| Author | Message | ||
| Bart Duncan (Bartman)
Registered Member Username: Bartman Post Number: 1 Registered: 11-2007 Posted From: 68.185.135.211 Rating: N/A |
Hey guys - I just picked up a 1981 Prevost Le Mirage. While driving home from Dallas I had many problems getting her into 5th gear and could not down shift so I had to pull over and start again each time. Is this user error??? My Eagle was not this hard to work with at all... thanks for any advice! | ||
| James Stacy (Jimstacy)
Registered Member Username: Jimstacy Post Number: 115 Registered: 1-2001 Posted From: 76.201.1.65 Rating: |
Bart, I may be telling you something you already know. Many bus stick shifts have a transmission brake operated by the clutch pedal. The purpose of this brake is to stop the trans input shaft so the transmission can be put in gear at a dead stop. It is engaged at the furthest travel of the clutch pedal. Many get prematurely worn by unknowing drivers pushing the pedal to the floor and holding it there at the wrong time, such as at a trafic stop. If the brake is functioning. and you press the clutch pedal too far, it can be difficult to shift. You will learn what point of clutch pedal travel is needed for smooth shifting. I am assuming you went through the process of determining shift point by accelerating to the governor limit in first gear and noting the speedometer reading, ( say 18 mph in 1st gear at governed limit). This tells you when you wish to downshift from 2nd to 1st, you can shift at 18 mph by double clutching with the governor at max rpm. Note the speed for each gear as you up shift and you will know the right downshift speed for each gear for that bus. This will vary with each bus due to gearing and governor setting. Old tour bus drivers know to do this with each different coach. Since it is done when upshifting, you will know the right speed to downshift. This is all a lost art since so few new buses require a clutch. FWIW Jim Stacy | ||
| L James Jones Jr (Jamo)
Registered Member Username: Jamo Post Number: 10 Registered: 11-2007 Posted From: 74.79.238.110 Rating: N/A |
Great info, Jim Stacy... Could you (or others) tell me if my newly aquired 4104-204 would have this tranny brake? Guess I could go to the manuals (I have OEM Parts & Service, along with a (actually 2)6-71 Service manual. I've been overwelmed with all the info in these binders. Wish I could get more learning done before our winter hits, but looks like I'm losing the battle... | ||
| Ron Walker (Prevost82)
Registered Member Username: Prevost82 Post Number: 344 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 208.181.210.47 Rating: N/A |
Did you get it into 5th? Do you have a 5 spd or a 6 spd tranny? If you have a 6 spd you have to push the stick pretty hard towards the curb side. I had a bit of fun finding it when I brought mine home. Prevost uses a Cab-over shift tower on the tranny and a drive shaft that runs from the back to a small box that the stick is mounted in. | ||
| James Stacy (Jimstacy)
Registered Member Username: Jimstacy Post Number: 116 Registered: 1-2001 Posted From: 76.248.111.112 Rating: N/A |
Jamo, IIRC the clutch brakes were on later model coaches, 102 MCI"s. BTW, I could never get my old '04 to shift as I would like. I got tired of fighting it so it now has a 350 HP 6v92TA/ V730. Even I don't miss a shift now. | ||
| RJ Long (Rjlong)
Registered Member Username: Rjlong Post Number: 1317 Registered: 12-2000 Posted From: 67.181.166.160 Rating: N/A |
Bart - Take a look at the "Articles of Interest" section of this board - you may find my comments on driving a stick shift coach helpful. As Jim asked, is this a five or six speed manual? Prevost has used a six speed that has a granny first gear and an unusual shift pattern that has driven many a new operator nuts until they figure it out. There may be a plaque on the dash or on the shift knob with the pattern. Jamo - No clutch brake on a 4104 - just takes practice. The above-mentioned article might help you, too. James - Of course you no longer miss a shift - all you do is "stab & steer!" ROFLMAO!!!  (But my comments about shifting an automatic might help smooth things out - not for you, but for Mama!) Isn't this a wonderfully crazy hobby!?!?! FWIW & HTH. . . | ||
| Bart Duncan (Bartman)
Registered Member Username: Bartman Post Number: 2 Registered: 11-2007 Posted From: 68.185.135.211 Rating: N/A |
Jim,Ron,RJ - thanks for the information! this is great! She does have a granny low - so I guess that she would be considered a 6 speed? - also on the way back from Texas to TN we almost froze to death not knowing how to turn the heat on! much to learn! | ||
| Ron Walker (Prevost82)
Registered Member Username: Prevost82 Post Number: 345 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 208.181.210.47 Rating: N/A |
Bart .. I sent you a shift pattern on a 6 speed .... check your email that is in your profile. Ron | ||
| Buswarrior (Buswarrior)
Registered Member Username: Buswarrior Post Number: 1109 Registered: 12-2000 Posted From: 76.68.120.54 Rating: N/A |
Hello. Prevost used a lot of those 6 speeds. Some are fond of descibing them as " W " shift patterns, versus the more traditional " H " shift pattern, due to one of the gears being all by itself in the pattern and beside the next gear, in the bottom row, IIRC. That may explain why the trouble finding gears.... there wasn't a gate where you expected one to put the shifter through. Ron, please refresh all of our memories with the pattern! happy coaching! buswarrior | ||
| Ian Giffin (Admin)
Board Administrator Username: Admin Post Number: 1028 Registered: 7-1997 Posted From: 24.239.7.250 Rating: N/A |
Hi Bart and all, This is the strange shift pattern that eludes your fingertips. I once described this as the French-Canadian's torture on the rest of the English speaking continent!  First gear is, indeed, a bull low. Used for starting off with a full passenger complement and all their luggage, basically, it was a creature comfort so as not to shake them at startup. So, start off in 2nd in a bus with just your family and a full water tank on board and you'll be fine. Gearing upwards usually presents no problems if you follow the pattern above. When gearing down, try this: presuming you shift from 6 to 5 ok, when going from 5 to 4, pull the gear shift backwards, then straight back forward as though you're pushing it back into 5th. A little finesse helps, as those big old outdoor, working, rough, calloused fists will likely not manhandle this particular downshift using brute force. Patience always :-) By the way, move your right knee right over to the steering column and move your butt over just a smidge left to get the shifter into reverse... and pull straight up whilst doing so. Good luck! Ian www.busnut.com | ||
| marvin pack (Gomer)
Registered Member Username: Gomer Post Number: 125 Registered: 3-2007 Posted From: 76.4.149.200 Rating: N/A |
after reading previous past on trannies, what is a clutch? is that what you start and stop with? Itis the pedal on the left side of the steerin column?? LOL I appreciate all of the comments on any item because of the wealth of knowledge and experience of all of you BUSNUTS ; Thanks again nuts! | ||
| David Evans (Dmd)
Registered Member Username: Dmd Post Number: 201 Registered: 10-2004 Posted From: 71.251.5.149 Rating: N/A |
Stab and Steer! what ever happened to FastFredric? | ||
| Buswarrior (Buswarrior)
Registered Member Username: Buswarrior Post Number: 1110 Registered: 12-2000 Posted From: 76.68.132.151 Rating: N/A |
Thanks |@n! All by itself in the TOP row... What the brain chooses to forget....how's the rest of that go? happy coaching! buswarrior |
