| Author | Message | ||
| Rick Johnson (Plywud)
Registered Member Username: Plywud Post Number: 11 Registered: 9-2007 Posted From: 24.17.125.224 Rating: N/A |
I just got new holding tanks and have 130 gallons of fresh and 85 each of grey and black. 130 gallons is upwards of an extra 1000 pounds to carry around, do you normally keep the fresh tank full always or do you run economy becuase you usually are staying in supported stops each night and an the occasional dry camp can be handled with alot less. RJ | ||
| John and Barb Tesser (Bigrigger)
Registered Member Username: Bigrigger Post Number: 24 Registered: 9-2007 Posted From: 24.197.246.104 Rating: N/A |
I don't know the answer, but I'm glad you asked the question. I am in the "buy the parts to build stage" and was figuring on 100 gal combined grey and black and 80 gals fresh. Maybe not enough? | ||
| Jack Conrad (Jackconrad)
Registered Member Username: Jackconrad Post Number: 673 Registered: 12-2000 Posted From: 76.3.169.171 Rating: N/A |
We have 100 gallon combined gray & black and 100 gallons fresh. If we are real conservative with our showers, we can go 10 days. We usually leave home with a full tank of fresh and an empty holding tank. At 8.3 pounds per gallon, a full fresh water tank is 830 pounds. This might be a lot for a small camper, but for a 35,000# bus conversion this is not much difference (6 passengers) Jack | ||
| Nick Badame Refrigeration Co. (Dnick85)
Registered Member Username: Dnick85 Post Number: 184 Registered: 2-2006 Posted From: 75.199.194.252 Rating: N/A |
Hi Rick, If I were to do it again, I would install as large of a tank that I can fit in the compartment. Hay, you don't have to fill it all the way if you don't need to. I would only fill it for the dry camping excursions. You know, better safe then sorry.... Right now we have 105 fresh, 105 gray, and 50 black. The black should have also been 105...?&*%*#@ Nick- | ||
| Bill 340 (Bill_340)
Registered Member Username: Bill_340 Post Number: 49 Registered: 7-2006 Posted From: 75.203.71.246 Rating: N/A |
You always should have enough to re fill your cooling system twice, incase of a breakdown, enough to live on for 3 days while you are dry camping in the repair yard,Along with dishes and COFFEE, | ||
| Jack Hart (Jackhartjr)
Registered Member Username: Jackhartjr Post Number: 6 Registered: 8-2007 Posted From: 64.12.117.73 Rating: N/A |
Because a lot of our camping will be in State Parks, (Long Key, Bahia Honda, Stone Mountain, NC, etc) which don't have sewer hookups, I plan to have big black and grey tanks. The water is usually no problem, you have that so I figure 100 gallons for that. We have a 30 black and 30 grey and 30 galley in an S&S right now. We get 3 to 4 days on the black, (Remember the bathroom sink goes in there too) a couple days on the grey shower and about 4 to 5 on the galley. If the Lady of the coach wants long showers, you better put the big tanks in there! | ||
| Bruce Henderson (Oonrahnjay)
Registered Member Username: Oonrahnjay Post Number: 181 Registered: 8-2004 Posted From: 72.12.39.78 Rating: N/A |
Nick Badame wrote: "Right now we have 105 fresh, 105 gray, and 50 black. The black should have also been 105...?&*%*#@" Nick, do you have a way to drain some from your grey tank into the black (although I guess it doesn't matter with a black that small)? I'm planning on 115 fresh, 80 black and 35 grey (but that's just the way that my available space has turned out). I will be able to drain a bit out of the grey if it fills first (and I expect it too ... but if it doesn't, I'll have a big black tank. I expect to do a lot of "dry camping". | ||
| Chuck Newman (Chuck_newman)
Registered Member Username: Chuck_newman Post Number: 241 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 64.69.32.251 Rating: N/A |
200 gals fresh, 100 gray, 50 black. Can use either fresh or gray to flush toilet. Always keep the fresh full (if possible) for emergencies -- mechanical, weather, natural disaster. | ||
| john w. roan (Chessie4905)
Registered Member Username: Chessie4905 Post Number: 756 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 71.58.48.5 Rating: N/A |
You should have less fresh water capacity than total of black and grey water- you don't want the possibility of black or grey to get entirely full. | ||
| john w. roan (Chessie4905)
Registered Member Username: Chessie4905 Post Number: 757 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 71.58.48.5 Rating: N/A |
Oh, and don't make your tanks too small, trying to save weight of water you might carry, as you can't easily change them later. Just carry less water if you are concerned by the weight. Check some of the private and commercially done conversions for sale in your size to see what they have used. Liquid tank capacitys are usually listed; then take the average of sizes would give you a good idea. | ||
| Ron Walker (Prevost82)
Registered Member Username: Prevost82 Post Number: 346 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 208.181.210.47 Rating: N/A |
I put in a 150 gal fresh water and 160 gal black/gray combined. I also put a bypass valve on the shower. Works well but there are times when I could use more capacity.... can you ever have enough when boondocking. Ron | ||
| James Stacy (Jimstacy)
Registered Member Username: Jimstacy Post Number: 118 Registered: 1-2001 Posted From: 76.248.108.3 Rating: N/A |
We have two 85 gal fresh, 95 grey and 95 black. Fresh tanks have a shut off on each tank to a common manifold. I keep one tank shut off at all times for emergency. (Came back to the bus one time to discover a fitting had failed and pump had emptied one tank on the ground.) No convenient source of fresh water available, fortunately we still had one tank in reserve. 95 gal black has always been more than enough, grey can be a problem. I need to drain vanity into black tank. That should help. A big tank can always carry less than capacity, a small tank can be a pain. | ||
| Glenn Williams (Glenn)
Registered Member Username: Glenn Post Number: 110 Registered: 6-2006 Posted From: 216.163.57.14 Rating: N/A |
In our old bus, we had 60 gal fresh, 50 gal black(Never got anywhere near full, even after 7days. Our grey was too small, 40 gal I think. These came with the bus. 2 of us could manage 7 days by showering every other day. Otherwise, we were not particularly cautious. We now have a son and plan to dry camp more often, so we have 100 gal fresh, 100 grey and 40 black. Only solid waste goes into the black. Both sinks and shower will go into the grey. Sean Welsh had a neat idea. He has a separate tank for drinking water only. Since I have an extran tank and pump, I think I will try the same thing. | ||
| Laryn Christley (Barn_owl)
Registered Member Username: Barn_owl Post Number: 93 Registered: 10-2006 Posted From: 71.254.35.124 Rating: N/A |
I have 120/60/60. I find the grey fills up fast and it takes forever to make a dent in the black tank and that’s with 8 people using it. If I were to redo my setup I would split the grey/black 70%/30% and I would still have plenty of black reserve. One day I am going to setup some way to transfer grey to black. Laryn (Message edited by barn_owl on November 23, 2007) | ||
| Paul Lawry (Dreamscape)
Registered Member Username: Dreamscape Post Number: 174 Registered: 5-2007 Posted From: 64.40.222.139 Rating: N/A |
I have 100 for fresh, 100 for gray/black. I really like the mixture in the gray/black as it makes it easier to dump, it mixes very well and does not clog at all. | ||
| Debbie and Joe Cannarozzi (Joe_camper)
Registered Member Username: Joe_camper Post Number: 67 Registered: 10-2006 Posted From: 71.239.202.82 Rating: N/A |
Put the biggest fresh tank you can fit. Fill it not to worry about weight and weather you have a gray and holding tank both or just a single combined holding make sure the capacity is greater than the fresh water tank + the hot water heater + 10 more gal. to correctly accomidate for the T.D.F.-turd displacement factor. We have 125 fresh and 125 holding and I installed a grey water bypass. This is the first camper that did not have a seperate gray and holding tank, instead a combined one, didn't like the notion at first but it has proven to be a non issue. | ||
| Michael Sheldon (Msheldon)
Registered Member Username: Msheldon Post Number: 49 Registered: 10-2006 Posted From: 68.230.115.166 Rating: N/A |
Everyone's needs vary depending on how they use their bus. In my case, we never have hookups, and I may be supporting as many as 6-8 adults for four or more days. So, I plan on putting in a LOT of water capacity. I'm currently considering two 95 gallon fresh water tanks, plus an equal volume of gray and 50-75 gallons black. I'm also looking to set up the tanks so the gray can be flushed through the black tanks, or flushed separately. | ||
| Jack Hart (Jackhartjr)
Registered Member Username: Jackhartjr Post Number: 7 Registered: 8-2007 Posted From: 64.12.117.73 Rating: N/A |
Michael, go for the biggest you can for that many folks onboard. The bays in that 'Cruiser' can handle the size and weight! Because of the way the air tanks set in the rear bays...I will try to find large volume tanks that can fit along the back of the air tanks to save room. As noted above we are only getting 3 to 4 days on a 30 gallon black tank...it's two of us and the bathroom sink goes in that black tank too. I am afraid if you are shooting for just 50 to 75 gallons in the black you will not have enough. For what it's worth. Jack | ||
| Laryn Christley (Barn_owl)
Registered Member Username: Barn_owl Post Number: 94 Registered: 10-2006 Posted From: 71.254.35.124 Rating: N/A |
A lot depends on what you plumb into your black tank; I only have the toilet going there. I am amazed that some are able to fill a black tank up. Two adults, six kids, and I try to put as much water down the toilet as I can because I want the tank to drain well when I dump. Any idea how much poo and pee it takes to fill one up? I still don’t know, but it’s a lot! Anyone filling a black tank up of any size is putting more than that in it. I am not questioning the fact that apparently some are filling their black tanks up; I personally have not been able to. The places we stay have electric only so I am going the whole stretch on what I carry. I have also started to fill my 120gal fresh tank only to 50-70% because we never use it all and I don’t feel the need to carry it around just to waste it. I dump and refill before every trip, and even after cutting back, I still put a lot of water onto my yard when we get home. How you use your systems will make a big difference. We tend to conserve a lot when out compared to our lifestyle at home. If you want to live the same on the road as you do at home then you need the largest systems you can squeeze into your machine. My 4106 has limited space, so if I were to redo what I have, I personally would downsize my system; but, if I was building a conversion and I didn’t know my usage, it would suck big time coming up short. I know the busses are able to carry the weight, but a little here and a little there adds up. I can tell the difference when I am traveling light or heavy. If I was to drive enough, it would end up factoring into the bottom line, just ask any trucker. Cool thing about these boards is you realize that there is more than one side to the story and many right ways do what you want. Good luck, Laryn | ||
| Don Evans (Doninwa)
Registered Member Username: Doninwa Post Number: 94 Registered: 1-2007 Posted From: 66.45.165.58 Rating: N/A |
In the S&S days we had separate holding tanks. Was annoying when one got full before the other. Only had trouble getting black tank to drain once. That was enough. First bus came with combined tank and we never have had any reason to want it any other way. Never any wasted space. No need to 'prime' it with water like a black only tank. Simple, one valve, one vent, less plumbing, less potential leaks. Does not matter if it's just me on board or a family gathering and the bus is serving as the rest room. (It happened on a trip to the river for a summer day of swimming.) Never a problem draining. The thing is, you can not always predict how the bus may be used in the future. If you have separate tanks you need to plan a way to connect the gray and black at a minimum. It only takes three full size valves. One on each tank and one to block the drain line so when you take the cap off to hook up a hose the drain line is empty. Would be best if they (the tanks) are at the same level so if one fills up you can open the connection and continue use until they are both full. No guessing how much to drain into the other. That is how we received the new bus. Will see how it works. If any grief will change it to a single system. Don 4107 PS: Don't know if it matters but even when hooked up I leave the drain valve closed and open it when needed for a vigorous flush. | ||
| Jerry Campbell (Jerrync)
Registered Member Username: Jerrync Post Number: 100 Registered: 7-2006 Posted From: 75.181.119.118 Rating: N/A |
we have 125 gal. water tank and 125 gray black and I like how it works. Makes it very good when it is time to dump.When it is time to fill the water tank it is time to dump. | ||
| Linda & Kirby Karlsson (Linda4104fl)
Registered Member Username: Linda4104fl Post Number: 18 Registered: 7-2006 Posted From: 68.30.107.34 Rating: N/A |
We have 100 fresh, about 65 gray and 35 black. Have never filled the black (toilet only) but the gray (shower and sinks) has been known to fill up. Wish we had more than 100 fresh. | ||
| Dale Houston (Songman)
Registered Member Username: Songman Post Number: 34 Registered: 8-2006 Posted From: 70.92.99.202 Rating: N/A |
I was planning to use a fresh/combined system in my bus. Now I have acquired a washer/dryer that I am going to install in a bay. In my mind I am thinking that I now probably need to have separate grey and black tanks. Does anyone have experience with this? Do the washers use enough water to warrant a separate grey tank? I have the Splendide combo washer/dryer. | ||
| Jack Conrad (Jackconrad)
Registered Member Username: Jackconrad Post Number: 681 Registered: 12-2000 Posted From: 76.3.169.171 Rating: N/A |
Dale, Not sure how much water the Splendide uses, but remember that you will drain your water tank by an amount equal to that going into your wast tank. If in a campground, it won't make any difference, since you can drain daily if necessary. If dry camping, when you need water, you can dump at the same time you are filling your fresh water tank. I don't think many places would want you dumping soapy water on the ground. Jack | ||
| Florida Cliff (Floridacracker)
Registered Member Username: Floridacracker Post Number: 350 Registered: 7-2004 Posted From: 24.27.228.156 Rating: N/A |
We have 120 fresh, 100 gray and 80 black. The gray and black can be tied together thru valving if needed. IF, you can train the family into sea showers it will last us 4 or 5 days...YMMV Cliff | ||
| Dale Houston (Songman)
Registered Member Username: Songman Post Number: 38 Registered: 8-2006 Posted From: 70.92.99.202 Rating: N/A |
I'll just take my 10 year old daughter out to the side of the bus and hose her down every couple of days!  | ||
| Bruce Henderson (Oonrahnjay)
Registered Member Username: Oonrahnjay Post Number: 187 Registered: 8-2004 Posted From: 72.12.39.78 Rating: N/A |
Dale Houston wrote "I'll just take my 10 year old daughter out to the side of the bus and hose her down every couple of days! " __. Now that you mention it, is anyone else planning to install fittings so that an outdoor shower (taps and head) can be fitted in moments? I'm thinking that it would be rare when you'd have 1) privacy and 2) a suitable drain area, but when you did -- on a warm summer day -- I think it would be lovely! | ||
| Simon Ayriss (Design_dog)
Registered Member Username: Design_dog Post Number: 56 Registered: 3-2007 Posted From: 69.227.189.77 Rating: N/A |
I haven't got to my plumbing yet but I had two wild ideas aside from a standard fresh / black-grey setup. One was actually adding a outdoor shower head from a bay. It would be as simple a connection not far from the fresh water tank. And my idea was using one of those cheap shower head water heaters just for the outside shower. Not sure if they work or even well but I thought if it did, it would be great to have outdoor hot water, and it would be separate from my main hot water system. Just a crazy idea but might work. Reasons to do this are: wouldn't tax my main water system. Quick temporary hot water. If my water heating system breaks down while boondocking I still have some temp hot water. Don't have to fire up the main water system for quick use or wait for possible hot water to travel through piping. Many uses are washing dogs outside or parts, dishes, picnic table? Of course if you have an advanced water heating system it is unnecessary I guess. Downfalls: Uses electricity not well suited for boondocking. says around 2400 watts. My main concern is. Electricity and water don't mix especially in a bay. But shouldn't be a problem if your careful[?]. Anyone every seen one in use? In terms of camping, not sure about full-timing, but I'm a fan of any soap thats bio-degradable. Also, as a side note to fresh water tanks. I hope to carry 5 gallon sparkletts type water bottles and possibly a short stack water tower for drinking water and cooking. -- just my crazy ramblings, not sure if they are sound. | ||
| Kevin Mossman (Ktmossman)
Registered Member Username: Ktmossman Post Number: 7 Registered: 9-2007 Posted From: 216.46.98.249 Rating: N/A |
Wow... That brings back memories. We used that kind of shower head when I spent 18 months in Central America (primarily Honduras) back in the early '90s. We called them "suicide showers" because the local power was so inconsistent that every few months the wires running to the shower head would melt through and your morning shower would be interrupted by a cascade of sparks. Good times!! |