| Author | Message | ||
| Jack Campbell (Blue_goose)
Registered Member Username: Blue_goose Post Number: 131 Registered: 5-2007 Posted From: 71.100.201.35  Rating: N/A |
I use a small air compressor to flush the toilet. The ones that you can buy at Lowes or other stores of that type are very loud. The price of a quite one the size that I need is over $900.00. That is a lot to flush! Has anyone here used a refergator compressor as an air compressor and if so how did it work and how much pressure could you get at what CFM. | ||
| Peter River (Whitebus)
Registered Member Username: Whitebus Post Number: 124 Registered: 4-2009 Posted From: 204.62.111.51  Rating: N/A |
don't you have air brakes? you can always tap into one of the tanks, and attach a smaller tank with a regulator, that wouldn't make any noise at all. | ||
| Wec4104 (Wec4104)
Registered Member Username: Wec4104 Post Number: 57 Registered: 7-2008 Posted From: 68.80.242.72 Rating: N/A |
I can't answer your specific question, but I was wondering if an air storage tank might be a benefit. At least for a middle of the night trek to the bathroom the compressor wouldn't need to run at all. Pondering how many flushes you could get off a 3-5 gallon tank. edit: I see Peter beat me to the punch (Message edited by wec4104 on July 09, 2009) | ||
| Debbie and Joe Cannarozzi (Joe_camper)
Registered Member Username: Joe_camper Post Number: 174 Registered: 10-2006 Posted From: 71.239.202.82 Rating: N/A |
Jun air very powerful very quiet runs on a/c current | ||
| Sean Welsh (Sean)
Registered Member Username: Sean Post Number: 923 Registered: 1-2003 Posted From: 67.142.130.12  Rating: N/A |
1. It is against the law to tap into a brake tank. However, coaches with air brakes have an "auxilliary" air tank to be used for purposes like this. No need for an extra storage tank; the aux tank will serve the purpose. 2. All well and good for the first few hours after you stop. If you have a really tight air system, maybe over night. But if you are parked in one spot for more than one day, you need some way to replenish this air. We use a 2hp, 135-psi, oiled Hitachi compressor for this purpose, and once the coach air has bled down a bit, this compressor runs about 20 seconds every half hour, keeping our whole system at 80psi. If you just need to run the toilet, you can get by with less.
Our Microphor uses 1-2 gallons of air at 60psi for every flush. So a 3-5 gallon tank starting at, perhaps, 120psi, you might get 2-3 flushes before the pressure drops below 60psi, at which point the toilet will stop working properly (don't ask how I know). -Sean http://OurOdyssey.BlogSpot.com | ||
| Peter River (Whitebus)
Registered Member Username: Whitebus Post Number: 126 Registered: 4-2009 Posted From: 204.62.111.51 Rating: N/A |
" All well and good for the first few hours after you stop. If you have a really tight air system, maybe over night" LOL, and I was complaining about my air bleeding out after 5 days, I guess I should count my blessings. yeah, aux tank, that's what I meant. I can also run air tools and inflate tires off it. 2 gallon of 60psi for every flush? what the heck does it use that much air for? | ||
| David Evans (Dmd)
Registered Member Username: Dmd Post Number: 342 Registered: 10-2004 Posted From: 173.77.231.123  Rating: N/A |
To get it over and past the next campsite! Sorry, rough day! | ||
| Paul Lawry (Dreamscape)
Registered Member Username: Dreamscape Post Number: 528 Registered: 5-2007 Posted From: 64.40.216.34  Rating: N/A |
Would a Viair system work? I've not heard them but they are pretty compact. | ||
| Luvrbus (Luvrbus)
Registered Member Username: Luvrbus Post Number: 726 Registered: 8-2006 Posted From: 74.33.54.207 Rating: N/A |
Jack, how much does Microphar charge for their 12/24 volt compressor.A friend of mine just bought one for his Eagle and told me it was cheaper than converting it over to 12v flush.I checked the shipping lable and it came from Phontosassa Fl where ever that is.It is quite and has a 3 or 4 gal tank. good luck | ||
| Jim G. - RTS (Jimgohio)
Registered Member Username: Jimgohio Post Number: 13 Registered: 4-2001 Posted From: 71.171.212.226 Rating: N/A |
'it came from Phontosassa Fl where ever that is' That sounds like a bad mis-spelling. I went to 5th & 6th grade in Thonotosassa! Small town outside of Tampa. Jim G. - RTS-II | ||
| niles steckbauer (Niles500)
Registered Member Username: Niles500 Post Number: 938 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 173.78.29.189 Rating: N/A |
I'm 2 miles from thonotosassa - let me know where and I'll get the info for you - HTH | ||
| Sean Welsh (Sean)
Registered Member Username: Sean Post Number: 924 Registered: 1-2003 Posted From: 67.142.130.12 Rating: N/A |
Yes, actually, because many older buses find themselves down on the stops by morning. In our case, we have an air-operated entry door and an air-flush toilet, so we are constantly using air, and that's why we need an electric compressor for when we are parked. As long as we have the compressor, we opted to build our leveling system using the factory ride-height valves. This means that the valves are always working to keep the bus level -- when we walk around, they will compensate, and if the wind rocks us, they will also try to compensate. This, too, uses air over time.
The Microphor toilet uses a 1.5" waste line (rather than the more traditional 3") and can be located many feet away from the tank. This is why we use one -- our black tank is a good ten feet further forward than the toilet, and there are three 90° bends in the waste line. The toilet achieves this by literally pushing the waste through the line with air. Waste first drops into a hopper, then the flapper valve closes and seals, then the bowl fills back up with water, and lastly a slug of air empties the hopper. Since each flush uses 1/2 gallon of water, and there is room for, umm, "stuff" in there as well, it needs to inject at least the volume of the hopper (I'm guessing about 1.5 gallons), plus some extra to clear the entire waste line.
A lot. We looked into one when we designed our air system. There's nothing special about it, BTW, in regards to noise -- it's just a pancake compressor, no different than, say, a DeWalt, other than it has a DC motor instead of AC. For this they wanted, last I checked, over $600. I have an inverter -- why would I need a DC version of a pancake compressor? I was able to buy a much better compressor for half the price by sticking with AC. FWIW. -Sean http://OurOdyssey.BlogSpot.com | ||
| Luvrbus (Luvrbus)
Registered Member Username: Luvrbus Post Number: 727 Registered: 8-2006 Posted From: 74.33.54.207 Rating: N/A |
I didn't say you needed a 12/24 volt compressor I was just trying to help Jack out he doesn't need as much air with a Eagle.He may be able to find one from a BlueBird Coach they used the 12 volt. Most of the noise comes from the intake on compressors anyway and you can slove that problem fairly easy | ||
| Sean Welsh (Sean)
Registered Member Username: Sean Post Number: 925 Registered: 1-2003 Posted From: 67.142.130.12 Rating: N/A |
That was a figure of speech -- I was not implying that you suggested that. | ||
| Jack Campbell (Blue_goose)
Registered Member Username: Blue_goose Post Number: 132 Registered: 5-2007 Posted From: 71.100.201.35 Rating: N/A |
Let’s start again; I have used the micropher air toilet for all of the years since the bus was converted. I had the same problem as Sean toilet wasn't over the tank. For years I used a piston type pump that was very quiet and when it went bad I bought a new small compressor that if you were parked beside my bus you would come over to see what went wrong when it comes on. The very quite compressors are very costly. The compressor looks like a freezer compressor. I have made vacuum pumps out of old compressor and didn’t worry about oil, but for a compressor it will run lots more and I am sure it wouldn’t last long. I was hoping someone here had tried to build one that could pass along their experience. | ||
| Len Silva (Lsilva)
Registered Member Username: Lsilva Post Number: 268 Registered: 12-2000 Posted From: 24.164.20.23  Rating: N/A |
Here are a couple of commercial units, I'm sure they are very pricey. http://www.silentaire.com/silentaire/supersilent.asp http://www.hvlp.com/ApolloAir/index.html Some home builts using refer compressors, apparently with good results. They would be so cheap to build, I'd say you have nothing to lose. Be sure to use an unloader type pressure switch. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7nWz83K0i6M http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=169234 http://www.volksrods.com/id36.htm | ||
| Luvrbus (Luvrbus)
Registered Member Username: Luvrbus Post Number: 728 Registered: 8-2006 Posted From: 74.33.54.207 Rating: N/A |
Jack, I have never built one but checking with some friends that have the air flush they use the Paasche Air Brush silent compressor cost they say is around 180 bucks. good luck | ||
| Chuck Newman (Chuck_newman)
Registered Member Username: Chuck_newman Post Number: 379 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 75.71.222.183  Rating: N/A |
Luvrbus, "Most of the noise comes from the intake on compressors anyway and you can solve that problem fairly easy" I was going to put a compressor in a "sound box", something like a generator. What would be an easier way to muffle the intake noise? Thanks. | ||
| Len Silva (Lsilva)
Registered Member Username: Lsilva Post Number: 269 Registered: 12-2000 Posted From: 24.164.20.23 Rating: N/A |
Air compressors generate a lot of heat. If you put it in a box, you must consider ventilation. | ||
| Cullen Newsom (Cullennewsom)
Registered Member Username: Cullennewsom Post Number: 91 Registered: 2-2009 Posted From: 129.7.52.191 Rating: N/A |
I have one of those "pancake" compressors. I have it installed in the bus for the moment. But, I will remove it soon; since I can't hear thunder when it is running (nor can anyone else). I think it might be useful to disguise the noise of my chainsaw. But that's not exactly helpful. I was thinking about using a refrigerant compressor, or A/C compressor off of a car. Someone mentioned the possibility of explosion due to explosive mixture of oil/air. Anyone have any thoughts on that? At first glance I don't reckon it sprays more oil into its output than a regular piston type air compressor. | ||
| Arthur N. Gaudet (Runcutter)
Registered Member Username: Runcutter Post Number: 17 Registered: 9-2006 Posted From: 76.185.246.187 Rating: N/A |
Jack, how about the electric compressor used in auto air suspension? Our Mercury Grand Marquis has (and my Lincoln Town Car had), a small air compressor that would come on whenever needed. It could be a little startling when you just walked by the car, and it started making a fairly quiet buzzing noise. Arthur | ||
| Tim Brandt (Timb)
Registered Member Username: Timb Post Number: 377 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 66.165.176.62  Rating: N/A |
Cullen I think the issue you will have with a AC compresor is lack of oil once the system is open. Won't last long that way. FWIW 2 stage compressors are quieter than single also those oilless compressors often seen on pancakes are noisier than a standard oil/piston type | ||
| Cullen Newsom (Cullennewsom)
Registered Member Username: Cullennewsom Post Number: 92 Registered: 2-2009 Posted From: 98.201.161.214 Rating: N/A |
That's what I'm sayin' ! :o) btw I noticed a few jun-air compressors on ebay. Some of them in completed listings went for around 300.00 | ||
| Jim Shepherd (Rv_safetyman)
Registered Member Username: Rv_safetyman Post Number: 280 Registered: 1-2004 Posted From: 67.142.130.47 Rating: N/A |
I was the one that mentioned the AC compressor (I think on the other board). It uses the old York piston compressor. A good link is: http://www.offroaders.com/info/tech-corner/project-cj7/project-cj7-onboard-air.htm. I have used this type system on my '56 Chevy with air suspension for years. The oil does not seem to leave the compressor. I put a filter on to catch it and it did not catch much. My plans are to drive it off the generator engine along with a hydraulic pump for the jacks. The biggest issue is that the compressor gets cooled by the returning freon in an AC system. That, of course does not happen when it is converted to an air compressor. However, I think that setting it up with a pressure switch and it's own tank (plumbed with a check valve to the aux air tank) would allow you to run the compressor for short periods of time. I don't need air when parked, so driving it with my generator for a few minutes before I leave a spot where I am on the pole (or when I am boon docking switch it on when normally running the generator)make sense. For those of you who need air when parked, you could use either a 120 V motor or one of the big a** 12V blower motors to drive it. By definition, they are pretty quiet. They are used on most semi trucks, so are available in the junk yard. Most of the trucks I have seen use the 210 CCI (was York) which is good for about 3-4 CFM. Kind a kluged up, but should give you what you need if you like to fabricate (and Jack, I know you do {grin}). Jim | ||
| Peter E (Sdibaja)
Registered Member Username: Sdibaja Post Number: 301 Registered: 5-2002 Posted From: 201.143.185.51  Rating: N/A |
around the the off road crowd you will see AC pumps with the original elec. clutch in regular use for airing up tires, air tools, and air lockers... none seem to wear out or give problems... some use pressure popoff valves, some do not... low bucks old school from the 60's |