| Author |
Message |
steve souza (Stevebnut) (24.91.90.28)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, February 01, 2002 - 5:30 pm: | |
Well I foamed my bus today. Messy job so if you decide to do it yourself here are some things to consider.
1 wear disposible coveralls
2 wear eye protection
3 bus should be warm 70 degrees
4 wear gloves
5 cover gun and tip liberally with vaseline for easy cleanup or tip changes
6 put thin coates it applies better and is easier to get the right thickness ( less waste and removal labor of excess)
7 cover anything you do not want the foam to get on
I bought my foam as a kit with two tanks and gun with several nozzels. It covers 600 board feet.
It came from mcmaster-carr $612.
I ordered a second kit today as the one kit was not enough.
It is expensive but what a nice job it does in stiffening the roof and I can already feel the difference in the inside temperature
I am trimming it with a air sander that has screws in the disc to cut the foam. It works really good but this is by far the worse part of the job. lots of dust (cough cough gag)
happy busin--Steve |
Scott Whitney (66.82.32.1)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, February 01, 2002 - 9:37 pm: | |
Hi Steve,
Glad you had fun today! Hope you aren't breathing that dust! Yeach!
Scott |
Rich (24.147.234.166)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, February 02, 2002 - 7:33 am: | |
Hi Steve,
I'm curious, is it any cheaper doing it yourslef? What size is your buss? It's one of the things I have to consider when the time comes so I was wondering if it's worth doing it yourself or having it done.
Thanks,
Rich |
David Anderson (168.215.176.136)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, February 02, 2002 - 11:54 pm: | |
I had my Eagle done before Christmas. Charged me $800 for labor. It took 2 large kits @ $804 ea and 2 medium kits @ $338 ea. Total with tax was $3344.92 If I had it to do over again I think I'd buy a good respirator and fan and do it myself. The shop thought they could do it with 1 and 1/2 kits. It was way more than I expected.
David Anderson |
John Wiser (Yuma8) (208.164.97.25)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, February 03, 2002 - 5:10 pm: | |
Had my MCI 8 with roof raised and around the wheel wells done for $2000 and they did all the cutting and grinding down. I had to get rid of 6 large trash bags and vacuum after they were done.
John Wiser |
Peter Broadribb (Madbrit) (216.67.207.131)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, February 03, 2002 - 8:47 pm: | |
John,
don't keep it a secret, please tell us where you had it done. Thanks.
Peter. |
steve souza (Stevebnut) (24.91.90.28)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, February 03, 2002 - 9:05 pm: | |
I still have more foaming and grinding to do so I went out and bought some dust masks. I could not seem to find anyone in my area (new bedford Massachusetts) who did spray foaming.
My bus is a AM General 35 feet long 96" wide and i am hopeing to do it with two 600 board feet kits (12"x12"x1") 1200 board feet total $612. per kit $1224. total plus 8 pounds of sweat and sore shoulders from holding the spray gun.
I seem to be better at spraying now so there will be less to grind off and less waste.
I cannot stress enough how important it is to put thin layers and build up the foam slowly so as to not waste the stuff. I am no expert after doing only a portion of one bus but maybee you guys can save a couple of board feet of foam I wasted learning the thin layer method.
Happy foamin---steve |
steve souza (Stevebnut) (24.91.90.28)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, February 03, 2002 - 9:13 pm: | |
Rich--
I like doing everything myself (DIYDR)do it yourself done right.
Of course that does not mean it is always the best method as a profesional with experience is much more skilled than myself.
When I do it myself the labor is free and I learn something every time.
Sometimes I learn that I should have hired a profesional!
But you know bus nutting is all about doin it yourself your way.
Have fun,foam well and prosper
--Steve |
C. Ray Powell (Raypowell) (152.163.213.76)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, February 04, 2002 - 12:00 am: | |
Had my MCI 5 hot foamed for $1000. Had 2 bids both the same. Located in Illinois.
C Ray |
Oaepalmer (Oaepalmer) (208.164.96.153)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, February 04, 2002 - 1:21 am: | |
I keep reading with plenty of interest about the owners foaming their buses....but I have yet to read the " weight " of the foam used.
This "weight" corolates to the density when the foam has set and the amount of weight a 1"x12"x12" edge supported "tile" can hold before fracture.
The density also has an effect on the size of the bubbles that remaain after curing which effect the insulating value of the material.
I have had several experiences with foam in place fabrication of background features and in shipping applications, I am sorely lacking in any knowledge about foam in moving vehicles or other high vibration applications.
One thing I do know is that the lightweight low density foams used in shipping, degrads drasticly when applied to a vibrating machine as a sound deadener...it turns to dust and delaminates from the original surface it was applied to, once those two happen the foam has completely lost any insulating or soundproofing abilities.
I also know that using a foam that is too stiff, such as a "40 lb." foam would be an un-necessary expence. I am also suprised that I havent read about any interior surface prep to combat condensation problems.
Maybe someone could fill me and the rest that are equally inquisitive in on the missing details? |
FAST FRED (209.26.87.35)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, February 04, 2002 - 5:56 am: | |
YOU have found the crux of the problem.
IF the foam is very dense, ( as the folks with WIGGLEWALLS that hope to "stifen up" the coach like ) the insulation value is poor.
If its nice and light for a good R value its very tender.
The best deal is the hot foamed pro job.
The home Pacs frequently take much more than planned , as the conditions and temps are not correct, so the stuff expands much less giving a poor R value.
I have been so disapointed with sprayed or poured foam' R value , that for yacht fridges or freezers I take the much bigger hassle of piece building out of sheet foam , of known R value.
You might consider using the best Home Depot boards of foam and glueing them in place.
You might consider not messing with the stock fiberglass sealed in airtight bags , leave the overhead as is , its real eazy to clean up , or just sticking 3/8 strips of somekind of wood ( as Mike is doing on his Quickie).
Folks glue rug , but its hard to clean , and some just use padded naugahide , as in a car overhead.
Most folks hope the foam is closed cell and dont bother with vapor barriers.
Works OK , but I wouldnt use an unvented cat heater and expect ANY R value after everything waters up.
FAST FRED |
John Wiser (Yuma8) (208.164.97.32)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, February 04, 2002 - 12:27 pm: | |
Peter:
I had the job done in my back yard by All American Foam. I am very pleased the end result. They advertise in Bus Conversions about every 3 months. Phone 1-909-359-7597 |
Tony Richardson (63.178.72.4)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, February 07, 2002 - 7:45 pm: | |
Can someone explain Hot Foaming.
Thanks Tony |
dougthebonifiedbusnut (24.218.115.126)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, February 07, 2002 - 10:42 pm: | |
heysteve i live about an hour away from you in hopkinton ma would love to see your rig you are on my way home from work email me your phone3 ill give you a call
doug tappan
dougthebonifiedbusnut |
Mallie (208.165.104.15)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, February 11, 2002 - 10:02 am: | |
As always, FF has some good points. Spray foam is advertised with high R values. In fact all insulation is advertised with the max R value that could be achieve under ideal circumstances, usually a lab. And the R value of the insulation does not take into account the loses through your framing. So none will ever perform as well as rated. Foam achieves "higher than still dry air" by flashing with a gas that has a lower conductive than air,, not hard to do. What is hard to do is retain the gas over extreme heating and cooling seasons. It is generally estimated that the gas will be replaced by air in a couple of years. So for all practical purposes, that will be the max, but higher density foams will be better in the long run.
There is some insulation on the horizon that promises real value by holding the low conductive gas in a pillow type bag, but as you can imagine what 20 years will do to the ability of most materials to hold without cracks, and loose the gas.
In the mean time closed cell foam offers the best for the least. It is used in boat hulls and performs well over long periods.
But as FF says, moisture content can be a factor. It is a factor in your home, and it is an even bigger factor in your bus conversion, because of minimal venting.
The open flame LP heater will put out about a gallon of moisture for every gallon of fuel burned. Not a problem if just used occasionally, but if used continually, in very cold climate, it can be. Certainly something to consider. |
mike heron (199.250.136.5)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, May 17, 2002 - 10:54 am: | |
Well, we dropped off our MCI at the foam contractor in Spartanburg SC last Saturday, and last night we went back up to pay the bill and bring it home. The guy did a very thorough job for his first bus, and I wouldn't hesitate to recommend him - he even shot the underside of my entry steps, which emits drafts in winter and some road noise. He taped all the exposed ribs and covered the floor with plastic - I had masked off all the windows, driver's area, etc. He also drilled a few more 1" holes in the roof ribs for blue plastic conduit for the three roof airs' thermostat controls.
The inside now looks like the Pillsbury Dough Boy turned inside out. Now the real work begins - leveling off the wall and roof cavities to be even with the ribs, so the wall skins can go on without lumps. The contractor showed me a way to use a 26" saw blade from an old fashioned bow saw to bring the walls close to level, using the ribs as a guide, then an air powered 9" grinder to sand them perfectly smooth. I am figuring three or four days of solid work for two men. Before the interior wall skins go on, we plan to cover the ribs with strips of EHP Rollboard to prevent heat and cold from radiating into the coach from these metal structural members, then rivet back into place the lower sheet metal panels, curved roof panels, etc.
We drove the coach home through the night, and it is much quieter, cooler (and heavier!). Actually that last point is key because the engine and transmission were set up to perform with a substantial payload, and as a stripped out shell, it was perhaps not shifting properly, etc
This weekend a buddy and me will tackle the leveling job. Thank God we have good respirators! More as it develops.
Mike |