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Message |
Wes Jackson (205.188.209.11)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, October 10, 2002 - 10:30 pm: | |
Found s decent deal on a 4106. Whats the story about finding engine, brake, aand other component parts. Are they difficult to find? Are there any obsolete parts. any info will be appreciated.
BUSFEVER |
RJ Long (Rjlong) (24.127.74.29)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, October 10, 2002 - 11:54 pm: | |
Wes -
First off, is the coach already converted, or is it still in "revenue service" or seated coach configuration?
If it's still in revenue service condition, then you have to look at the logistics of a vehicle which the newest ones are 37 years old, vs picking up one of the excellent used MCIs that are available for not much difference in cost.
It's VERY easy to sink a LOT of money into an old chassis, the amount can often exceed the cost of buying a much newer chassis in better condition, especially in today's depressed situation.
Right now, it's a buyer's market, but a seller's nightmare, particularly if the seller made a poor choice of a shell initially.
If the coach is already converted, it becomes a whole different ballgame. Now you have to look at two different components of the vehicle: chassis AND house systems. As far as the chassis is concerned, see above. As far as house systems, does it meet the requirements YOU have for what YOU want to do with it? Are you thinking of extended boondocking? Simple weekend getaways? Vacations utilizing campgrounds with hookups? You have to determine what YOU want to do with your coach, and then build or remodel to suit your needs. That's a major part of what makes this hobby both fun and cantankerous at the same time!
Oh, and don't forget MAMA! She has to live with the beast too, and if mama ain't happy, ain't NOBODY happy!
As for the 4106 itself, they're wonderful coaches. Basically all aluminum, they're lightweight, with a decent power-to-weight ratio provided by the 8V71 Detroit, and get good fuel mileage (for a coach of this vintage) at reasonable highway speeds. Among many in the bus industry, they're known as the "sports car of buses" because of their handling characteristics.
All came from the factory with four-speed manual transmissions, altho many have now been converted to automatics. (Here's one of those things where it might be better to buy a unit that already has an automatic up front, if that's MAMA's preference.)
Powertrain parts are not difficult to find if you know where to look. Engine parts are as close as your local Detroit Diesel parts house. Brake components are best sourced thru either several of the major bus supply warehouses, or HD truck parts places that specialize in air brakes. Manual gearbox parts require some digging, again, major bus supply houses are your best bets. The rear axle ring and pinion assemblies are highly prized, so expensive if needed. Suspension parts are shared with lots of other makes that use air.
Are there obsolete parts? Of course, the coach is 37+ years old! Front OEM turn signal lenses are the first to come to mind, front and rear center "Michigan Marker" lamp assemblies, front and rear corner clearance lamp lenses, especially the RH ones (altho an outfit in FL is reproducing these), many exterior trim pieces, and so on. Oh, and forget trying to replace the big rear window, the glass hasn't been available in years. That's just a few, and some of the reasons so many people who do have an '06 put front and rear fiberglass caps on them, just to be legal.
Sounds a little like I'm bashing the 4106, but I'm not - I own one myself. I love the coach, but I also realize what I'm up against. . . and it's not getting easier.
Let me make a suggestion here: BEFORE you plunk down any of your hard-earned cash on a coach, order and read "Beginner's Guide to Converted Coaches" by Larry Plachno, the publisher of National Bus Trader, an industry trade magazine. You can get it either from Amazon.com or direct from NBT at www.busmag.com. It will be the best money you'll ever spend on this hobby, believe me!
Out of curiosity, two things: What part of the country are you in? And if you can get the VIN of this coach, I can tell you who originally purchased it from GMC and when it was delivered new.
HTH,
RJ
PD4106-2784
Fresno CA |
FAST FRED (63.215.234.50)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, October 11, 2002 - 5:52 am: | |
AS another 4106 owner there are some delights to this coach , that are basically unavilable elsewhere.
RL has discussed the superb driving , but the best is the Monocoque aluminum construction.
The thousands of man hours that went into these GM's is mostly aircraft style construction, impossible to duplicate today with out spending millions.
While trim pieces need to come from as specialist like LUKE at US Coach,
YES even the Michigan markers IN THE ORIGONAL GM BOX!!
are still ON the shelf.
OF ALL the coaches the GM have the best chance at another 50 years.
When the US Congress basically put GM out of the coach business ( None understood business enough to understand a de-facto monopoly may not be BAD),
GM just sold the business to someone with a different name.
So the excellent mega buck engineering went to the next owners.
This means that all the 4 stroke V drive transits , will become "Fair Pickins" as they hit the scrap sales.
So for the future a 4 stroke ,and (unfortunatly) auto tranny , big front brakes and high cut angle power steering , newer non "gold" rear axle , with big brakes ect are coming down the line.
A scrap transit for $1500 to $3000 would be the IDEAL parts store for all the GM owners.
Have seen them on E bay already ,for under $3000 so the good pickins is coming!!
If Nova will create the conversion cradle , it should be a bolt together HEAVY job.
Most coach items are usually "ONCE" jobs.
So as long as the BODY stays in OK shape you will have a "forever" coach.
AS new 35 ft coaches are rare today the price will hold thru out the decades,
for the FEW that can enjoy "The Sports Car of Coaches".
FAST FRED PD 4106 2582 |
don (Bottomacher) (216.130.156.53)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, October 11, 2002 - 8:23 am: | |
Buses are a lot like horses. They are big, heavy, dirty like you've never seen, and LOT of work. They must be exercised often and thought about nearly constantly. They cost a pile even if you don't use them, and a ten percent use-to-maintenance ratio is probably pretty good. But there's nothing like driving a 4106 down the road on your first trip, especially a long trip, or just admiring it in your driveway. Of course there are obsolete parts; if you can't fabricate, improvise, and generally fix machines, you'll find yourself at the mercy of some truly unforgettable folks, especially at truck stops and towing services. Fortunately, the 06 is pretty basic, except for the electrics maybe, and is really not too hard to work on (eat lots of Wheaties and buy a good impact wrench.) Most of all, find out who knows what he's talking about, and LISTEN. If you read this board daily, it won't take long to recognize the folks who know what they are saying. Luke at US Coach is probably the single greatest source of help for your 06 (he sure has been for me)- he's knowledgeable, glad to help, and honest. Some on this board will sell you junk and disappear, but Luke is there for the long run, and acts like it. Fortunately, there's a lot of help out there, and it's probably no harder than restoring an Essex or Hupmobile. (If you don't know what they are, you're probably too young to own an 06 anyway.)GOOD LUCK |
OlMoldy (208.18.102.150)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, October 11, 2002 - 4:31 pm: | |
Like the Honky Tonk song "YOU GOT THE MONEY HONEY I'VE GOT THE TIME", that's what it takes. I have done about everything mechanical to our 4106 & I can tell you - you need the money - a honey sure helps - and the time. I thought I would never get it all straighten out to drive right & thought I was pouring my money down a rat hole for a while. But all the BNO kept steering me in the right direction and as hardheaded as I am, I hung in there. Now I can set back and say that wasn't so bad. (I might add I did it with a broken down spine).So if your health is good and you can do it yourself, you will enjoy it that much more.
You are getting a lot of good info right here, just pay attention, as Fred had said in near those words to me. Parts no problem as they already spelt out, good info for you. Luke is great for parts and info. You will love that baby once she is complete. I would not quit until mine drove like a car, it is now as close to that as it will ever be.
Now you have new friends who will help you in a minute.
Good luck on your project.
Larry |
R.C. Bishop (128.123.221.151)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, October 11, 2002 - 10:05 pm: | |
Great spirit, Larry!
This board is without question the best discussion board on the net...no matter the subject. ( Thanx a BUNCH, Ian!!)
And if you sit back, relax, and as RJ says, just think about what you are reading (don't read negative into ANYTHING , just as very important input) you will learn a lot, at no expense to you and from a WORLD of expertise, opinion, and endless possibilities.
There is no one that has gained more from this board than I. And I am grateful to every one who has taken the time and effort to answer not only my questions, but those that I would never even think of asking.
I am on SS, finance the coach project on a cash basis, for the most part (if I see a bonafide bargain, I'll charge it, infrequently) and a having a ball! If I need to buy groceries this week, no bus parts. Next week is another time. So what's new. Priorities, right?
Enjoy the hobby, and like FF says, do it your way!
Thanx again, Larry for a great post!
RCB |
Frank Allen (205.188.209.11)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, October 15, 2002 - 11:06 am: | |
Id have the bus looked at , the front end rear end stucture under neath and the bulkheads in back ,and have someone check over the engine then if all thats ok id buy it it is a great bus.
owened mine since 87 love it
Frank Allen |
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