| Author |
Message |
Michael J (Mjryan) (67.41.234.175)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 18, 2003 - 4:30 pm: | |
Hi all
WOW it's a long way down here to post,I feel like I am in the basement,not complaining just looking around and it's scary.
My question is, What is the model number of this bus, and what is a 8.2 DETROIT? This is on EBAY. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2400596954&category=6728
Looks like it could be just right for a project I have in mine.
Thanks in advance for your help.
Michael j 4104 |
Henry R. Bergman, Jr. (Henryofcj) (65.194.145.44)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 18, 2003 - 7:13 pm: | |
Boy, it sure beats me. It looks like some sort of oldie but goodie 30 foot long or soosssss Transit Bus perhaps somewhat converted with two roof top RV type airconditioners.
Must admit I am a little confused by the powerplant/transmission. The 8.2 liter Detroit is/way rather an unusual example from Detroit.
This mill is a 500 cubic inch V8 four stroke derived from gasoline production facilities, but with some of the good features of the Detroit 2-strokes.
It does not have cylinder sleeves or liners, but does employ the unit injectors common to the 2-stroke versions. This mill was available in non turboed versions as well as turboed.
Power ratings varied from around 150 hp with the non turboed all the way up to around 220 hp with the turboed version. Torgue was from around 350 up to around 525 ft. lbs..
With the lower ratings, the trannys were USUALLY the small Allision AT-540/545 4 speed most usually WITHOUT a lock up clutch. The turboed versions usually got the MT-640/650 family, which is a much larger....
....and stronger 4 speed with a lock up clutch. The coach could have either mill or tranny, but I suspect it may have the turbo mill and larger tranny for emission reasons and longer service life.
Of course, I may be totally wrong about the type of transmission. The mill also could be mounted sideways in the coach which would mean it would have some sort of V-730 3 speed tranny? Help here.
I did not know intercity transit coaches of this type had the 8.2 Detroit V8 four stroke diesel. This mill is rather weak and light duty and was usually offered in 2 ton trucks and such as a low cost diesel engine. A Jake is not available.
The 8.2 was discontinued due to emissions output. Years ago, we did swap one into a 1 ton Ford truck, which gives you kinda of an idea how big, heavy and powerful the mill is. Not very. About 1100 pounds and about the size as a 427, perhaps a little bigger.
Maybe someone who knows GMC transits can give you a better idea of what you have. For my two cents worth, I am surprised the 8.2 was offered in the application described. A very light duty diesel. Good luck and Detroits forever. |
Darryl (68.184.120.141)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 18, 2003 - 11:27 pm: | |
This bus is more commonly known as the baby Fishbowl. It is a 30 footer. I believe the model number was 3502. It did not come with the 8.2, as that engine wasn't even around in the 70's. The 8.2 is a recent engine and is in alot of school buses today. Strangly enough, this bus does not have the V drive that it's full size sisters have. The engines were straight in like an MCI. All the ones I've seen had the Toro-flow engine. |
Michael J (Mjryan) (67.41.239.157)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, January 19, 2003 - 2:10 am: | |
Darryl
What is a Toro-flow engine?
Michael j 4104 |
Darryl (68.184.120.141)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, January 19, 2003 - 9:54 pm: | |
It's an older generation diesel that GM built. I think it may have preceeded the 2 cycles. Reports (as I hear them) was that it was a good engine in stop and go service. However, when run on the hiway at constant high speeds it didn't fare so well. Something about the length of the stroke and the diameter of the piston being too close to the same in measurement. I believe it overheated the pistons. That engine was a little before my time so I don't have any first hand knowledge of it. A frind of mine has one of these baby fishbowls with the toro flow in it. It is definitely a smoky engine. |
DaveD (64.235.198.76)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, January 19, 2003 - 10:28 pm: | |
The GM 71 series 2 stroke diesels have been around for a long time. I believe that 4-71s were built starting around 1931.
DaveD |
buslady (198.81.26.174)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, January 20, 2003 - 1:25 am: | |
I dunno what model # that fishbowl is but it is SO CUTE! Too bad it's not a bus still |
Jojo Colina (Du1jec) (209.75.20.72)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, January 20, 2003 - 3:43 pm: | |
DH 478 TORO-FLOW Diesel Engine, was basically the gas 478 V-6 converted to a Diesel. Most ended up replaced by a Gas powered V-6 or V-8. They also built a 637 V-8 Toro-Flow Diesel Engine.
http://www.favorites.com/~jolly/Diesel.htm |
Mark Medin (209.79.199.156)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, January 20, 2003 - 3:49 pm: | |
It's a baby fishbowl, alright. Model is either TDH-3301 or TDH-3302A. It came with the 478 c.i. toro-flow, and was replaced (as many were) with another engine (in this case the 8.2). I know little of either engine, except that the toroflow has a less than stellar reputation for reliability. |
Michael J (Mjryan) (67.41.226.133)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, January 20, 2003 - 8:36 pm: | |
Thanks you all for the information.
It is a nice little bus, be great bumming around Mexico with a boat in tow, no need for a toad, in fact it's not much bigger than one anyway, but don't know how the engine would hold up. Be a bad place for a break down even though the natives can fix most anything. Shucks to bad, I'll just have to use the BIG 4104.
Michael j 4104 |
RJ Long (24.127.74.29)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, January 20, 2003 - 11:37 pm: | |
OK, everyone, here's the answer to "What is the Model Number?"
According to the seller, the VIN on the coach is TDH3302A-189. Translated, that means:
T = Transit
D = Diesel Engine
H = Hydraulic (auto) transmission
33 = 33 seated passengers
02 = Second of the series
A = Air Conditioned
189 = Sequential Production Number
This bus was originally purchased/delivered to the City of Indianapolis as fleet number 737 in September of 1973.
BTW, GM built 223 of these "Baby Fishbowls".
Mystery solved!
RJ
PD4106-2784
Fresno CA |
seaton (205.183.220.250)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, January 22, 2003 - 4:25 pm: | |
Don't be fooled. Other than body parts, this bus has nothing in common with a fishbowl. That is why they did not remain long in production. Bus companies and transit authorities like to have parts commanality across their fleets. But I do wonder if one could be retrofitted with a V drive and and 8V71 or a 6V92. I bet it would be fast. |
RJ Long (24.127.74.29)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, January 22, 2003 - 5:34 pm: | |
Seaton -
Besides the VIN, the seller also sent me about 12 pics of this Baby Fish.
Other than the T-drive powertrain layout, based on the VIN and the pics, everything else looks exactly like a Fishbowl. Interior walls, wheel wells, roof structure, dashboard & driver's compartment, front end, doors, A/C system, etc. Obviously, the rear undercarriage is different for the T-drive, but that appears to be all.
GM likes the commonality of parts, too. Keeps production costs down. . .
Stuffing a 350 hp 6V92TA in the tail would be fun - wheelies to go!!
RJ
PD4106-2784
Fresno CA |
seaton (205.183.220.250)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, January 23, 2003 - 8:46 am: | |
I'd LOVE to have one with a 6V92 and a nice, compact converted interior. And you're right. When I was speaking of mechanical parts, I meant the mechanicals. As you say, everything else is identical to a 35-foot new look transit. |
Henry R. Bergman, Jr. (Henryofcj) (65.194.145.59)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, January 24, 2003 - 1:08 am: | |
Wonder if a Detroit 6V53TI could be stuffed in? About 300 hp @ 2800 and 750 tor @1800 with N80 injectors.
Wonder what kind of Allision it has, and if a MT 650 would fit? Then you could easily "lite 'em up!" He he he. Warp 10 Mr. Sulu!!!! |