| Author |
Message |
Alan Heaberlin (66.159.217.244)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, March 05, 2003 - 10:50 pm: | |
I recently took delivery of a 1975 Flx New Look. It's been parked for 6 years and I'm working to make it safe and roadworthy before starting the conversion. It is a shell at this point. Engine is a 8V71 with VS2 trannie.
I've fixed enough air leaks that it will hold air pressure for a couple of hours but I'm concerned that the one most important safety feature is not working. The emergency shut off switch does not shut off the engine. I can hear the solenoid working when I throw the switch while the engine is not running but I'm not sure what the mechanism is supposed to do. I haven't got my engine manual yet and the chassis manual I have is for a later bus with the Cummings/Perkins setup.
Any advice on how to troubleshoot the problem will be most appreciated. I want to drive it to town and fill up with fuel before war starts and they start charging 2 bucks a gallon for Diesel. I prefer to have all the safety features working before I start pushing it down the road. |
Jayjay (198.81.26.174)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, March 05, 2003 - 11:47 pm: | |
There is a spring-loaded lever at the end of your blower housing, and the E-stop solenoid holds it open. Facing foreward it is on the lower left hand corner of the blower. (most imes, but I've seen them on the lower right)This allows air to flow past the gate in the top of the blower. When you actuate the e-stop switch the solenoid retracts and allows the internal trap-door to slam shut, thereby cutting off the air supply to the engine. A small, short lever is pushed foreward and upward to re-set, and re-arm the mechanism. A caveat: The trap door may be sprung, OR hung up ( in a partially OPEN position)on the gasket inside the blower housing. This condition is common if the gaskets are replaced in the improper order when the blower cover is installed. Then you could re-set the e-stop and STILL not have any safety, since even if tripped it won't go shut!!! HTH G'Luck and Cheers...JJ |
jmaxwell (66.42.92.5)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, March 05, 2003 - 11:56 pm: | |
Well, ure too late. Saw it for $2.02 tdy. N. CA. Same place was 1.38 two months ago. |
Alan Heaberlin (66.218.40.250)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, March 06, 2003 - 9:39 am: | |
Thanks Jayjay, Yes I see the little mechanism. I'll pull the solenoid this morning and see if I can free up the trap. Maybe the solenoid isn't pulling off far enough. I thought it was something like that but it never hurts to ask. Was hoping to hear from Scott Whitney on this too. So far I've been trying to fix every sign of neglect as I go. BTW, I saw fuel at a truck stop in Mojave yesterday (3/5) for $1.76. I better hurry!
Alan |
Jim Wilke (12.46.52.74)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, March 06, 2003 - 2:08 pm: | |
Your emergency stop valve mechanism may be stuck in the open position too. Mine had been disconnected & wired open. I guess somebody had problems way back with it nuisance tripping. Anyway, after being in one spot for decades it needed freeing up.
Note: it normally will not completely stop the engine, but it won't run more than an idle & smokes like an oil refinery on fire. You should trip it on purpose when it is repaired, then see what it looks like so if it happens you will recognize what is wrong with the bus! I accidentally tripped mine once while working on it & later when I started it I was kind of mystified for a few minutes as to what was wrong.
Jim-Bob
1959 4104-4039 |
Mike Stabler (Docdezl) (64.255.109.146)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, March 06, 2003 - 7:53 pm: | |
FWIW sometimes when an engine goes high enough that only dogs can hear it. And for one reason or another and injector is wide open. Cutting the air slows but won't stop it. What might look like someone has put too many brass adapters on "THE" fuel line you can reach. By pulling on that fuel line "one" of the fitings will break and "not" the pot metal of the filter adapter. Being scared helps!! No air,NO fuel,No go. Hopfully???
smoke,rattle&,stink....docdezl |
Geoff (Geoff) (66.238.120.90)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, March 07, 2003 - 9:02 am: | |
You guys with the older Detroits and emergency air flaps should consider upgrading the fuel racks to the spring loaded type. The spring loaded racks will allow you to shut the engine off if one injector gets stuck in the full fuel position (the older racks hold ALL the injectors in full fuel if one gets stuck). There are plenty of good used spring loaded racks out there-- they will fit without any modifications and then you won't need the air flapper which is only good to stop an engine if it is idling (and not always then). I might also add that you should have the replacement racks installed by a qualified Detroit mechanic if you want your engine to run right when you are done...
--Geoff
'82 RTS CA |
DrivingMissLazy (66.190.119.82)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, March 07, 2003 - 7:41 pm: | |
Several years ago, I had an injector stick in a DD-671 in my 4104. This happened when cresting a mountain in Southern California. The pucker factor went to a +10 (as Greg would say) when I suddenly found myself barreling down the mountain with wide open throttle. When I finally realized what had happened and finally remembered the emergency shut down, I turned it on, and it stopped the engine dead from full throttle. With some help from friendly truckers who explained what had happened, I removed the valve cover and released something. A rocker arm or whatever was holding the throttle open. Just do not remember what since it happened many years ago.
Anyhow, replaced the valve cover, reset the emergency shutdown damper and proceeded on home on five cylinders. Had a lot of black smoke, but other than that everything worked fine.
Also, although many on the board have stated that this would suck the seals out of the turbo, I suffered no turbo damage and only had to replace the one injector.
Richard |
William (216.82.156.175)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, March 07, 2003 - 8:00 pm: | |
My MC9 has red plates back next to the engine and on the dash next to the main switch that say "This engine is not equiped with an emergency shutoff switch". Sounds like that is a bad thing. Should I put one on? Is that normal for an MC9?
William |
Tom Caffrey (Pvcces) (64.114.233.36)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, March 07, 2003 - 8:58 pm: | |
Sounds like it depends on whether it has the spring loaded racks that Geoff mentioned in the post above. If it does, maybe you don't need it.
For what it's worth.
Tom Caffrey PD4106-2576
Suncatcher |
Darryl (68.184.120.141)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, March 07, 2003 - 10:16 pm: | |
Chris, if you have a 6V-92, they will not have the auto shutdown. They have the spring loaded rack. |
Mike Stabler (Docdezl) (64.255.109.143)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, March 08, 2003 - 3:12 pm: | |
OK, I apologize for the following smarta**
,insensitive remark. All diesels can and do "run away" for myriad reasons. I have only seen 25 or 30,and the remains of 1/2 dozen "on the hook". Adding to the BIG BANG theory?
You do not NEED an emergency shut down! IF or when your engine "runs away" it WILL eventually STOP. Heal itself, and stop. Run out of fuel and stop. Run out of oil and stop. Start making crunching grinding sounds and start to slow and then come to a stop. And then finally the oil pan removeing ballistic catastrophic failure but, not all parts stop simultainiously.
I am a proponant of some sort of high or low tech way of CUTTING the fuel. Electromechanical valve or hammer!
I have seen water get thru and steam blow injectors. Shafts and seals fail on blowers,turbos,air compressor,after coolers,and feed engine oil to the intake. Water will condensate out of fuel and puddle in the injection pump and when engine shuts down freeze and expand and the next time it starts--ZOOOOM.
The all time best was watching a partially tuned 8V92 turbo "READ" the detroit engine manual. The manual was trying to be pressed,held over turbo intake as rpm's rose. Keeping fingers OUT OF turbo as it PULLED pages from the book. A warm summer night with the shop doors WIDE open. Dual 5 inch stacks aimed out and into the night sky and toward the fuel island. Brite sparks and black smoke was like in a glass tube staight to the fuel island were it stopped and hung. Didn't see the fuel boy for an hour!!!!!
Also did you know that a detroit with out its valve covers WILL spray lube a tool box and fill any open drawers......wasn't mine, so its funny!
Smoke,rattle&,stink....docdezl |
Henry R. Bergman, Jr. (Henryofcj) (65.194.145.32)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, March 09, 2003 - 1:27 am: | |
Sometimes no emergency shutdown is better. Here is another old retired fireman's story.
Years ago an Engine was first due on a little dinky attic fire. The apparatus operator was...
...kinda new on the rig and tripped the emergency shut down by mistake. That and a lot of....
....other Bo Bo's (like the Titanic) resulted in three houses losing their roofs to the ....
....tune of about $250 K and this was 20 years ago or soosss. Seems no one ever told the....
....rank and file what that little do-hickie pull lever was for. We found out the hard way.
Corrective actions later fixed that little oversight, but try telling that to the three home....
....owners who were kinda upset to says the least. Heads rolled. Thanks. Henry of CJ. |