| Author |
Message |
Debbie and Joe Cannarozzi (Joe_camper)
Registered Member
Username: Joe_camper
Post Number: 39
Registered: 10-2006
Posted From: 76.223.80.184
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 31, 2007 - 6:19 am: | |
Is there any one out there who has done this with a DD 2-stroke or has any first hand knowledge that could share some info?
http://www.fireemup.com/magnum |
Ed Roelle (Ed_roelle)
Registered Member
Username: Ed_roelle
Post Number: 35
Registered: 3-2005
Posted From: 68.85.142.109
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 31, 2007 - 9:14 am: | |
There was an extensive discussion on the Detroit Diesel Discussion Board that you might want to check-out. http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/DetroitDiesel/
The very knowledgeable experts agreed that it is a bad idea.
Ed Roelle
Flint, MI |
Kyle Brandt (Kyle4501)
Registered Member
Username: Kyle4501
Post Number: 366
Registered: 9-2004
Posted From: 65.23.106.193
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 31, 2007 - 1:30 pm: | |
From what I gathered from reading the posts there, it is a bad idea due to the fact that intake air is used to push the hot combustion gasses out of the cylinder on a DD 2-stroke.
It is this exposure that allows things to get ugly. There is no problem when there is no fuel in the intake air charge.
But when a flamable fuel/air mixture is used to evacuate the cylinder . . . disaster will follow if that fuel/air mix ignites before the intake port is closed.
Propane has a minimum ignition temperature in air of 898F.
The limit of flamability for propane is 2.37% gas in air/gas mixture. This means at that level, it won't burn.
Now to pose a question that beggs to be asked, what happens if the amount of propane injected was so low that it was too lean to support combustion in the airbox?
I'm guessing that those who have experienced sucess with propane on DD 2-strokes have been lucky enough to have been below this flamability threshold.
But then again, I've been wrong before . . . |
Dan West (Utahclaimjumper)
Registered Member
Username: Utahclaimjumper
Post Number: 58
Registered: 1-2005
Posted From: 208.66.38.115
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 31, 2007 - 3:03 pm: | |
Joe, what you will find is 99% of the naysayers have NEVER done it, or tryed doing it, or know anyone who has done it, they just repeat, repeat
and jack their jaws about a subject they know nothing about.>>>Dan (been doing it ten years) |
Jerry Liebler (Jerry_liebler)
Registered Member
Username: Jerry_liebler
Post Number: 275
Registered: 3-2005
Posted From: 67.140.164.220
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 31, 2007 - 3:23 pm: | |
Kyle,
I think you'll find that the sucessful propane injection systems have propane to air ratios between 0.25% and 0.75% which from your post is far below the flamability threshold.
Regards
Jerry 4107 1120 |
Austin Scott Davis (Zimtok)
Registered Member
Username: Zimtok
Post Number: 161
Registered: 9-2006
Posted From: 216.37.73.226
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 31, 2007 - 3:43 pm: | |
This reminds me of another "power trick" I was told many years ago.
I was told by a someone that he would put about 1gal of gas to 30gal of diesel to increase the power of his truck.
I don't know if it works or is harmful, but I don't think I would try it.
. |
Debbie and Joe Cannarozzi (Joe_camper)
Registered Member
Username: Joe_camper
Post Number: 40
Registered: 10-2006
Posted From: 76.223.80.184
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 31, 2007 - 6:36 pm: | |
Well here is a topic that has stirred some opinion. That's good. I called these folks in the site I put up and spoke with a fellow and that 25%/75% mixture ratio was described. The are currently planning to test and dyno a DD 2-stroke but are planning on using a 318 for the test.
They have yet to try a 2-stroke.
Tongue-in cheek I asked if they would be interested in using our 8-92 for the test platform. They were very receptive. NooooooooT.
They are also a local co. for us, only an hour or so drive.
Ed thanks for the link and I'm looking forward to reading that. I can then further discuss these questions with them too. See what they say. I have a 3406B cat motor in a semi, I am Local and have a totally convenient propane dealer for a source. I might use the system on it just to see if it does lower fuel expenses. The other bennies that they boast are all great but for me the draw is the mileage.
I understand it would be a 4-stroke but it will give me the opportunity to see how the customer service as well as other things to base a decision on.
The fellow who sold us our bus has seen 1, in Australia, and 1 other fellow out west that he is going to send me his e-mail address. both 2-strokers but knew literally no details.
I would love to here yes I have done it with a 2-stroke. I would not seriously consider it before. |
Dan West (Utahclaimjumper)
Registered Member
Username: Utahclaimjumper
Post Number: 59
Registered: 1-2005
Posted From: 208.66.38.60
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 31, 2007 - 7:51 pm: | |
Joe, re-read my post.>>>Dan |
Florida Cliff (Floridacracker)
Registered Member
Username: Floridacracker
Post Number: 336
Registered: 7-2004
Posted From: 67.8.199.203
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, August 31, 2007 - 8:28 pm: | |
Dan,
I reread your post, also.......
How about sharing some of your knowledge and experience with the uninformed?
Cliff |
Debbie and Joe Cannarozzi (Joe_camper)
Registered Member
Username: Joe_camper
Post Number: 41
Registered: 10-2006
Posted From: 76.223.80.184
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, September 01, 2007 - 8:19 am: | |
Dan
I sent you an e-mail but received a failure notice?
I would love to talk. Our e-mail address is in our profile if you do not wish to use the forum for whatever reason. |
Dan West (Utahclaimjumper)
Registered Member
Username: Utahclaimjumper
Post Number: 60
Registered: 1-2005
Posted From: 208.66.38.115
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, September 01, 2007 - 10:13 am: | |
Joe, Ive updated my e-mail address.>>>Dan |
George M. Todd (George_mc6)
Registered Member
Username: George_mc6
Post Number: 259
Registered: 8-2006
Posted From: 207.231.81.129
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, September 01, 2007 - 7:26 pm: | |
Zimtok,
Two things to consider when adding gas to diesel, one is a biggie, the other isn't.
Vapor on top of a diesel tank is way too lean to burn, so nothing happens when touching a nozzle to the edge of a diesel tank, and a static spark jumps. Vapor on top of a gasoline tank is too rich to burn, so again nothing happens. It's also too lean right at the cap, with just the air around it. But, when you mix gas and diesel, the gas evaporates much faster out of the diesel, and the vapor on top of the tank becomes explosive. We won't talk about the lack of lubricity in gasoline. Many truckers have added gas to diesel in the winter, in an effort to avoid gelling. Don't know if they all know to touch the nozzle to the tank before taking the cap off, or what? FWIW
George |
quantum merlin (Quantum500)
Registered Member
Username: Quantum500
Post Number: 6
Registered: 8-2007
Posted From: 67.41.221.134
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, September 01, 2007 - 8:44 pm: | |
From what I have read propane has kind of gone out of popularity because it makes too much heat. NOS or methonal is a much better alternative because it carries heat away while adding power and economy. You might look into that option. |
Frank Rowe (Frankid)
Registered Member
Username: Frankid
Post Number: 29
Registered: 10-2006
Posted From: 63.239.248.1
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, September 02, 2007 - 12:31 am: | |
http://members.shaw.ca/k2pilot/Propane%20article.html |