| Author | Message | ||
| Doug Clapper (Dctrader)
Rating: N/A |
Let's see if we can put a damper on the gas companies gouging the general public. Pass this on if you feel it is important enough. We all are feeling the gas pinch and something needs to be done. If we could get a state or nationwide boycott of the companies that import oil for a week at a time and only buy from the companies that produce oil in America, the foreign oil companies might lower their prices. With oil company profits at an all time high, it's time for the price of gas and fuel to come back down. Where to buy your gas and fuel. This is very important to know and read on -- Why didn't George W. think of this? Gas rationing in the 80's worked even though we grumbled about it. It might even be good for us! The Saudis are boycotting American goods. We should return the favor. An interesting thought is to boycott their GAS. Every time you fill up the car or bus, you can avoid putting more money into the coffers of Saudi Arabia. Just buy from gas companies that don't import their oil from the Saudis. Nothing is more frustrating than the feeling that every time I fill-up the tank, I am sending my money to people who are trying to kill me, my family, and my friends. I thought it might be interesting for you to know which oil companies are the best to buy gas from and which major companies import Middle Eastern oil: Shell............................. 205,742,000 barrels Chevron/Texaco......... 144,332,000 barrels Exxon/Mobil............... 130,082,000 barrels Marathon/Speedway... 117,740,000 barrels Amoco............................62,231,000 barrels If you do the math at $30/barrel, these imports amount to over $18 BILLION! Here are some large companies that do not import Middle Eastern oil: Citgo.......................0 barrels Sunoco...................0 barrels Conoco...................0 barrels Sinclair....................0 barrels BP/Phillips.! .............0 barrels Hess........................0 barrels ARC0.0 barrels All of this information is available from the Department of Energy and each is required to state where they get their oil and how much they are importing. But to have an impact, we need to reach literally millions of gas buyers. It's really simple to do. Now, don't wimp out at this point ... keep reading and I'll explain how simple it is to reach millions of people!! I'm sending this note to about thirty people. If each of you send it to at least ten more (30 x 10 = 300) ... and those 300 send it to at least ten more (300 x 10 = 3,000) ... and so on, by the time the message reaches the sixth generation of people, we will have reached over THREE MILLION consumers! If those three million get excited and pass this on to ten friends each, then 30 million people will have been contacted! If it goes one level further, you guessed it. THREE HUNDRED MILLION PEOPLE!!! Again, all you have to do is send this to 10 people. How long would all that take? If each of us sends this e-mail out to ten more people within one day, all 300 MILLION people could conceivably be contacted within the next eight days! | ||
| John MC9 Rating: N/A |
So. It's the Saudis that are charging the hell out of us! And we shouldn't buy fuel from companies that buy from the Saudis! Uhh.. so...uhh... how come gas isn't any cheaper at Citgo, Sunoco, Conoco, Sinclair, BP/Phillips, or Hess? Well... I guess I should get started sending out emails. I don't want my ears to fall off or another fifty years of bad luck. And besides, Bill Gates will send me $100 for each email. Hey Doug...... HAR de HAR HAR. | ||
| johnwood
Rating: N/A |
Actually, it probably would do more good to send letters to your congessmen to relax rules on new refineries! Last one built was in '73 I believe. They are all old (30+ yrs) and running at close to 100% capacity. There is actually a good quantitiy of crude available to the refiners.......... just no capacity to make it into fuel due to NIMBY rules. Due to weird market the price of crude reflects lack of refining capacity. One other factor in the high crude prices is the weak dollar and chindia demand. | ||
| John MC9 Rating: N/A |
Whoops... I forgot this: Gas and fuel | ||
| Doug Clapper (Dctrader)
Rating: N/A |
Yes all the refinries lack storage and are all out dated, Yes we need new refinries with larger storage cap. The other oil companies prices will stay up with the saudies supplied stations they want their piece of the profits as long as they can. but by buying our fuel at the others that are not supplied by forgein oil, all the prices should come down. Yes emails to your Congressmen and Senators will also be helpful as well, I'am in So. Tx where alot of refinries are but our prices have increased .30 cent in the last couple weeks and if someone does'nt do something soon we'll be paying $3.50+ a gal. | ||
| James Maxwell (Jmaxwell)
Rating: N/A |
This idea has floated the Internet for at least 4 yrs. I can't count the number of times I have seen it. I'm surprised that you have not seen it before Doug. Maybe the internet does not spread the word as fast and as far as we think? Nevertheless, for numerous reasons, it won't work. Giants like Exxon and Chevron don't really care if they refine it or not. In fact, they would prefer not to, being more than content with putting it on the spot market, which is what they do with a significant part of their oil holdings. Another factor, depending on regional demands, oil is commonly traded between majors. Bottom line is, who is refinining who's crude and who is selling who's refined product? You just never know. Just boycott one major, do it for a month. They don't give a damn, they'll peddle it off as crude or refined product to whereever you switched to for the month. Another consideration. I, and maybe you, can easily go a week without buying petro. But, what about the guy that has to go to work tomorrow on his 100 mile round-trip commute so he can earn the money to make his mortgage and put food on the table for his 3 rug rats. This is all far more complex than just importing it. As mentioned, there is refinery capacity also as a huge factor, in fact, as of last Thursday, 9 major refineries in the US were running at anywhere from 0 to 75% capacity for various reasons: 2 for fires and 7 for "unscheduled maintenance and repairs", whatever that entails. So, next time u fill up at Arco/BP--go in and ask them to show the documentation on where they got the crude. About your surest bet is that they didn't get it off the North Slope, since most of that is going to the Asian Pacific Rim nations in exchange for SE Asian Sweet, at a hefty 1/3 difference in exchange I might add: we ship a bbl. they send us back 2/3 bbl. Most North Slope is high sulfur, only slightly better than shale oil. I haven't knowingly bought a drop of fuel from any of the major importers in years, but I'm willing to bet I've purchased a bunch of their crude from others. | ||
| John MC9 Rating: N/A |
Doug- We have droves of people coming to Florida, buying $60k houses for over $350k without a blink. They park their SUVs in harm's way and don't give a rat's ass who hits it. It isn't the economy that's gone nuts, it's the people. It's the greed and ego; the wanton display of affluence that's driving prices up. Don't blame the Saudis, they're only supplying the crude for the crud. | ||
| Mike (Busone)
Rating: N/A |
Hey John, You should look at what people are paying for houses here in Denver. It sure is insanity. I can't wait to move to an area where the houses are priced what they are really worth. | ||
| niles steckbauer (Niles500)
Rating: N/A |
US Oil companies are not paying $60+ barrel for 'light sweet cude' - they are paying less than half that for low grade crude - Oil is not 'refined', it is 'distilled' - it takes considerable more refinery processing time/capacity to distill low grade crude than light sweet crude - either buy crude that requires less refining or increase refinery capacity - there are an estimated 30+ years (conservative @ current rate of consumption) of available low grade crude located within the US international boundries - Or we can do what we always do and engage in semantics - When fuel tops $5 gallon I'll hopefully see people getting serious about conservation and production - I welcome the onset of the introduction of other alternative fuels and re-acceptance of previously determined politically incorrect fuels, the only way we'll create energy independence is by relying on current and future technology and resources that exist now within our custody and control - Or we can keep playing politics - Niles | ||
| Larry Rating: N/A |
20 year or so ago Texas drillers did not want to pump oil until the price went up. So the Uncle Sam says ok go ahead and cap them of, but first file the pipe full of concrete before capping. Or continue pumping (at a lose). Now if you want to pump drill a well next to it, since that is easier than redrilling threw the concrete. Above was so I heard, maybe so or not? But I do know I could go to Texas and buy houses for half of what the value was, since the ones who worked in the oil wells, were without jobs. Sounds bad as was, but there best way out. Also have a talk with the tree huggers. | ||
| James Maxwell (Jmaxwell)
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Niles: You mention an interesting point. Heard a segment of a Lundberg report last week where it was mentioned that Amoco was currently paying Aramco (The Saudi Nat'l. Oil Company) $31.50/bbl. and re-selling the bulk on spot market trading at slightly above $60. The Saudi Royal Family and their other "interest" parties ended up w/nearly 1/2 that amount with less than 1/4 of that amount being "trickled" to the "people" of Saudi. In comparison, the citizens of most of the other Persion Gulf countries like UAE, Dubai, etc. end up w/about 1/3 the total take, which was similarly priced. Chevron and Shell both had sweeter deals going in Kuwait; I suppose out of consideration for their arranging repatriation of the oil fields from Saddam 15 yrs. ago. | ||
| degojo Rating: N/A |
My bus holds 235 gallons of diesel. It is pretty near full and I have not driven it in a while. Frankly its the best investment I have. I can't wait until the fuel is worth more than all the metal surrounding it. If the Bush family was into sugar not oil we would have troops in Haiti and sugar would be $20 a pound. Hell why be president if you can't help the family and friends. | ||
| niles steckbauer (Niles500)
Rating: N/A |
What a timely news broadcast - http://abcnews.go.com/WNT/story?id=1042788&page=1 | ||
| Bob Vandawalker (Rav221)
Rating: N/A |
I agree with John, we are a spoiled country. People in the US generally enjoy the best of everything and are willing to pay for it (whether they can afford it or not). SUV's are the crave, so people buy them, even though they get crappy mileage. Do you really need 4 wheel drive in downtown LA? People still resist car pooling, walking a few hundred yards or using mass transit. How many kids now drive to school instead of walk. My office sits up the street from a high school , it's amazing the number of $30,000 and $40,000.00 vehicles that sit in the student parking lot. Until I saved enough money from my part-time job to buy a car, I walked about 1 1/2 miles to school. Buy the way my part-time job was at a gas station. I clearly remember being yelled at by a customer who was very upset that gas prices increased to the outrageous price of $028.9. It's a different time with different values, and only getting worse. Hey, I think my dad said that when I was 17. Guess he was smarter than I thought at the time. Bob V. | ||
| James Maxwell (Jmaxwell)
Rating: N/A |
Bob V. I hear what ure saying about spoiled Americans. Can u imagine, they have to have their very own Bus, at 6-8 mpg just to go camping at their favorite lake, where they could just as well use a Coleman tent and stove. I also remember as a kid walking 10 miles to school, in the snow, uphill all the way, holes in the soles of my shoes, and in the late afternoon, making the same trip back home, also uphill all the way!!! It may be part of the reason I grew old before my time. LOL | ||
| John MC9 Rating: N/A |
The SUV gets about 10 mpg and my bus gets 9.. I can sleep, eat and live in the bus, but the SUV provides only expensive transportation to and from point A and B. There's really no comparison to owning a fuel guzzling "car" and an RV that can provide living space, is there? (I guess you can pee on the back seat of that Cadillac Escalade, if you so desire) The news just announced that the high $3.00+ price of fuel may last until after Labor Day. What amazes me, is that so many people refuse to see the timeline of the higher pricing. It isn't glut or shortage, it's supply and demand. They can charge more when it's in demand. I guess when you lack a brain" as I do, you can understand the "no-brainers" easier.....? | ||
| James Maxwell (Jmaxwell)
Rating: N/A |
The point was not what you and the SUV owner were going to "Point B" for, but rather you were both going there, and the SUV driver did it with less fuel than you, by your own figures. The price of either mode also has nothing to do with it. Not all buses get as good as 9mpg, I know neither one of mine ever got better than 7.5 and none of the guys I regularly travel with do any better, while the vast majority of SUV's (Not all are Escalades and Navigators) get far better than 10. According to Lundberg, total US consumption by petroleum based energy actually decreased by a very small percentage point in the past 30 days, despite an increase in consumption for electric generation. Did u see the price of fuel decline? So much for that pure supply and demand theory. | ||
| Bill K Rating: N/A |
I have a 99 Tahoe and I get 18+ and around 6 with the bus. | ||
| John MC9 Rating: N/A |
Oh, alwright, alllllright.... The newer SUVs get more mpg than my MC9. I did tell you that I didn't have much brain left, didn't I? I just assumed they were all the same with the "5 or 6 around town". My Caravan only gets about 12 average, between the few dozen Florida traffic lights per quarter mile. But the fact remains, that there is a real strange coincidence that the price of fuel rises prior to any holiday (where the usage will increase due to travel, etc), and manages to drop somewhat just after the holiday. The price of home fuel oil rises in the Northeast as the weather gets colder and everyone turns their thermostats higher, so the best time to fill the tank, was always mid-summer. Supply and demand. How else would it be explained? The more you need it; the more you want it, the more it's going to cost you. And they'll charge you as much as the market will bear. We proved all that, back in the gas crunch of the '70s. We all turned to smaller cars, did less travelling and found that wood was an alternate way to heat our homes....well... until the price of a cord of wood compelled us to burn the coffee table instead.... proving that the price of raw wood, also bore the pressure of supply and demand. There's plenty of refineries and wells to handle the job quite well. Back in the '70s, we were told that there was a short supply of fuel. But once we cut back, the price dropped and, there was enough for the years and years that followed. So much of it, that it compelled us to be wasteful. Increased wages and more spending power took us to where we are now. We will pay what we can afford to pay. When we stop, they will stop. I know.... it's too simple to see it that way; it's almost an insult to our intellectual ability. But it's still supply and demand. | ||
| David (Davidinwilmnc)
Rating: N/A |
Back to the guzzling SUV vs. bus discussion... Who thinks that the total miles (and therefor fuel consumption) is remotely comparable to the miles put on an average SUV. I've always heard that average yearly mileage is between 12k and 15k miles. Who puts that on their bus? Some, I'm sure. Look around you sitting in traffic. How many converted buses do you see? How many SUV's? How many Civics, Corollas, etc? We've created our own high fuel prices. By increasing the demand (remember supply takes a lot longer to change, demand is almost instant), we've allowed ourselves to be held 'hostage' to fuel costs. Not all newer SUV's are good on gas, either. A friends Grand Cherokee got 14.5 according to the trip computer on the highway at 65 mph. My Corolla got about 35. Both seat 5 passengers. The Jeep isn't all that much roomier. I still think that SUV and truck owners who use them to transport 1 to 2 people through city traffic are partially to blame for increased fuel prices. Remember the late 70's and early 80's? Remember when the first generation Accords, Camrys, Sentras, Escorts, etc came out? People were amazed that they could be comfortable in a car that small. They were cool because they got over 2x the mpg of the old V8 station wagon. The could make U-turns anywhere, could almost fit sideways in those huge parking spaces, and were just easy and fun to drive. If we treated fuel issues like the rest of the world does, imagine how much we would save and how much less we would polute. | ||
| Bob Vandawalker (Rav221)
Rating: N/A |
When I used the SUV example, I was only making a point for the number of people who have a 4x4 vehicle and will likely never engage it. Which brings me to a story> About 2 years ago, I came out of the New York State Fair, there was a woman who was parked near me in the parking area which had become a bit muddy due to a downpour. This woman was sitting in her Chevy Tahoe spinning the hell out of the rear tires which had dug down quite well. I went to her window and asked her about using 4 wheel drive, her response was "what?". I pointed out the rocker switch on the dash, she had no idea what it was for. After she was amazed that the vehicle walked right out of the mud, she told me that the dealer never told her it was a 4 wheel drive vehicle. (True story) I would also bet any of these bus conversions gets close to the same mileage as the 3/4 ton pickup towing the 30ft camping trailer. Hey at least everyone here is doing their part and not buying a 40ft boat with 2 diesels. | ||
| Dale L. Waller (Happycampersrus)
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Not to mention that "ole lame duck" needs the 18 percent tax a gallon to fund his economic recovery. Watch and see if prices don't decline after the holiday as the other posters have stated. Looks like price gouging to me. Also the refiners don't want to ad refineries to raise their cost just to lower your gas price. | ||
| Lew Poppleton (Lewpopp)
Rating: N/A |
WHY NOT GET ALL OF THE TRUCKERS TO SHUT DOWN WHEN NOT DRIVING AND WE WOULD HAVE MILLIONS OF GALLONS A DAY NOT USED. I REALIZE THEY NEED AIR AND TV, BUT NOT ALL THE TIME. THERE ARE SOME COOL NITES. | ||
| Mike Taylor (Mc9er)
Rating: N/A |
Hi everyone  Recently I heard a local news caster saying that a local county school was mixing 50% diesel with 50% chicken fat from local chicken processing plants due to the high cost of fuel. The maintenance director for the school buses says its working good and reducing emissions. KFC is sounding like a good stock to buy. Gotta fry that chicken to get the fat. LOL!!! Hopefully that emission cloud will get to the Saudi's and smell like chicken --it. | ||
| Stan Rating: N/A |
Does nobody believe in the American system? You buy shares in the oil companies and use your dividend checks to buy your fuel. | ||
| Marc Bourget Rating: N/A |
Want to end the high cost of fuel, drive 55 The less the demand the greater the "supply" and the price will drop. | ||
| John MC9 Rating: N/A |
In the "read and weep" department: Weekly Retail On-Highway Diesel Prices | ||
| Johnny Rating: N/A |
Drive 55? Around here, that qualifies as "suicidal". | ||
| Marc Bourget Rating: N/A |
Not if everybody else (mostly) went slower. | ||
| Johnny Rating: N/A |
Which will never happen. I run 70-75, and am relegated to the right lane. | ||
| Marc Bourget Rating: N/A |
Johnny, I agree, At the same time, if we exercise the freedom and make the choice to drive 75, then it's reasonable to adopt the position that we've forefeited our position and shouldn't complain about the price of fuel. | ||
| John MC9 Rating: N/A |
Johnny- You live in Flor-Ah-Duh? 75mph is the average I95 ramp speed. They want to raise the "minimum" speed on I95 to 55mph, because they're seeing the average motorist's speed to be well over 85-90. They tried to pass a law that would give any motorist doing the speed limit (75) in the left lane and not moving right asap, a ticket for impeding traffic. It's insane. | ||
| Johnny Rating: N/A |
New England, actually. | ||
| Mike (Busone)
Rating: N/A |
Sounds like Denver, speed or get run over. |