| Author | Message | ||
| Edward T McGehee (Bluesman)
Registered Member Username: Bluesman Post Number: 6 Registered: 11-2008 Posted From: 216.220.216.198 Rating: N/A |
First I want to thank every one that helped me answer me regarding my VS8-2. On the front brakes, they have the can , out of the can is a rod. At the end of the rod is a open ended clevis that has a pin that goes to the S cam arm. On the front of this arm is a 9/16 bolt head. I have 1/2" of pad remaining on the shoes. I was told by Mick O neil ownwner of Oneils deisel service in Ellensburg Wa, to grab the S cam arm and pull it forward. I can then tighten up the 9/16 bolt head until the shoes are tight against the drum then back it up 1/4 of a turn. Do this on all the brakes. When I pull the front s cam arm it moves about 2" and pull the rod that far also. I can see it is taking the diaphram with it. On the rod there is that clevis with the pin and a cotter pin. The rod is threaded. I assume I have to turn the clevis out so that the rod is not pulling the diaphram. The problem is I don't think there is enough threaded rod length to accomodate this. So do I have to remove the S cam arm and clock it back however many notches ? I hope I am making sense. Thanx Ed | ||
| Luvrbus (Luvrbus)
Registered Member Username: Luvrbus Post Number: 796 Registered: 8-2006 Posted From: 74.33.54.207 Rating: N/A |
ED, you adjust the brakes with the slack adjuster not the rod. The rod hooks to the slack adjuster and there is a bolt that pushes down and turns for adjustment | ||
| Len Silva (Lsilva)
Registered Member Username: Lsilva Post Number: 318 Registered: 12-2000 Posted From: 72.187.35.208  Rating: N/A |
Ed, Please don't take offense, but I strongly recommend that you pay someone to adjust the brakes the first time and show you how it's done. These kind of questions scare the hell out of me, and, at two inches of slack, you are right on the edge. The slack adjuster is what you need to adjust, and when it's properly adjusted, the clevis arm should be at 90 degrees to the slack adjuster for maximum travel. | ||
| Edward T McGehee (Bluesman)
Registered Member Username: Bluesman Post Number: 7 Registered: 11-2008 Posted From: 216.220.216.180 Rating: N/A |
Len,no offense taken. I appreciate your concern. I will take it to oneils Monday. The 90 degrees is a good indecation of a possible problem for sure. Thank you,Ed | ||
| marvin pack (Gomer)
Registered Member Username: Gomer Post Number: 686 Registered: 3-2007 Posted From: 71.53.153.91  Rating: N/A |
Ed Welcome to the wonderful world of BUSNUTS and now to the brakes. Len said it best by letting someone who has done it, do it. Watch and learn by asking questions too. The slack adjuster has a 9/16, 12 point nut that a box end wrench only works it. The 'nut' has a keeper on it which prevents it from turning on its own and loosening up. The wrench pushes the keeper down and then you turn the nut to adjust the brakes. I turn mine down tight and back it off 1/4 turn. As Len said before, let someone do it and watch. | ||
| Arthur N. Gaudet (Runcutter)
Registered Member Username: Runcutter Post Number: 28 Registered: 9-2006 Posted From: 70.122.242.207 Rating: N/A |
Ed, I'm glad you'll take it into the shop. With 40 years in the bus business, I still have a recurring dream --- driving a vehicle with failed brakes. It's never happened, but once I did instruct a driver to back up a few feet and pull into the shop, after he lost an airbrake diaphragm. He still had plenty of air, but I'd overestimated his skills (should have done it myself). Wacked the car behind him. Thank goodness, it was a stick shift and in neutral, no damage. In the 80's, I was AGM on a 100-bus property. I made it a habit to walk through the shop at least twice a day. In one period, I saw the same bus in, every couple of days. When I asked why --- brake adjustment. After a few days, I grabbed the day foreman to go deeper. The result, the keeper wasn't popping back out, and the brakes backed themselves off. Even the mechanic (a good one, if I recall), didn't catch it. So, even though I used to adjust brakes when I started in the business (mechanic helper), I now make sure only someone fully qualified touches our 4107 brakes. By the way, the procedure we used was to jack the bus (over the pit). One person in the pit tightening the slack, with the other turning the tire. When the brake was fully engaged, stopping the tire, the slack was backed off (but I forget how far). Maybe that's partially where the recurring dream comes from. The pro also knows where to look for incipient problems while he's under there -- invaluable. Arthur | ||
| Buswarrior (Buswarrior)
Registered Member Username: Buswarrior Post Number: 1742 Registered: 12-2000 Posted From: 76.68.120.163  Rating: |
Arthur has touched on it: "The pro also knows where to look for incipient problems while he's under there -- invaluable." Here's an excellent resource: http://www.practicalairbrakes.com/ Spend cash if you have to, to learn. As for adjusting your own brakes, you need to check your work. Measure the pushrod travel, BEFORE and AFTER your attempt. How fast are your brakes wearing? Are you backing the nut off too much/not enough? Can't get it under an inch and half...what's wrong? The trouble with watching someone else, you are ASSUMING the other person knows what they are doing and is showing you everything you need to know to go out on your own. Purchase the airbrake training materials available from your jurisdiction or the noted site to get the current straight poop. There has been so much misinformation spread in the transportation industry regarding airbrakes, and some of it from official sources, that it is a testament to the men and women who drive trucks and buses, and evidence of the existence of God, that they haven't called on their brakes to work to 100%, because quite often, it isn't there. happy coaching! buswarrior | ||
| R.C.Bishop (Chuckllb)
Registered Member Username: Chuckllb Post Number: 975 Registered: 7-2006 Posted From: 75.210.77.190 Rating: N/A |
Interesting thread...lotsa' good advice. BUT...I have a question: I wonder in the great scheme of things how many "shops, facilities,etc" have the true expertise to know how to do it as precisely as Arthur feels (knows) it should be done. No innuendo, slam or snide here...I am dead serious. I can't think of a shop in our neck of the woods that I would feel comfortable knowing slacks had been correctly adjusted...if at all. I could cite experiences but I'll refrain...  To be sure there are those out there, but without word of mouth (Luke's place for instance) how is one to know ... So folks, if you have one of those "special" places in your experience, please don't hesitate to share. BW posted as I was typing...thanx for that! Suspicions confirmed Thanx, RCB ------in the great third worl...uh Southwest! West (Message edited by Chuckllb on November 21, 2009) | ||
| clint hunter (Truthhunter)
Registered Member Username: Truthhunter Post Number: 545 Registered: 1-2009 Posted From: 24.129.237.52  Rating: N/A |
...lest it not be mentioned, if a auto slack adjuster needs adjustment then it is to be considered defective & in need of replacement, so do learn what your doing on brake adjustments. In some jurisdictions you must be endorsed to adjust , in all jurisdictions "pulling the slacks" to verify is actually required on pre-trip, though rarely done by any, it is also actually required at mandatory "check your brake" stops in the mountains, though almost never done. | ||
| Patrick levenson (Zubzub)
Registered Member Username: Zubzub Post Number: 130 Registered: 5-2007 Posted From: 174.91.226.239  Rating: N/A |
Kind of agree with RC on this. I don't find adjusting the slacks difficult, I can see thta someone could adjust them backward but there are lots of things that can be done backward with catastrophic results. You need to understand what is going on not to have a problem "red before green or you won't be seen" "green before red or you'll be dead" (most worthless set of memory aids ever). In the case of brakes the shops I have been in will use the the tire monkey for the greasy on your back work so that doesn't impress me much. OTOH if you really don't understand how the brakes work seek a professional. | ||
| Bill Holstein (Billmoocow)
Registered Member Username: Billmoocow Post Number: 43 Registered: 5-2009 Posted From: 98.232.207.25  Rating: N/A |
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PXG4gjzEbDU | ||
| Len Silva (Lsilva)
Registered Member Username: Lsilva Post Number: 319 Registered: 12-2000 Posted From: 72.187.35.208 Rating: N/A |
Interesting video, the very next one contradicts it. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NnGi_lqueo0&feature=related AUTOMATIC SLACK ADJUSTERS SHOULD NOT REQUIRE ADJUSTING. If they do, something is wrong with it. | ||
| Len Silva (Lsilva)
Registered Member Username: Lsilva Post Number: 320 Registered: 12-2000 Posted From: 72.187.35.208 Rating: N/A |
Interesting video, the very next one contradicts it. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NnGi_lqueo0&feature=related AUTOMATIC SLACK ADJUSTERS SHOULD NOT REQUIRE ADJUSTING. If they do, something is wrong with it. | ||
| David Dulmage (Daved)
Registered Member Username: Daved Post Number: 265 Registered: 12-2003 Posted From: 142.46.199.30  Rating: N/A |
I took an air brake course at a local community college that was recognized by the provincial Ministry of Transportation. I completed a written and practical exam at the college that gave me my air brake endorsement on my driver's licence. The course was an excellent source of information about the operation, maintenance and safety considerations of air brake systems. It was, for me, well worth the fee (about $250.00). FWIW DaveD (Message edited by DaveD on November 23, 2009) | ||
| R.C.Bishop (Chuckllb)
Registered Member Username: Chuckllb Post Number: 976 Registered: 7-2006 Posted From: 75.210.117.249 Rating: N/A |
Which leads to a question....: EXACTLY how does one know if the adjusters are "automatic" ...or not.. (What EXACTLY do they look like, as compared, for instance with non "automatic)? Thanx RCB | ||
| Len Silva (Lsilva)
Registered Member Username: Lsilva Post Number: 321 Registered: 12-2000 Posted From: 72.187.35.208 Rating: N/A |
Everything you could need is right here: http://www.bendix.com/en-us/service/library/Pages/Home.aspx Start with the BW5057 AIR BRAKE HANDBOOK | ||
| Buswarrior (Buswarrior)
Registered Member Username: Buswarrior Post Number: 1743 Registered: 12-2000 Posted From: 76.69.143.28 Rating: N/A |
I do not like this first video, and would not pollute a novice's head with it. That is an auto slack he is adjusting, which you aren't supposed to do. On install, you are supposed to let an auto slack draw itself up. How about applying some grease to the slack? Perhaps one of the most ignored grease fittings in the history of road going transport, prime reason for an auto slack, or anything mechanical, to not work properly. The regulated stroke limits aren't about getting a ticket from the MTO, it's about SAFETY. Beyond the limits for a particular chamber, it will bottom out, making less stopping force during a heavy stopping event due to the heat induced expanding drum. In other words, it won't stop right when you really need it to. The laws of physics are more important to me than the ticket! He talked, and did not show you why lifting the wheels off the ground and giving them a spin lets you snug them much closer than a 1/2 turn. Or lets you find your drums are out of round...If a dragging brake is important to talk about, isn't showing us how to find one important? What is a full half turn? By my observation, he backed that off more than 90 degrees in his three applications of the wrench, which leads to the next problem: At the very end, he finally shows you the brake being applied, and it stroked further than he says it did. Looked like at least 2 inches to me, which would be overstroked. So much for his demonstration of proper technique. And it was edited!!! The trouble is, in the blah blah blah is some good stuff, and then some serious crap. I'll review the other one later, got to go now! happy coaching! buswarrior | ||
| Edward T McGehee (Bluesman)
Registered Member Username: Bluesman Post Number: 8 Registered: 11-2008 Posted From: 216.220.216.173 Rating: N/A |
Well I was able to google airbrake adjustment and got some good results.one was for adjusting air brakes without lifting the bus wheels off the ground. You use a hammer and tap the drum. If the pads are not touching the drum it will ring.when the pads are making contact with the drum the drum will have a dead sound. You need 2 people for this approach. 1 at the brake pedal and 1 doing the adusting. Safety first using blocking at the axles in case of air bag failure and at the tires as the emergency spring brakes need to be disengaged for the rear adjustment. They say this method is used if you are approching a long steep grade and feel that you want to do an adustment before decending the grade. This is what I did yesterday. It worked good. I was able to adjust the fronts to a 3/8" throw of the slack adjuster and rod and keeping it at 90 degrees. I found the rear drivers side not functioning. I think the return spring on the shoes is off or broken. The rod from the can is over extending. It looks like it has been like that for many years. So I am going to seattle this week to get the 20 ton air over hydrolic jack from harbor freight. 99.00 investment,I need a jack anyway. Trying to beat feet out of here before the big freeze. I will keep you posted thanx again for everyones help Ed | ||
| Buswarrior (Buswarrior)
Registered Member Username: Buswarrior Post Number: 1744 Registered: 12-2000 Posted From: 76.68.135.182 Rating: N/A |
The second video, I like. Get the specific directions from the manufacturer of your slack adjusters as to how their product is to be installed, maintained and how to trouble shoot. For what they cost, perhaps it would be money well spent replacing the ones that arrived on the coach, that way we get all new product info and know that they have been well treated right from the start. Ed, watch out for "they say". If legitimate sources cannot be referenced, you better take the "advice" with caution. For instance, at what point of contact pressure of the linings will a brake drum start to "ring", rather than "thud"? 3/8" stroke on application is pretty tight... You might want to lift that wheel and see if it spins free at that adjustment. Why would the presence of a hill ahead change "their" concern about the performance of the brakes? Shouldn't they be up to snuff for all driving conditions? Keep researching, you're getting there! happy coaching! buswarrior | ||
| David Dulmage (Daved)
Registered Member Username: Daved Post Number: 266 Registered: 12-2003 Posted From: 142.46.199.30 Rating: N/A |
If there is any doubt about the integrity of the spring brake can, it may be safest to have a bus or truck mechanic deal with it. Do not disassemble the spring brake can. The force exerted by the assembly is deadly. I hope this doesn't offend. I don't know the extent of your experience with these brakes. DaveD | ||
| john w. roan (Chessie4905)
Registered Member Username: Chessie4905 Post Number: 1763 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 71.58.71.157  Rating: N/A |
One issue with adjusting brakes with wheels off the ground; if the part of the axle spindle (front or rear),where the inner wheel bearing inside race rides has any wear or a step worn on the bottom side of the spindle, the drum and hub assembly would shift up when wheel,s are set back down on the ground. This would cause the brakes to drag from a little to a fair amount in that location. This isn't necessarily common, but can happen. I do jack my wheels up to adjust though. That way, there is no confusion. Don't try to watch the shoe to drum gap though while adjusting if you have drums with deep inside ridge. You may not see it. You can watch the shoe movement vs drum edge to verify that you are moving the slack the right direction. Clean the adjusting screw and locking ring with a stiff brush and a little solvent to remove caked grease, before you start. Spray screw with a little light lube when done to keep from rusting fast. | ||
| Arthur N. Gaudet (Runcutter)
Registered Member Username: Runcutter Post Number: 29 Registered: 9-2006 Posted From: 70.122.242.207 Rating: |
Not bus, but the effect of maladjusted brakes. Read the "Post Accident Observations and Tests -- Brakes" - right below an interesting photo. http://www.ntsb.gov/publictn/2009/RAB0903.htm Arthur | ||
| R.C.Bishop (Chuckllb)
Registered Member Username: Chuckllb Post Number: 977 Registered: 7-2006 Posted From: 75.209.140.24 Rating: N/A |
Now....a REALLY interesting thread!!! See my FIRST post above. I honestly (particularly now that I have read the comments on this thread) have no confidence in who to turn to.......or where>  . From my point of view, there may indeed be a bunch of folks out there who know something about heavy equipment; however take ones coach ( hauls people, right?) to highest rated Heavy equipment place on the map and...do they know motor coaches?...don't know, but I can say that my personal experience in a VERY large facility PROVES they do not. Long stories (several) so won't go on...I know there are those "out there" that are very dedicated and know how things should be done...but, once again "life's experience" shows they are few and far between; therefore sure would be nice to have a list of such places (individuals). Me thinks BW has it all pretty much in perspective. Thanx for the thought "provoking". RCB | ||
| David Guglielmetti (Daveg)
Registered Member Username: Daveg Post Number: 116 Registered: 2-2009 Posted From: 69.106.223.122  Rating: |
Wow, air brakes are air brakes...regardless what they are installed on! People or freight, it is all the same to the brake manufacturer and the individual parts/pieces that make up the assemblies. There is a lot of good information here, but a lot of "stuff" to wade through to get to it and the novice may have a tough time. I agree that newbies to air brakes should be shown how to do it a few times before they assume the responsibility of doing it themselves. In addition, regarding ASAs (auto slack adjusters) keep in mind that measuring stroke is critical and that if the original installation "set-up" wasn't correct then the stroke could be wrong. So for ASAs, I believe that you should measure the stroke and record that information. Periodically you should have the stroke checked and compare numbers...they really shouldn't change much (within 1/4" or so) and if they do change...something should be looked at/examined. I am in the air brake business so I find some of this entertaining and some troublesome. There are air brake classes you can go to from time to time and often they are free...well worth going to, just remember that does not make you an expert, only exposes you to the world of air brakes. | ||
| R.C.Bishop (Chuckllb)
Registered Member Username: Chuckllb Post Number: 978 Registered: 7-2006 Posted From: 75.209.140.24 Rating: N/A |
David...I think you miss my point. If the mechanic/ owner/ whoever/ is not very cognizant of what the difference in a coach/ bus,/ Semi, Crane, etc. is, then the possibilities of "adjusting" those brakes may not be foremost in their mind (if at all). Most mechanics that I am familiar with are hourly (plus bonus for work put on a time card) paid and as someone else already stated, are most probably the low man on the pole to get under a vehicle on their back. (BTDT). In my personal experience, all over this great country of ours, there are few that qualify for the category of "watching out for the customer". I am sure, without going further you know precisely what I mean. To be sure, there are exceptions, and that is EXACTLY what I am seeking...WHO? I note, that to this point at least, my question above about how one (me for instance) can identify whether or not one has Automatic adjusters...has gone un-noticed, ignored or without regard to the implications that have been outlined by comments and the video in question. If there is, indeed, a difference, it would be nice, if not important, to know, (ASS U ME ing the first few posts above "knew what they are talking about"....particularly the video) regarding that particular/peculiar information. Air brakes may be air brakes to you, but to me they are an intergral part of my transportation when I and passengers are in the coach,..... about which I apparently have limited and fragmented information. To be sure, I have read and studied a bunch of information over the years on the system. I have had a CDL...in California)...that does not make me an expert or even qualified to do a thing. I do not consider myself a newbie to them, nor do I consider myself a newbie to my coach; but there are many things beyond my expertise on that 30,000 pound piece of machinery. To be sure, I become familiar with new things every day.... ...one of the reasons I ask questions. I just rebuilt the power steering pump, the radiator, the radiator fan, the fuel pump and the fuel tank and a number of other, perhaps, not so critical systems, but that does not make me an expert on any of them. I study, I examine, I look, I feel, I probe, but have never considered myself an expert on anything. The reason for my interest in this particular thread. Be "amused" if you will, but to me...and perhaps others reading the thread, it is dead serious and deserves good attention, which for the most part I believe has been put into this effort,so far. You state "you should have that checked".....air brake classes are fine, but they do not answer the question; who does one trust to do the job?.. (take a look at what BW says...and what one of the videos talks about...CONFLICTION...in capital letters). I have not found a facility thus far that fits in that category. Perhaps you could recommend one close to El Paso, Las Cruces/ Albuquerque/ Tucson. It might be worth the drive. Thanx, RCB | ||
| Don Evans (Doninwa)
Registered Member Username: Doninwa Post Number: 241 Registered: 1-2007 Posted From: 208.81.157.234  Rating: N/A |
One thing that has not been covered is the before and after test drive. May be obvious to some but not all. I don't care who did the work, I'm the final check to approve or reject the work. Before, take note of how brakes work and feel. I apply the parking system while slowly rolling and take note of how much authority they show when they hit, an old habit from the farm fields when it better hold you with a full load pointed down hill. Does brake application cause 'pull' to one side. Drums even in heat (see below). After, take note of how brakes work and feel. It should be the same or better. Never worse. Parking brake, pull ect. After a few miles without constant use, check all drums for heat. Have a hot one, could be too tight. Make a full stop (or two) with authority from speed and check the drums for heat. Should be comparable side to side, that is drive axle with drive, steering with steer, tag with tag. Worst case I ever saw was an old Ford Louisville that my son was driving for a local farmer. He stopped by the shop and said it didn't seem to have much brake and they told him to park it in gear instead of using the parking system. Had him make a full application from about 20mph. Slightly drug one front wheel and about ripped the wheel out of his hands. Crawled under and found both real wheels stroked out. One front had slack adjuster screwed up and would not adjust. Adjusted the rears and the one good front and the result was the farmer was pissed that I messed with his truck. | ||
| Ralph Peters (Ralph7)
Registered Member Username: Ralph7 Post Number: 81 Registered: 3-2004 Posted From: 70.212.184.236 Rating: N/A |
RCB The auto slack adjustor will have a lever on the side of the slack that is attached to a non moveable point. The lever is a ratchet that ratchets when the pushrod goes past a predetermined angle, if it does not go past it does not adjust, but as shoes wear it goes past then it advances. BW mentioned lack of lube is a major factor of failure, also so is incorrect instulation of either a new brake can or slack. RCB, will try to call you, Presently in Alamogordo NM. | ||
| Rob Norgren (Robsedona)
Registered Member Username: Robsedona Post Number: 175 Registered: 11-2007 Posted From: 70.212.226.218  Rating: N/A |
Our Front and Rear axles are the same as on the Big trucks Like me front is a Rockwell Yes our Breaks are the same Engine the same only Different way to mount etc We may have DDs not Spring breaks (Maxies) Our slack adjusters are the same many different ones (Some Auto adjusters do need adjusting when first installed not after) Look up what you have Call Luke or Ed or the manufacture Take Pic and post here and ask what type and find out about yours and then go backwards from their. Break and stopping is more important then going this size of Rig can and will do a LOT of damage! Make sure you and the others on the road next to you are safe! Right on RJ We learn but we are not EXpert in the field by no Means. And After I fix any Thing I Test it out Good Before I Go Full OUT! | ||
| Buswarrior (Buswarrior)
Registered Member Username: Buswarrior Post Number: 1747 Registered: 12-2000 Posted From: 76.71.100.170 Rating: N/A |
Here are some pictures and literature from some manufacturers. There is a ton of info at all of these manufacturers' sites, just click through from the specific link I have posted here. First, a picture of manual slack adjuster, these also may have bent or offset arms for some applications, notice there is little in the way of extra features or attachments besides the big chunk of metal. http://www.anythingtruck.com/commercial/airb_slack-adjusters.mv There are two kinds of automatic slack adjusters: those that adjust on application, and those that adjust on release. As you might expect, everyone says theirs is better! And it is best to be careful using brand names, as some of the manufacturers offer both types. Haldex, which are the same style of the old MCI auto slacks from the 70's. Be careful, there have been subtle changes to procedures depending on variant, this stuff may not be good for the old ones... Anyway, there is an external crank sort of affair that rotates around the camshaft and has an added mount to attach the crank to so it acts as a ratchet. http://www.haldex.com/en/North-America/Applications-Products/Product-categories/Brake--Sus pension-Systems/Product-Information/Automatic-Brake-Adjusters-ABA-ASA1/ Here's the Bendix offering: http://www.roadranger.com/Roadranger/productssolutions/brakes/automaticslackadjusters/inde x.htm This style auto slack is identified by the mechanism that has a second attachment to the clevis. It works via the second arm going beyond some angle to the clevis assembly. Here's the Rockwell, similar to the Bendix: http://www.anythingtruck.com/commercial/airb_rockwell-autoslackadjusters.mv The Spicer, looks like a Haldex, works in a similar fashion http://www.roadranger.com/Roadranger/productssolutions/brakes/DanaAutoSlack/index.htm Arvin Meritor's version, similar in function to the Bendix: http://www.arvinmeritor.com/products/aftermarket/cvaasa.asp And there are chinese versions... watch what you are paying for, if that is of concern to you http://www.chinasuppliers.globalsources.com/china-suppliers/Auto-Slack-Adjuster.htm Yes, I suppose I'd better work on something to consolidate this info in an easy to find place... Bossnut has spoken. happy coaching! buswarrior | ||
| R.C.Bishop (Chuckllb)
Registered Member Username: Chuckllb Post Number: 979 Registered: 7-2006 Posted From: 75.210.234.74 Rating: N/A |
'Preciate all the xtra work in flushing out the differences, BW. Also all the influence, Ian! GREAT idea....Now I know..... I fear I must not have done a great job in communicating. I am aware that each time we take a vehicle in for work of any kind there is a whole lot of trust left to the establishment and indeed the individual who works on the coach. But for whatever reason I cannot adequately explain, brakes are (should receive), to me at least, "special" consideration in the overall scheme of things. Perhaps more so than any other system on a coach. Lives (passengers, others on the road or that might otherwise be involved, the driver, etc) depend on them...and EVERY time the vehicle is stopped...particularly in a "quick stop" situation. Yes trucks and other heavy equipment, etc have the same concerns. But not always as stated above, the same equipment or circumstances. Many (majority?) of our coaches are vintage vehicles. Things many times, are different. And many of the folks who work on them may (or may not) know how they are different. I have a suspicion that was (is) the case with one or more of the videos early in this thread. But I would guess by far the majority of folks who are paid to do brake or other "mundane" work on such vehicles do not have those things in mind when working on them. Preciseness is probably not at the top of the list. Allow me to cite a minor case...my own experience: I purchased a new, made for me, Dodge Ram (early this decade) from a dealer that has, to the best of my knowledge, a typical service department. Shortly after I purchased it...about a year, as I recall...still under warranty...I had to take the truck in to find out why the brakes were "squealing". Very few miles on it and as I write it has only 52,800. That was on a Friday. On Sunday, I started out our long drive to the highway. As I was about to turn onto the highway I heard and felt something very out of the ordinary on the right front. I stopped and looked at the wheel, Two (2) lugs had nuts part way on them. The balance had none. I left the truck sitting on our drive, called road service and steamed as I walked back to the house. At the end of the service call, the fellow handed me a written receipt indicating what he had done....FUNISHED AND PUT ON A TOTAL OF SIX NUTS on all four wheels. I about dropped my teeth. I have since learned the entire service department at that dealership is suspect. I could provide more stories about heavy equipment shops, but that is not necessary. Thanx for all the fine input on this very helpful and informative thread...which BTW, is what I think this forum is all about. And thanx again Ian for the opportunity, RCB .....and Happy, Safe< Thanksgiving everyone! | ||
| Len Silva (Lsilva)
Registered Member Username: Lsilva Post Number: 322 Registered: 12-2000 Posted From: 72.187.35.208 Rating: N/A |
Trust, but verify! | ||
| marvin pack (Gomer)
Registered Member Username: Gomer Post Number: 687 Registered: 3-2007 Posted From: 71.53.153.91 Rating: N/A |
BW and RC GOOD FIND and we preciate ya'll. I found that when you follow up something, Also say "it is not that I don't trust you, but I just want to keep you honest" I have said that to a lot of people in my life and if a person is honest, They will gladly accept your thought and will help verify what they done. Gomer | ||
| David Guglielmetti (Daveg)
Registered Member Username: Daveg Post Number: 117 Registered: 2-2009 Posted From: 69.106.223.122 Rating: |
Here is a link to ArvinMeritor's site with a Tech Tip brochuce you can download (28 pages). http://www.meritorhvs.com/MeritorHVS_Documents/TT1.PDF Hope that works...might have to cut/paste/ I guess one of the things that gets me is some systems should be left to someone who knows what they are doing, and I'm not saying that folks don't know what they are doing...hell even a monkey can be trained to do some things...but go ahead and build your cabinets anyway you'd like, with any materials you like and if it doesn't hold up, then no problem...do it again a bit different. However when it comes to a critical system likes brakes, we need to be doing a decent job of it the first go 'round. Anyone who is in the northern california area is welcome to come by my shop for as much air brake training as you can stand, however if it runs more than a day...I'll expect dinner. | ||
| R.C.Bishop (Chuckllb)
Registered Member Username: Chuckllb Post Number: 980 Registered: 7-2006 Posted From: 70.212.205.15 Rating: N/A |
Dave...that's an invite...I think... . But I'm not in Northern CA.... Who knows, I may just be there some day! Was once. Navato. circa 1990. "I guess one of the things that gets me is some systems should be left to someone who knows what they are doing......." Precisely my thinking and point in all of my posts...but, alas....who...where...(besides you and Luke)..many, many miles away...from many of us. Have a Happy Thanksgiving! RCB | ||
| David Guglielmetti (Daveg)
Registered Member Username: Daveg Post Number: 118 Registered: 2-2009 Posted From: 69.106.223.122 Rating: |
You are welcome to email me at work david at reddingtrailer dot com if I don't get back within a day or two, call me and I'll check my spam box. I would be glad to anything to help out regarding educating in the area of brakes. If you still need help indentifying your slacks, you could send me a picture (Message edited by DaveG on November 25, 2009) |
