| Author | Message | ||
| Celia (Cc_racer)
Registered Member Username: Cc_racer Post Number: 1 Registered: 5-2008 Posted From: 69.237.48.249 Rating: N/A |
Hello everyone, I just bought a bus! A 1960 GMC 4106 that I found on eBay. It was 500 miles away, but I drove it home (with my dad following me) last Monday with no problems other than a tire blow out (whole story in itself lol). I loved driving it and I think I did a very good job. My family and friends are amazed that A GIRL wants to drive a bus! Anyway, I am sure that I am going to ask a million questions about my new baby here, but thought I would start with one that has my dad and I a little confused. What kind of transmission do I have?!?! The engine is a 8V-71 and all I can tell about the tranny is that it is a 3 speed automatic (and it says V drive right on it). The man who previously had the bus passed away so I cannot ask him. The son who sold me the bus told me it is NOT an Allison, but that is all he really knew. The owners manual came with the bus, but nothing in it mentions an automatic transmission, only manual. It LOOKS like something that would have come original on the bus even though most of the things I have read seem to say that 4106's only came with manuals. I know I'm really showing my ignorance here, but not knowing this is really driving me nuts! Any information you could give me would be greatly appreciated. Thanks | ||
| Douglas Wotring (Tekebird)
Registered Member Username: Tekebird Post Number: 352 Registered: 10-2004 Posted From: 71.230.13.96 Rating: N/A |
Celia, the 06 came only with a 4 speed manual. if your tansmission hasa a V on it it is likely a Allison VS which came in a few different models. is the shifter a switch or a lever like in a car? It is indeed an Allison tranny Which manual do you have? You should have a parts manual, mainteneance manual, should probably have an 8v-71 Highway engine manual as well as the parts and maint manual for the tranny, All on the bus, just in case. | ||
| Paul Lawry (Dreamscape)
Registered Member Username: Dreamscape Post Number: 274 Registered: 5-2007 Posted From: 70.167.209.179  Rating: N/A |
Welcome Celia! Can't help with your questions, we own an Eagle. Just wanted to let you know you can ask any questions here, very knowlegeable folk that will lead you in the right direction. I know when I drove our Eagle from Ohio to CA I had the most incredible feelings. What a trip. Doug is right, get all the manuals suggested. Enjoy and keep us informed. Paul | ||
| John and Barb Tesser (Bigrigger)
Registered Member Username: Bigrigger Post Number: 81 Registered: 9-2007 Posted From: 24.197.246.104  Rating: N/A |
Celia, Welcome to the world of Bus Nuts. These things will drive you crazy and become a large hole in your driveway into which you can pour money, but you gotta love em! The people on here are outstanding and will help you in any way that they can. I can't help you with your trans inquiry as we have an MCI but good luck to ya. John and Barb | ||
| Dan West (Utahclaimjumper)
Registered Member Username: Utahclaimjumper Post Number: 100 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 208.66.38.60 Rating: N/A |
When you open the rear engine cover (or tail gate)the end of the transmission will have GM V drive in raised letters on it. A flat spot on the trans on the passenger side will have a stamped number begining with VS xxxxx It is an Allison VS2-8 or a VS2-6, both good transmissions.>>>Dan | ||
| James Stacy (Jimstacy)
Registered Member Username: Jimstacy Post Number: 135 Registered: 1-2001 Posted From: 75.41.17.206 Rating: N/A |
Welcome, Celia, The transmission is 99% likely to be an Allison, probably installed after market, although the 4106 was the first GM intercity coach available with an automatic, as far as I know. Early V drives were VS2 models that feel like a 2 speed. Final gear lockup was a very tall ratio. Not many of these still around. Later models were V-730, the most common. They were a 3 speed with locking torque converter. Rare versions had a retarder, and/or a right hand rotation input. Two input gear ratios were available (under drive input (mostly in transits), and overdrive input (intercity coaches). Latest model was V731, an computer controlled version used with later model DDEC engines. Yours is highly likely to be a V730 with overdrive input. Sooner or later, you will need a service manual and a parts manual for the coach, transmission and engine. This could wind up as 6 separate manuals depending on printing version, although the parts manual could cover all three subjects. These books should be your very first purchase as the information in them is invaluable. They cover how things work, proper use and maintenance, repair procedures, part numbers, etc. Good luck with your new acquisition. Keep us posted on your progress. Do you intend to keep it as a seated coach or convert it to a motor home? Jim Stacy | ||
| Douglas Wotring (Tekebird)
Registered Member Username: Tekebird Post Number: 353 Registered: 10-2004 Posted From: 71.59.75.212 Rating: N/A |
Jim, I am pretty sure you are incorrect. I am fairly certain no 4106 ever left the factory with an Auto. also the V on the transmission is certainly a sign of a Allison VS transmission the 730 did not have any stamping like this | ||
| Douglas Wotring (Tekebird)
Registered Member Username: Tekebird Post Number: 354 Registered: 10-2004 Posted From: 71.59.75.212 Rating: N/A |
additionally, it can't be a 1960 model as the 4106 was first produced in 1961. something you may choose to fix when titling in your name. | ||
| Tom Caffrey (Pvcces)
Registered Member Username: Pvcces Post Number: 1209 Registered: 5-2001 Posted From: 65.74.72.93 Rating: N/A |
Celia, welcome to the club! Somebody fouled up the information on this coach, as Doug has said. There were three locations to find the model and serial number, the easiest being if the builder's plate is still in place at the top of the entry stairs. If you will post the whole number, someone on this board should be able to furnish you enough information to get the year and model number straightened out. The number will look like the one in my signature line, below. The VS2 transmission requires the least cutting and welding to install in this coach. It is a two speed. The V730 is usually the one that is installed these days, it's a three speed and is readily available in many places. Installing it requires considerable cutting of bulkheads. Both of these transmissions have lockup converters. Automatics can have a significant impact of fuel mileage for a number of reasons. In good shape, it's not uncommon for the standard shift 4106 conversion to break 10 MPG. The two speed autos seem to have the best top speeds and fuel mileage, but are not very good on startability. The three speeds have good startability but because of their gearing and perhaps other reasons, do not usually get the best fuel mileage. Fill us in and ask your questions. There's a wealth of information on these boards. For what it's worth. Tom Caffrey PD4106-2576 Suncatcher Ketchikan, Alaska | ||
| James Stacy (Jimstacy)
Registered Member Username: Jimstacy Post Number: 137 Registered: 1-2001 Posted From: 75.41.17.206 Rating: N/A |
Doug, If I'm wrong it sure as heck wouldn't be the first time. You are very correct tht 1960 was the last year for th 4104, I missed that in her note. The earliest '06 was indeed 1961. I have no records to verify options on delivered '06's. I was going on a memory of a conversation with Garry Dean regarding GM automatics. BTW did you know that the first prototype samples (about 4 pieces) of the V-700 series delivered to GM by Allison were in fact 4 speed units? As I was told by a retired GM Truck and Bus engineer, GM requested a change because the over all length was too great and required an excessively shortened drive shaft. Allison removed one planetary gearset and shortened the case. Sure wished I had one more gear in my 4104. While you might certainly be correct that no '06's were factory delivered with automatics, it is a moot point. The point is she now has an automatic in the coach regardless of who installed it. Without better records than she seems to have available, an inspection to determine model or serial number would be the best way of resolving the question of what she has. I remember a newby a few years back who bought a "1960 4106". It turned out to be a 4104! Thanks for the info. Jim Stacy | ||
| Bill Gerrie (Bill_gerrie)
Registered Member Username: Bill_gerrie Post Number: 171 Registered: 3-2006 Posted From: 209.50.73.157 Rating: N/A |
Celia If you could send a picture of the tranny showing the side of it we could identify it. It could be a VS2 or a V730. If you get the bus on the road and hold down the accelerator and count the shifts we can tell as well. The VS2 has 2 shifts and the V730 feels like 3 shifts due to a lock up in second gear. Bill | ||
| RJ Long (Rjlong)
Registered Member Username: Rjlong Post Number: 1384 Registered: 12-2000 Posted From: 67.181.166.160  Rating: N/A |
Celia - Check your private emailbox for some info on your coach. Bill - V-730s are often mistaken as four speeds, especially by newbies, because when the torque converter locks up, it feels like another shift. VS models are similar - feels like a third shift when the torque converter locks up, even though the transmission's a two-speed. (A giant Powerglide!!) | ||
| john w. roan (Chessie4905)
Registered Member Username: Chessie4905 Post Number: 1177 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 71.58.110.9  Rating: N/A |
If it is a VS series, the "v" drive will be on a plate with about 8 bolts holding it on and about 6 to 8 inches in diameter the piece this plate is attached to in turn is attached to the case with about 18 bolts , and probably is about 18 inches in diameter. I'm going by my parts book pictures.The end of this case will be mostly squared off. The v730 has more of a somewhat cone shape to the end with a 1 1/2wide inch by about 10 inch long boss on it with no markings and no plates. the whole housing cover assy unbolts. The VS series model number plate will be on the top of the trans, right behind the solenoid that the wiring attaches. You'll need to open the right hand side engine compartment door to see it. Probably will need to wipe off the oil and grease to read it. | ||
| Celia (Cc_racer)
Registered Member Username: Cc_racer Post Number: 2 Registered: 5-2008 Posted From: 69.237.48.249 Rating: N/A |
Thank you for the responses and welcomes! Unfortunately, I am using a friends computer at their house and am not with the bus at the moment or I would find my serial number! Rest assured, I will find it and post it here. To shift the tranny, there are two toggle switches mounted to the left of the driver: one switch, if pushed forward, puts you in "drive", while pulling the switch back puts you in reverse. Straight up is neutral. The second toggle swith moves left to right. Far left is first gear, straight up is second, and far right is third. If left in far left position, it shifts through the gears on its own. This is the first bus I have driven. Is this a common set up? Also, I have uploaded a pic of the bus and one of the tranny. It is registered as a 1960 GMC PD-4106 Is this the wrong year, or the wrong model? Thanks Again <img><br/>Shot with <a href="http://profile.imageshack.us/camerabuy.php?model=DCR-HC96&make=SONY" target="_new">DCR-HC96</a> at 2008-06-09 <img><br/>Shot with <a href="http://profile.imageshack.us/camerabuy.php?model=DCR-HC96&make=SONY" target="_new">DCR-HC96</a> at 2008-06-09 | ||
| Laryn Christley (Barn_owl)
Registered Member Username: Barn_owl Post Number: 452 Registered: 10-2006 Posted From: 70.110.0.51  Rating: N/A |
Old buses that have been tilted for the wrong year is more common than one might think. My bus was titled as a ’63 (Calf title) but it is a ’62. My father’s was titled as a ’66 (PA title) but is a ’64. We had them corrected (VA title) so we can run the correct year antique tags on them otherwise we wouldn’t have cared. | ||
| Celia (Cc_racer)
Registered Member Username: Cc_racer Post Number: 3 Registered: 5-2008 Posted From: 69.237.48.249 Rating: N/A |
Opps, those links don't work! I'll try again. Here are the pics (I hope!). http://us.a2.yahoofs.com/groups/g_1392761/4994/__sr_/b957.jpg?grgRbTIBHAgBXsoi http://us.a2.yahoofs.com/groups/g_1392761/4994/__sr_/2afc.jpg?grgRbTIB5RgYEB9. | ||
| Paul Lawry (Dreamscape)
Registered Member Username: Dreamscape Post Number: 278 Registered: 5-2007 Posted From: 70.167.209.179 Rating: N/A |
First one is OK, second says "don't have access to the server".. Thanks for posting. |