| Author | Message | ||
| Frank Allen (Frank66)
Registered Member Username: Frank66 Post Number: 66 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 64.12.117.73 Rating: N/A |
have a 4106, left rear air bags go to the bottom in 1 hr, put new check valve in leveling valve but did no good, sprayed soapy water over air bags and valve but seen nothing, unable to hear any ait leak, any ideas will be appreciated Frank Allen 4106 | ||
| joe padberg (Joemc7ab)
Registered Member Username: Joemc7ab Post Number: 218 Registered: 6-2004 Posted From: 66.38.159.33 Rating: N/A |
Airbag plated off? If not suspect leak in airbeam. Joe. | ||
| marvin pack (Gomer)
Registered Member Username: Gomer Post Number: 210 Registered: 3-2007 Posted From: 76.4.151.87 Rating: N/A |
joe a lot of the gm's as well as mci's use the beam above the air bag for a compression tank and over time they develop holes in them from rusting thru the metal. they have a plate that goes over the hole and seals it from the air beam. sometimes the ride will be different but somebody here on bno has the part numbers and info for you to look at. a different air bag will give you a better ride after convering it all over. some has said it rides and handles better also. gomer | ||
| Bob MacIsaac (Wildbob24)
Registered Member Username: Wildbob24 Post Number: 4 Registered: 5-2007 Posted From: 74.184.58.175 Rating: N/A |
If there are no visible leaks at the valve or bags, you may have a perforated line. Need to squirt them with the soapy water as well. BTW, the 4106 doesn't have air beams. | ||
| Bill Gerrie (Bill_gerrie)
Registered Member Username: Bill_gerrie Post Number: 147 Registered: 3-2006 Posted From: 209.50.74.42 Rating: N/A |
Frank Air up the system with a shop air compressor so you don't have the noise of the engine. Spray every fitting and bag with a soapy water mixture. Look in your bus manual and you will see there is a metal piston inside the air bag as well as a metal plate at the top. They are prone to rusting out. Go underneath BUT BE CAREFUL AND BLOCK THE SUSPENSION. Disconnect the leveling valve arm and raise the bag in question up higher and spray water at the top. This will tell you if the steel plate at the top is okay. Spray all around the bottom and underneath the round plate the bag sits on. This will check the steel piston. You might also want to hold a bottle of water around the exhaust tube from the leveling valve to see if it is leaking internally. If the bag goes down in and hour you should be able to find the leak very easily. Bill | ||
| James Stacy (Jimstacy)
Registered Member Username: Jimstacy Post Number: 125 Registered: 1-2001 Posted From: 76.201.5.79 Rating: N/A |
4104 was last GM with air beams. Best leak detector I've found is kids bubble soap in a spray bottle. Bill Gerrie is right (again, he does that a lot) in suggesting you inflate the rolling lobe bag to check the normally folded surface and mounting plates. I know you changed the check valve, but the levelers are by far the biggest cause of suspension leaks. Can you cap off the line to the leveler to eliminate it from the test? Perhaps temporarily replace the leveler with a schrader valve and inflate manually. As Bill said, a leak that goes down in an hour is a big leak. HTH. Jim Stacy | ||
| joe padberg (Joemc7ab)
Registered Member Username: Joemc7ab Post Number: 219 Registered: 6-2004 Posted From: 66.38.159.33 Rating: N/A |
I am here to learn. Learned something new today, because of the simmilarity between the 04 and 06 I assumed they both had airbeams which in fact is not the case. Have had a saying for a long time that if you did not learn something new each day it had not been a good day. Today has been a good day. Joe. | ||
| Gus Causbie (Gusc)
Registered Member Username: Gusc Post Number: 624 Registered: 11-2005 Posted From: 208.54.200.190  Rating: N/A |
Joe, I would have said the same thing because my 4104 and the 4106 look so much alike I often assume they are about the same. I thought the difference was mostly in the engine and headlight setup? Now because of recent posts I know the rear window and air bags are different - slowly but surely!! | ||
| john w. roan (Chessie4905)
Registered Member Username: Chessie4905 Post Number: 948 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 71.58.48.5  Rating: N/A |
If you disconnect the air line going to the leaking air bag, coming from the leveling valve and make up some fittings to attach a tire stem type valve to it, you can air it up separately; block off the line from the leveling valve temp. If it still leaks down, remove bag and associated parts and repair. If you are going to be under there while you are airing up etc., wear some earplugs and eye protection in case a bag would blow out while close. Also, especially of course, block up the coach before getting under it. | ||
| Bill Gerrie (Bill_gerrie)
Registered Member Username: Bill_gerrie Post Number: 150 Registered: 3-2006 Posted From: 209.50.74.38 Rating: N/A |
James Thanks for the kudos. That is a great idea for the schrader valve. Learn something every day. That would certainly tell you if if the bag is the culprit. Bill | ||
| Frank Allen (Frank66)
Registered Member Username: Frank66 Post Number: 67 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 64.12.117.73 Rating: N/A |
thanks guys, some good ideas here, i cant figure out with a leak that defltes both bags in a hr i should be able to hear the air but wasnt able , there are no air beams, the problem is with the plumbing is you cant see the feeder line without dropping the bag, gonna go out and try again. thanks to all for your thoughts Frank allen | ||
| Tom Caffrey (Pvcces)
Registered Member Username: Pvcces Post Number: 1181 Registered: 5-2001 Posted From: 65.74.66.116 Rating: N/A |
Frank, you need a teenager that has not hurt his ears with loud music to listen for the leak. It can be surprizing the difference between young and old for hearing air leaks. Good luck. Tom Caffrey PD4106-2576 Suncatcher Ketchikan, Alaska | ||
| larry currier (Larryc)
Registered Member Username: Larryc Post Number: 164 Registered: 2-2007 Posted From: 207.200.116.13 Rating: N/A |
Frank, Moisture is a problem we have to live with when we use airbags. Normally the closest bag to the air tank will acumilate enough water to rust the bottom of the bag out about every 5 years. You can't hear it leak because it leaks between the roll in the bag and the base. When these bags rust out they will be slow to build air at first and they will build faster as the bladder seals the base. If the bag is rusted out the bolt will probably seize in the bag. You may have to cut the bolt head off to get it apart. | ||
| Jeffrey Smith (Greenhornet)
Registered Member Username: Greenhornet Post Number: 107 Registered: 12-2006 Posted From: 76.110.43.40 Rating: N/A |
Thanks again, and you guys are right about learning things every day. I just had to look up and just learned what a Schrader valve is! | ||
| Tom Caffrey (Pvcces)
Registered Member Username: Pvcces Post Number: 1183 Registered: 5-2001 Posted From: 65.74.66.116 Rating: N/A |
Jeffrey, I think you want to add an "e" to the middle of that word if you want to do searches for it. For what it's worth. Tom Caffrey PD4106-2576 Suncatcher Ketchikan, Alaska | ||
| Richard Bowyer (Drivingmisslazy)
Registered Member Username: Drivingmisslazy Post Number: 2043 Registered: 1-2001 Posted From: 75.108.85.14 Rating: N/A |
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Jump to: navigation, search A Schrader valve (with cap) on a bicycle tire A Schrader valve (with cap) on a bicycle tire Unusually tall Schrader valve Unusually tall Schrader valve Tom, Are you sure he needs an "e" added? Richard | ||
| Buswarrior (Buswarrior)
Registered Member Username: Buswarrior Post Number: 1227 Registered: 12-2000 Posted From: 76.66.19.241  Rating: N/A |
We must be careful, Schrader is a manufacturer, though we popularly refer to those tire inflation style valves as "Schrader valves" Schrader makes some other stuff in some of our buses too, darn, can't remember now...anyone? happy coaching! buswarrior | ||
| Tom Caffrey (Pvcces)
Registered Member Username: Pvcces Post Number: 1184 Registered: 5-2001 Posted From: 65.74.66.116 Rating: N/A |
I'm sorry, guys; I guess that I blew that one! Thanks for the corrections. Tom Caffrey PD4106-2576 Suncatcher Ketchikan, Alaska | ||
| Frank Allen (Frank66)
Registered Member Username: Frank66 Post Number: 73 Registered: 10-2005 Posted From: 64.12.117.73 Rating: N/A |
Thanks to all for the help, i rigged up a fitting and installed it so i could use shop air to inflate that left side , i then could hear the leak but sounded like it was coming from the brake, but it wasnt, it was the air bag, had a hole in it, got easy to see when i blew it up higher, got a new bag from Luke , should be ok when i get it on. thanks guys Frank allen 4106 |