| Author | Message | ||
| truthhunter@shaw.ca
Rating: N/A |
Has anyone real knowledge about these pulse modulators that are reputed to break the sulfates off of lead/acid battery (both deep cycle and starting batteries)with the aim of reconditioning them to a younger stronger condition. I would even welcome any anecdotal experience; if anyone has experienced this battery charging/reconditioning aid (PLEASE - no lecture from the peanut gallery about if there was such a "miracle in a can" they would of invented it years ago or the CIA would of forced the sale & silencing of such technology to *Union Carbide* a hundred years ago or at the least it would have been tacked-up on the cross with JC)(Just joking for you haha-DRDave)! This technology does seem to be coming down in price, and is now appearing on some smaller electronic 4 stage battery chargers that I have glanced at in big box retailers | ||
| David (Davidinwilmnc)
Rating: N/A |
I have a group 27 from a friend's motor home. I had been (over)charged with a early 90's cheapo converter. Then it was drained 'til my volt meter showed 0.30 volts. It would not take a charge from my 10 amp charger or .75 amp Battery Tender. We were going to dispose of it, then I remembered... I have a Vector VEC1093 (around $90 or so from Walmart) that charges up to 40 amps and has the conditioning mode. I ran that on the battery for about 2 days. Then I charged the battery. It charged fine. I've used that battery with an inverter to run a small refrigerator in my pop-up camper many times. I've also used it to start the 302 in my boat this past year. This charger has 'saved' a couple other batteries, too. The only bad thing about it is that it has the cheapest battery clamps. They're plastic with metal contacts and broke a while back. Still, I've been impressed with it. | ||
| Jerry Liebler (Jerry_liebler)
Rating: N/A |
Truthhunter, Yes, I have real actual experience desulphating batterys. It takes a long time but it definitely does work. However, don't waste your money on any commercial pulse desulphator. http://p198.ezboard.com/fleadacidbatterydesulfationfrm1 I've built 3 pulse desulphators according to the schematics on this web site or it's links. I succesfully restored 4 L16s that had sat discharged for about a year. The process took about 4 months and I measured their capacity along the way by doing monitored discharges to a preset voltage. When I started I had about 3 amp hours when I called it good I had over 390 amp hours (these L16s are rated at 395 AH). Early on I tried a commercial 'desulphator' and measured negligble pulse voltage so I sent it back. I've also restored several car batterys but they weren't as badly neglected and went quite a bit quicker. Regards Jerry 4107 1120 | ||
| PAUL COLLYER (Paso_1)
Rating: N/A |
I too have used the pulse desulfation method the jury is still out. It seems to work on some batteries quicker some never. I tried resurrecting a 8D that got froze (I'm assuming it broke apart inside ) never got a sniff of a volt after 2 months. I have yet to try some of the suggested methods. ie: charger and pulse at same time. Seems to keep a good battery good for a longer time. Jerry I wish I could find someone to build me one like on your link. (Hint Hint )  | ||
| Jerry Liebler (Jerry_liebler)
Rating: N/A |
Paul, I agree with your observation that some batterys have other issues, the pulsers only work if the problem is sulphation. But then battery manufacturers have said 80 - 90 % of battery failures are due to sulphation. My L16s had hardly been used but were left unattended for a year during which time they self discharged and became badly sulphated. But since any discharge over about 25% of capacity can cause some suplhation pulsing will keep good batterys at full capacity for most of their life. But these pulsers are very effective radio jammers so they aren't usually used on working battery banks. In restoring the L16's the pulser was on for the whole 4 months and I'd charge them, let them sit powering the pulser for weeks at a time then charge while pulsing and even equalize charge while pulsing etc. Every time I connected the charger all the television channels became snow, fortunately I lived far enough from my neighbors that they never complained. About once a month I'd fully charge and do a capacity test, this is one of the problems with restoring batterys, when are you done. My capacity test was to load them with a constant current (I built a load box) and monitor the voltage (I built a settable voltage monitor), when the voltage dropped to a preset level the load was disconnected and while the load was on a timer (I modified a battery powered clock) counted the time. I started out with a 10 amp load and ended up with a 40 amp load. I tested 2 series connected batterys at a time (12 volt). There was much more to this project than just building the pulser. Regards Jerry 4107 1120 | ||
| paul c Rating: N/A |
Jerry I wish I knew then what I know now Working in a shop in the 60's we often experimented with acid filled lead batteries. Mostly car batteries however we had various successful things. We dumped the batteries washed them out completly by rinsing shaking bumping etc.. then filling them with acid again and put them on a slow charger in series with about 10 other batteries.( wall unit) amazing things happen on some of those batteries. you could easily get a full 3 extra years on some batteries.( after that crazy procedure) we also dumped battery acid and got to see the differant colors of the acid and soon got to regonize what batteries wouldn't work and which would. Never new anything about pulsers back then. But we often charged a battery full then attach a headlight and killed the battery. We had a service truck with a 8D battery that was used for boosting cars all day and put on a slow charger every night often almost cooking the battery and they seemed to last 2 winters in minus 40 f weather for weeks at a time. I have a big shop charger as well as little trickle chargers I have a baterry load tester and can load test before putting a battery back into service. I am curious to see the results of some of my testing and to see what the effects it will have on a bus battery bank with 4 8d's plus the two starting 8 d's paul | ||
| Tom Caffrey (Pvcces)
Rating: N/A |
Truthhunter, we have some reclaimed old L16s on our boat. The desulfater we used on them has done a nice job. I have seen batteries that didn't respond by restoring their capacities, but from what I've seen, a lot depends on whether the desufater can get the battery ringing. If the wiring and the battery don't match up well to the desulfater, then it won't do much. When they do match up, it works very well. For what it's worth. Tom Caffrey PD4106-2576 Suncatcher Ketchikan, Alaska | ||
| Jerry Liebler (Jerry_liebler)
Rating: N/A |
Tom, I believe it's best to say no one knows the exact reason, or how, pulse desulphators work. That they do work I personally have seen and I did some experiments with the designs of my pulsers. From these experiments I conclude that reducing the 'wiring' inductance between the pulser and the battery increases (better) the rate of improvement. Toward this end my pulser's 'leads' are 6" pieces of 1" wide copper braid. Also doubling the energy delivered with each pulse did not double the rate of improvement. So I'd suggest that very fast rise time of a pulse to rather high voltages delivered to the 'guts' of the battery is the key. Note my pulsers put about 70 volts peak across the battery with a voltage rise time under 10 nanoseconds, and repeat this some 2000 times a second. During each of these pulses the charging current also rises rapidly but only changes 2-5 (different designs) amps but does it in 10 nanoseconds. Regards Jerry 4107 1129 | ||
| William J Kluge, Jr. (Flx_a_bill)
Rating: N/A |
Tried that website listed above.. and had to bumpt to a few more websites before I saw a circuit diagram or two.. which were over my head.. dumb me couldn't even tell how they were powered. Looks like when a battery goes bad.. get a new one. | ||
| Gary Stadler (Boogiethecat)
Rating: N/A |
. | ||
| Gary Stadler (Boogiethecat)
Rating: N/A |
I've been eyeing this page for a while now, trying to figure out if this is snake oil or real. It's good to hear that it actually works. http://www.shaka.com/~kalepa/highpower.htm Although I dislike anything that uses 555's (personal design button of mine) it looks reasonable. I've got a few batteries around here that have cells that are not shorted outright, but enough that they will loose a charge within a week. Think desulfators will help them? Another question... in a bout of absolute stupidity, I recently ~fully~ charged a very nice deep cycle battery....BACKWARDS... As soon as I realized it, I discharged it and recharged it the correct way. It was NOT a happy camper in the process (got REALLY hot and took forever to charge). After about a week, it finally came back to about 90% of it's capacity, but it was part of a matched set. Any idea if a desulphating process will help it any further? Interesting stuff... | ||
| Paul Tillmann (Paultillmann)
Rating: N/A |
With three buses now which translates to 6 $150 8D batteries I decided to purchase a PulseTech pulse recovery system which conditions two batteries at a time. It was an expensive ($399) experiment but I figured if it works I would save in the long run. I have one battery with one weak cell that I am conditioning now. The pulse conditioner has been on the battery for about 3 weeks now with no positive results yet. I will keep you posted. I figure if I condition all the batteries at least once per year and the batteries last that much longer it will be worth the money. I also understand the military uses these pulse conditioners with much success. Paul MC-5C T6H 5308A T6H 5307N | ||
| David (Davidinwilmnc)
Rating: N/A |
The conditioning mode on the Vector charger I was referring to is (supposedly) a pulsed desulfating mode. I don't know that I would spend much money just to test the theory that desulfating works. Since my charger has a 2, 10, 20, and 40 amp charge settings and a 100 amp start boost, as well as a desulfating mode, I thought it was worth a try. I've run it on a lawn tractor battery, motorcycle battery, group 24 and 27's, and my jet ski battery. All these batteries were weak (wouldn't charge completely or at all) and all but one of three 27's recovered and is in use. | ||
| truthhunter@shaw.ca
Rating: N/A |
Thanks JL & others. It looks like I should get down to the electronics parts store and do some Christmas shopping for the old Coach's work-ins' (the inside already has a deluxe propane/electric cook top under the tree). It seems time to put some elbow grease behind those years of pondering pulse conditioning technology is about to end for this BUSNUT. | ||
| Jerry Liebler (Jerry_liebler)
Rating: N/A |
All, Be careful of chargers that have a 'desulphating' mode. It usually means just an extra high output voltage. In truth all charging has a desuplhating effect. Suplhates form in various size crystals, the small ones are removed by ordinary charging. It is the large hard crystals that pulsing helps. When a battery has it's plates totaly covered with sulphate it will not take a charge and the voltage out of the charger can be raised without any current flow. If the voltage is raised enough some of the crystals may break loose, this is what the charger desulphate mode does. But this recovery is only of a small fraction of the plate area so the capacity will be seriously below the rating. The very fast rise to high voltages that the little home brew pulsers generate will eventually recover all the plate area and hence capacity. Gary pointed to a very high powered experiment that, I believe, has been abandoned as it doesn't improve on the original design first shown in 'Homepower' magazine. Regards Jerry 4107 1120 |