| Author | Message | ||
| Patrick levenson (Zubzub)
Registered Member Username: Zubzub Post Number: 248 Registered: 5-2007 Posted From: 70.52.29.224  Rating: N/A |
I've been sorting out the wiring on my '53 4104 now for a bit. Generally it's gone well but slowly. My 1st inclination to rip it all out and start new still might have been faster, but I have enjoyed working through the wiring diagrams and getting to know my bus better. 1. One of the things that has always bugged me about the bus was a constant drain on the batteries....I'm not sure how much but it would always have a load on the battery....turns out the old relays that I kind of like because they are so rugged and tunable also leak current. I was working on the horn relay when I discovered there was + current "B" terminal when the points were open....this makes no sense really, but I guess internal corrosion is causing some part of the relay to short. Only 2 volts were sneaking through so I guess I could use it as some kind of resistor. Anyhow I replaced it with a little cube relay, and I guess there will be a few more to change along the way. I've got tons of cube relays pulled off of transits headed for the great bus yard in the sky. 2. The other thing I have learnt is that fixing stuff can really make things worse. Case in point , when I rebuilt the rear control panel (the one that allows you to turn on the engine from the engine bay) I let loose a sackful of snakes). PO or more likely POs have wired around all the shutdown systems over the years (I would have down the same), but when I "fixed" the rear control things got wonky all over the place. All of a sudden the charging indicator tell tale on the dash would turn on when I turned on the marker lights. Took awhile for me to figure that one out as the marker light issue turned up 3 months after I had "fixed" the control panel. 3. remove the front seat when working on control panel. Fixing old wiring is hard enough, pull the seat and get a nice cushion to sit on, oh and absolutely use a drill driven socket to screw and unscrew the junction post nuts. Anyhow just thought I would pass this on in case anyone needs the info. | ||
| Bill Gerrie (Bill_gerrie)
Registered Member Username: Bill_gerrie Post Number: 376 Registered: 3-2006 Posted From: 216.198.139.38  Rating: N/A |
When you finish yours you can sort out my panel by the drivers seat. HA HA. It is a nightmare of hundreds of wires. Some orginal and a lot of add ons. I actually keep all diagrams of the add ons but some day I need to tidy up the mess. Bill | ||
| R.C.Bishop (Chuckllb)
Registered Member Username: Chuckllb Post Number: 1378 Registered: 7-2006 Posted From: 69.97.113.34  Rating: N/A |
Precisely why I tackle it "one problem" at a time!  Thanx for sharing! RCB | ||
| Tom Christman (Tchristman)
Registered Member Username: Tchristman Post Number: 245 Registered: 1-2006 Posted From: 66.218.33.156 Rating: N/A |
I feel very lucky that my bus has all its' wiring original. Now my truck conversion-let's just say I've pulled bundles of useless wiring from the PO. I often wonder what people are thinking when they do wiring. It can be so simple-yet they make it complicated!? Good Luck, TomC | ||
| john w. roan (Chessie4905)
Registered Member Username: Chessie4905 Post Number: 1953 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 71.58.71.157  Rating: N/A |
When owners or previous owners switch them to negative ground, new problems arise from the rectifiers and other items that need changed or rewired.They use a rectifier for the warning lights on a 04. | ||
| Patrick levenson (Zubzub)
Registered Member Username: Zubzub Post Number: 250 Registered: 5-2007 Posted From: 70.52.29.224 Rating: N/A |
I have read that my bus a '53, was pre rectifier There is some kind of gismo on the current supply side of the oil and temp gages but I thought it was more of a voltage regulator kind of thing, and those 2 gages are working. i looked up rectifiers online but everything seemed to be about using them to turn AC into DC (half wave etc...) I'm always up for learning more, could you possibly explain ho the rectifier works in this application and how/why it needs to be polarity sensitive. Electronics is a weak spot for me, conquering the mighty cube relay was a major breakthrough about 10 years ago, and I have not advanced much since then.... | ||
| FAST FRED (Fast_fred)
Registered Member Username: Fast_fred Post Number: 1291 Registered: 10-2006 Posted From: 99.153.142.249  Rating: N/A |
When playing Edison , just be really sure to replace those star washers on the screws. They make DC circuits far more reliable at almost no cost. FF | ||
| Gus Causbie (Gusc)
Registered Member Username: Gusc Post Number: 1209 Registered: 11-2005 Posted From: 65.247.196.140  Rating: N/A |
I found that I needed to clean all those brass nuts at the panel studs and replace all the star washers. I also gave them a good coat of anti-corrosion oil. Also, a bunch of the wiring connected to the terminals at the elect panels was severely corroded from the terminal for about three inches. I cut that out and replaced the terminals, sometimes even the wire because it was too short. I agree on the cube relays, I use them anytime an old one goes bad. I find that those old blue rectifiers and the old alarm system cause most of my problems. Anytime I change any wiring those things seem to go nuts. My original generator indicator needle wakes up once in a while, flops around for a while, then settles to one side or the other. One day I'll remove it but right now there are more important things to do-like get my running light working!! | ||
| joe padberg (Joemc7ab)
Registered Member Username: Joemc7ab Post Number: 443 Registered: 6-2004 Posted From: 66.38.159.33 Rating: N/A |
Those old blue rectifiers--- those are most likely selenium, about 1.5 inches square and are the forerunner of the common silicon rectifiers of today. I replaced more than a few in a former life. Joe | ||
| Patrick levenson (Zubzub)
Registered Member Username: Zubzub Post Number: 251 Registered: 5-2007 Posted From: 70.52.29.224 Rating: N/A |
when you say blue rectifiers do you mean the little discs on the supply side of the temp and oil pressure gage? | ||
| Jim Rink (Fakeguy)
Registered Member Username: Fakeguy Post Number: 169 Registered: 1-2005 Posted From: 96.11.208.218  Rating: N/A |
One of the first things I did to my 4106 was cut loose the turn signal mechanism from the steering column which was broken. I replaced with generic truck turn signal box (signalstat? name escapes me at the moment). What a nightmare even with the schematic. The multicolored wires were difficult to distinguish actual colors due to age. However after all was said and done, was a positive experience since it got me into learning more about the coach wiring system. They had some interesting wiring patterns. Today, I am actually a little proud of have figured it out and finished in an afternoon...wish all subsequent jobs had gone that easy by comparison. That was six years ago and it still works fine today. | ||
| Len Silva (Lsilva)
Registered Member Username: Lsilva Post Number: 403 Registered: 12-2000 Posted From: 72.187.35.208  Rating: N/A |
Jim and others here, Did you mark up the schematics to show the changes you made. It is not inconceivable that these old buses of ours will be around for another fifty years and multiple owners in the future. Let's try to help them as much as we can. | ||
| Gus Causbie (Gusc)
Registered Member Username: Gusc Post Number: 1211 Registered: 11-2005 Posted From: 72.173.192.59 Rating: N/A |
Pat, Yes, they look like cooling fins with wires soldered to them. It is easier for me to replace them with cube relays than to try to figure out the wiring, even with a wiring diagram from my manual. | ||
| Patrick levenson (Zubzub)
Registered Member Username: Zubzub Post Number: 255 Registered: 5-2007 Posted From: 70.52.29.224 Rating: N/A |
Gus, I'm confused, you replaced the rectifiers with cube relays? | ||
| Gus Causbie (Gusc)
Registered Member Username: Gusc Post Number: 1212 Registered: 11-2005 Posted From: 12.189.32.54 Rating: N/A |
I may be the one who is confused!! I did this a couple of years ago and it is probable that I replaced some old relays with cube relays. Right now I'm not sure?? I'm away from home and can't go out to the bus to check. Ill be home Wed and will check my maint records. The more I think about it the more I think that I just disconnected a bunch of the rectifiers because so many of them were in alarm systems that no longer function. Sorry about that!! | ||
| Tom Phillips (Fortyniner)
Registered Member Username: Fortyniner Post Number: 18 Registered: 2-2010 Posted From: 66.93.216.253 Rating: |
Speaking of 50 year old wiring the circuit design for the headlights is just a little too basic. It takes just one short to blind you at night since ALL headlights are protected with a single breaker. After experiencing this first hand with the 4106 I recently bought Im considering adding a little headlight breaker subpanel in the aux airtank bay kind of like a 4905 has. -Tom P. | ||
| Patrick levenson (Zubzub)
Registered Member Username: Zubzub Post Number: 256 Registered: 5-2007 Posted From: 70.52.29.224 Rating: N/A |
Could you elaborate? I lost my headlights to a short once as well. Since then I have replaced all the wires and have one dedicated breaker in the front panel for the hlights. What is the difference in the 4905 setup? | ||
| marvin pack (Gomer)
Registered Member Username: Gomer Post Number: 979 Registered: 3-2007 Posted From: 71.55.13.161  Rating: N/A |
Pat the 4905 has indivual breakers on each light. It is rather cheap to add the breaker to your lights tho, go by auto parts store and get them for a little of nothing, that way if you have a problem with one of them it will trip the breaker instead of losing all the lights. gomer |
