| Author |
Message |
J.L.Vickers
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, August 16, 2005 - 8:32 am: | |
Need some advise on a air cooled oil cooler for a V-730 in a P8M4905A.
It now has the engine coolant oil cooler for the V-730.
I want to install the air to oil cooler in the system also.
Which line would be the best to plumb the system to?
Oil into the transmission or oil out of the transmission?
Note! The engine temperture while on the road is around 180-190 degrees.
I just want a little extra added protection.
Thanks
J.L.Vickers |
Larry
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, August 16, 2005 - 9:07 am: | |
use cooler from V2sa I believe that is close to trans number?(older transet 2spd bus),pipe as it is now.
You could use a before before cooler also if you like but prob won't need it.
Just my opinion, seems to work fine on mine (its larger). |
PAUL COLLYER (Paso_1)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, August 16, 2005 - 4:12 pm: | |
Looking at a cooler on a VS2-8 on a 68 Transit compared to the cooler on a 77 V730 it's twice as long. I would think it would be best to plumb/tap the air cooler after it leaves the orginal coolant cooler. |
jimmci9 #2
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, August 16, 2005 - 7:06 pm: | |
if you are determined to do this, plumb it into the return line... the 1 coming back to the transmission from the oil cooler mounted on the engine... otherwise, the engine will heat the trans oil back up to whatever the engine coolant temp is....make sure that you use #20 size hose/line..single wire braid is what we use...with re-useable type fittingss..... and limit the fittings to as few as possible.... |
Doug McCartney
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, August 18, 2005 - 11:46 pm: | |
I’m not sure that you will be gaining much by adding a supplemental cooler. My experience with V-730's in a transit fleet leads me to believe that the stock cooler bundle is more than adequate. I think the volume of oil that they have probably helps more than anything.
In all of the transits that I have been around, including brand new Allison WTs, I have never seen anything but a cooler that shares the engine coolant. Even with the higher coolant temperatures that new engines run we don’t seem to have problems excessive heat in the transmissions.
Doug |
dave4106
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 19, 2005 - 8:59 am: | |
all depends on the cooling capacity of the radiator. you can double the capacity of the coolant to oil cooler, but without the engine radiator being of sufficient size ,you won't gain any additional heat reduction. air to air will achieve this but if your coolant temp is running at spec now why mess with it? i know peace of mind counts for something. |
Craig Craddock (Gs4)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 19, 2005 - 1:49 pm: | |
I believe you can not compare a V730's use in a transit situation versus over the road use. From my experience short stop and go the transmission looses it's heat very quickly in comparision to a long run in 100 to 115 degree plus outside ambient air temperatures. The ashpalt temps. exceeding 140 degrees. Over the road use it keeps heating up the longer you go and the faster your speed the higher the temperature will climb until it reaches your cooling capacity what ever that might be. This is based on when I and a friend did not have enough cooling capacity both engine and transmission. We experimented with the engine heat exchanger only, air only and both systems in series both with the air cooler before and after the heat exchanger. We both now use only the air exchanger. Mine is a Hayden 1292 and my friend's a 2292 double row Hayden. When we were having cooling problems we would stop along the side of the road for about 5 to 10 minutes and it would cool down very quickly and be good for another 80 to 100 miles before it reached 230 degrees oil pan temperature. I have even tryed a mister on the air cooler lowering the temp about 40 degrees if I am not using my 16" shroulded electric fan for the air cooler it is not in front of the engine radiator. My friend is using two smaller elec. fans unshroulded.
Just some of our experimenting over the last 8 years. We both run the hot SW desert areas. |
jimmci9 #2
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 19, 2005 - 6:43 pm: | |
the transmission generates heat from the torque convertor.... when the trans is in "lockup" no heat is generated....adding an additional cooler, either air or engine mounted will add oil capacity.... (which doesn't hurt).. and will help shed some heat... but, again, let me repaeat.. torque converters generate heat... not transmissions.... |
Don/TX
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 19, 2005 - 7:50 pm: | |
Yeah Jim, the "heat while on the highway" thing bothers me too, do you suppose his transmission was not locking up? From my limited experience, the stop and go city bus use makes far more heat than out cruising on the highway. |
jimmci9 #2
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 19, 2005 - 10:07 pm: | |
i really didnt understand craigs post..either......when an allison (ht740, 750) is in 2nd, 3rd, 4th.. etc, the torque convertor is in lockup.... and the governor in the trans sets the shift points...modulator makes it shift..a transmission is gonna run maybe 10-20 degrees hottet than the engine pulling it.... more than that and something else is wrong |
Craig Craddock (Gs4)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, August 20, 2005 - 2:57 am: | |
I do not totally understand it either. My experience is from two freshly overhauled and one of unknown condition that we did fix the lockup on, all are V 730's. They all acted the same. Yes they all locked up could definetely feel it. Completely maybe not, but I think really think so. We always guessed it was the angle gears or the flow of the oil through the pump & etc. heating it. Loren at Dreamliner also has talked about the same thing and says he has a bypass kit to correct it. I have heard of this from another source on one of the boards. I just considered this bypass idea to keep the heat down snake oil, but do not have any idea what they are doing. My transmission temperature does not increase climbing hills but I am locked up and not in a torque converter situation. This and the above post are mine and a friends experience with V730's with inline 671's, 8V71, & 8V71TA powered 4104's. I am open to ideas. Currently we have the transmission heat under control in both buses after much experimenting. His runs at 160 with the 2292 and mine runs 160 to 180 with a 1292 air cooler. |
Don/TX
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, August 20, 2005 - 6:52 am: | |
Something else to consider when cooling V730 trannies. A friend of mine went to the air to air, mounted it down low so air flowing under the bus would cool it. It done wonderful for a few months, then started heating badly again. Finally took a look at the air to air, the fins on the front were all mashed over, totally blocking the airflow! Don't know if it was a single piece of road debris or multiple hits. |