavy and short of increasing tire size and brake clamping force our braking performance seems dictated by the laws of physics.
BTW, if you want to run a test, do a measured stop with the ABS working, and then repeat the test with the power to the ABS control disabled. You will know if it has any impact. That won't help you with controlling it from the driver's seat but it will possibly demonstrate that ABS does not diminish braking performance. |
Craig (Ceieio)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, August 17, 2005 - 1:21 pm: | |
I watched a show where Emerson Fittapaldi tried to out brake the ABS system in a car. It was the same car used in back to back tests with multiple trials. He was barely able to out brake the ABS (by a couple of feet) and said that he believed that he was only able to do it because he was prepared for the test manuver.
Out on the road with a surprise situation he believed that the ABS was the right way to go for him.
I have done this manuver at a driving school at PIR (cars I admit) and it would be VERY difficult for me to come close to the ABS results. Perhaps with a great deal of practice.
I would assume that the bus ABS would be similar.
Craig - MC7 Oregon |
John MC9
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, August 17, 2005 - 2:27 pm: | |
Proper training and experience with any particular vehicle a
person drives without "ABS", would provide that certain
"edge" that can prevent an accident regardless what other
vehicle that person drives.
It's unfortunate, but new drivers that have experienced only
the "ABS" vehicle won't know what to do, if and when that
"ABS" system fails to operate as it was should.
Having a faulty "ABS" system fight your maneuvers is nothing
we would want to experience... There have been tales of that
happening. |
Jon W.
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, August 17, 2005 - 4:27 pm: | |
I may be wrong, but it is my understanding that a fault in the ABS system only disables the ABS system so it reverts back to a non-ABS system. John, please explain exactly what has failed on a braking system with a failed ABS.
My experience with ABS in the snow is that you stomp on the brake and hold full brake pressure to let the ABS system to regulate the brakes. The ABS system senses impending lock-up and pulses the bakes at that wheel to avoid lock-up.
That type of braking action is the exact opposite of what you do with a non ABS system. If you do not have ABS it is up to the driver to modulate brake pedal pressure to hold the wheels on the verge of lock-up, but not to allow lock-up to occur. I have 44 years of experience driving in snowy conditions and even though I have a high opinion of my driving skills I can never brake as consistently good as an ABS system.
I have never felt uncomfortable driving my original bus without ABS, but given the opportunity I would have preferred ABS.
Like everybody else I often feel frustrated that my coach takes as long to stop as it does. But I also have come to realize it is simply a matter of that much weight is going to take a lot of space to get stopped. I just wish the idiots that cut in too close when they pass would understand how much they are at risk if they cut in too close and then have to spike their brakes because a deer or something else suddenly appears in front of them. |
John MC9
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, August 17, 2005 - 5:13 pm: | |
Jon-
That was my point. If you have some experience driving without
it, you can have some control over your vehicle when it fails..
The idea of stomping on the brakes and keeping the pedal down
while "the computer" figures out how to save my ass, does not
work well in my digestive tract.
And the thought that people are relying on this method of
stopping on icy/rain slick/slippery surfaces scares the bojangles
out of me. These are the same idiots down here in Flor-a-duh
that fly up behind you at a light, in the pouring rain, feeling
safe and secure that their SUV's ABS system will manage to
stop them just prior to my spewing the morning's breakfast
down my right leg.
The more automated we become, the more careless we are.
Just an opinion, of course. |
Jon W.
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, August 18, 2005 - 3:17 pm: | |
John MC9, it sounds like we are both from the old school.
Despite my reluctance to change to new technology (I finally got a cell phone about 5 months ago) I took an immediate like to ABS living in snow country.
I considered myself an absolute driving pro if I could brake my car to a stop on ice or slippery snow if I did not engage the ABS, but if I added one more gram of foot pressure on the brake the ABS would engage. ABS, when applied by stomping on and holding the the brake down beats me by a country mile, but apart from entertainment value I never wanted to hear the pulsing of brakes because I was overdriving my car.
Every ABS system will light a warning light if it has a malfunction and the driver must then modulate pedal pressure. It just requires a mental shift in gears, something that exceeds some folk's ability. |
Doug McCartney
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, August 18, 2005 - 9:09 pm: | |
The current anti-lock brake systems are very good. Nothing like the systems of the late 70's. We have a transit fleet with Waboc anti-lock brakes. Some of the units have been around for over ten years. Other than an occasional wheel speed sensor problem, they have been virtually trouble free. The fear of one flailing and causing a vehicle control problem is complete nonsense.
The modulating valves are normally open and do not interfere with the braking when they have not been activated by the ECU. The system is very reliable and safe.
If you can simultaneously monitor each wheel for skidding and react to each wheel locking independently, all in a fraction of a second, then you are a good enough driver to out perform the system. If not, the system will be able to help you maintain control and stop the vehicle better than you can on your own.
Doug |
John MC9
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, August 18, 2005 - 9:57 pm: | |
Re:
"The fear of one flailing and causing a vehicle control problem
is complete nonsense. "
Kinda' like the Titanic sinking?
The point was... that people relying on the ABS not failing
are relying on a computer chip to save their life. It seems logical,
that: Pressing and holding the pedal to the floor while the computer
does it's thing during a panic stop on ice; having the ABS fail in
those critical moments, may result with the individual holding the
brake pedal to the floor, unable to control the skid until it's too
late to do so.
I don't question an ABS system doing better than a human
can in a panic situation....when it's working as designed. I do
question it's value when it fails unexpectedly....
And I do fear the individual that is so accustomed to having a
computer doing his thinking, that he's never bothered to learn
how to handle a panic situation for himself. |
Doug McCartney
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, August 18, 2005 - 11:19 pm: | |
I’m not here to start a fight, so please don’t take it that way. I think this is worthy of some debate and I respectfully disagree on a couple of points.
The Titanic was on it maiden voyage these systems are certainly not. As a technician I know that there is always a chance that a system can fail. This system is designed to be safe even if it is not operating.
The modulator valves have no affect on the system unless they are commanded on. In the worst case, you have a system that works like one with no anti-lock. The driver would have to control the skid like he would with any other non anti-lock equipped vehicle.
The system also cycles all of the valves and requires a speed signal from each of the sensors at start-up. If it does not compete the self test, the ABS light comes on and you have regular old brakes.
Your thought that somehow a driver will get “accustomed to having a computer doing his thinking” is unrealistic. If you get to a point where the system has to control the skid, you know that you have done something wrong. It does not act in a subtle way.
To think that a person would be using the brakes hard enough to activate the ABS system in a routine stop is not realistic. They certainly could not do it enough to get "accustomed" to using it. The type of a panic stop that would activate the system is rare.
Doug |
John MC9
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 19, 2005 - 12:29 am: | |
Doug-
It's clear that you do not reside in Florida. |
Doug McCarteny
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 19, 2005 - 1:02 am: | |
Have you driven or been a passenger in a ABS equipped coach when the anti-lock brake system was actively trying to control a skid? |
John MC9
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 19, 2005 - 2:28 am: | |
No Doug.
But I've been in a passenger vehicle when the ABS system failed
to operate coming down a snow/iced road in New Hampshire.
Been fun Doug. And no, there's no hard feelings. |
Jon W.
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 19, 2005 - 8:33 am: | |
John MC9,
With all due respect you make a failure of the ABS sound like a crisis.
If you were in a vehicle with an ABS failure, on ice, and that failure caused you some serious concern then I can only conclude that the driver was going too fast for conditions, and even if the ABS was working on that vehicle you should have been scared.
Except for playing in the snow with my car I never had a real world activation of my ABS in the 17 years I have had vehicles with ABS with one exception. I had a dog run in front of me in a car and I reacted quickly and for a very brief moment the ABS pulsed.
I hope to never have my bus ABS activate because if it does I have either overdriven my bus or a panic stop situation has just occured. If the system is in failure mode I will still have 100% of my brakes, but the full responsibility to prevent lock up will be mine. I have yet to lock up the brakes on my buses or trucks. That is over 44 years of driving them. |
Jim Bob
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 19, 2005 - 9:00 am: | |
I have had two opportunities to use the ABS in my pickup. Both times it came on because I had the pedal to the floor. It makes a "washboard vibration" you hear & feel. In both cases I feel certain I would have been in an accident without it because I got stopped about 12-24 inches from the obstacle. Without it at least the rear wheels of the vehicle would have been locked up and I would have needed distance I didn't have. These incidents happened on flat dry road. |
Stan
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 19, 2005 - 3:01 pm: | |
I know how ABS works on a slippy surface but how effective is it on a dry high friction surface?
If you lock up all your wheels on dry concrete road do you stop quicker or go further than you would with your wheels turning slowing with ABS? |
John MC9
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 19, 2005 - 3:27 pm: | |
Doug-
Naw, no fight. Just a differing opinion of the overall value of ABS.
Jon-
I too, never locked the brakes or skidded a wheel on dry
pavement with a bus or truck. I have experienced wheel slides
on snow and iced roads. Not due to a "too fast for conditions"
scenario, but simply as part of the conditions most drivers in the
northern states and Canada experience in normal winter driving.
If you've never sat on an iced roadway at a traffic light and had
your bus slide sideways to the curb while you waited for the
light to change.... well...
When the roads are that slick, you needn't be making a "panic stop"
(or going too fast for conditions), to cause the ABS to actuate. Any
wheel that breaks traction during braking, will cause the ABS system
to actuate. Just going over the white reflective pavement markings
while braking can cause the wheel to lose traction.
I've never driven a bus or truck with ABS, so my comments are
more of a rhetorical question: how long does it take for a driver to
lose his fine-tuned braking skills, when he's forgotten that the ABS
is doing most of his thinking...
It might be a great technological advancement, but in my opinion,
people drove better back when they drove without it. |
Jon W.
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 19, 2005 - 3:44 pm: | |
John MC9,
Now you just said a mouthful:
"It might be a great technological advancement, but in my opinion,
people drove better back when they drove without it."
I think that the technological advances we are seeing, such as air bags, ABS and now stability control are allowing the brain dead to drive like Jeff Gordon.
I laughed at your sliding sideways comment, although at the time it wasn't funny. I came in from a trip when we lived in NY and our driveway was a snowy, slippery mess. I stopped next to the barn, and in seconds the warm tires allowed it to gradually slip sideways towards the barn stopping before it hit the barn, but making it very difficult for me to move it without taking out the side of the coach or the barn.
Aaaah, the bad old days. |
John MC9
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 19, 2005 - 6:12 pm: | |
Jon-
In the 60's, on one ski trip to Hunter Mountain, NY, a bunch
of us (drivers) sat in a coach playing cards and swapping stories,
when one yelled out "Hey lookit that", pointing out the windshield...
We all watched as a parked Scenic Cruiser slowly slid backwards
from it's parked position in the very iced over parking lot, over
the embankment, all but totally disappearing from view. It looked
like the Titanic in a sinkhole.
His group was sent another bus, of cuz...
(ahh, nostalgia) |
Jack Conrad (Jackconrad)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 19, 2005 - 7:06 pm: | |
A friend was getting ready to leave his place in Canada to come to Florida last December. Bus all loaded, set the brakes and went into the house to check everything one last time before locking the doors. Looked out and saw his Prevost slid across the driveway into the well and pump. He thought parking brake failed until he noticed rear wheels were not turning, just sliding on the layer of ice on the driveway. Departure was delayed until well and pump were repaired. Jack |
Don/TX
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 19, 2005 - 8:37 pm: | |
I feel that the real message in that is that he should have departed earlier, before it froze! |
Mike (Busone)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, August 20, 2005 - 10:47 pm: | |
I remember in highschool then whole class put in some money for a ski trip. We went up to Breckenridge CO for the day. I was very excited to get to ride in a 1997 model MCI. That evening when we were all going to leave it was getting very cold up there. Then driver put the bus in drive and the wheels just spun. Turns out the snow in the parking lot melted into slush during the afternoon and then refroze in the evening. The tires were perfectly frozen in. After about 45 min of salt and gravel we got out. The driver was not too happy. |