| Author | Message | ||
| mel4104 (208.181.100.42)
Rating: |
out of deisel for your DD no problem ,do what a friend of mine did for fuel, he drove his TD6H-5303 across Canada from Vancouver Island to the east coast and dack for less than $200for deisel.what he did was install an extra fuel tank and filters with 2 shut off valves so that he could control the type of fuel that he wanted to run on, what was the other fuel?????? do you have a answer yet ???well her it is , he went to the local fast food outlets and got their used cooking oil and filtered out the chunks . he would start the bus on deisel and switch to cooking oil until it was ready to shut offat the end of the day. a bus company in Ontario putit on a dyno and the results were 7% more HP on the oilover deisel and the good side is that the exaust smells sweet but very mild and he had no engine problems there and back and this is 35 years old. mel 4104 | ||
| Stan (24.67.45.35) Rating: N/A |
Is the work of submitting federal fuel tax, provincial fuel tax and in some places city tax worth the saving in fuel cost. You have to stop at every port of entry and report mileage in each jurisdiction, Diesel fuel is not expensive if you subtract all the taxes. Getting caught using non-taxed fuel is a very expensive proposition. | ||
| Paul Tillmann (Paultillmann) (24.105.194.23)
Rating: N/A |
I may be very wrong here, but, isn't the tax on the fossil fuel called #1 or #2 diesel. Used cooking oil is a privately refined alternative (and environmentally friendly) fuel for, in this case, non-commercial use, NOT #1 or #2 diesel fuel bought at the local Flying J. So if I (as a private person, non-commercial) packed my 1974 T6H5308A full of Trojan 6 volt batteries and installed an electric motor to the rear end I would be violating tax laws because I would't be paying the Diesel Fuel Tax?? How about the people that put propane injection on their diesel engines? Are they in violation too?? I'm confused. Paul | ||
| Jojo Colina (Du1jec) (64.154.81.242)
Rating: N/A |
The only case I know where you can get in trouble is when you use a refined fuel which is sold without the road tax on an highway vehicle. I.E. Farm Diesel or heating oil. If it is not a refined motor fuel you are pretty much off the hook. Not to mention that private motorcoaches do not need to file IFTA papers. If it is not dyed for identification and you can run with it I say go for it. | ||
| Stan (24.67.45.35) Rating: N/A |
Fuel taxes are defined in the legislation as 'Road Use Tax'. It is used as the simplest method of making you pay for the road you drive on. When propane is used as highway motor fuel it is subject to tax. If electric vehicles become popular, I'm sure the legislators will find a way to get their bite. | ||
| Johnny (63.159.152.175) Rating: N/A |
www.greasel.com I'm considering this for my F-350. | ||
| Bill Glenn (141.151.10.230) Rating: N/A |
Hey Mel, glad to hear it runs just as good in a detroit ( Rudolph would be proud), I have been playing with various cuts( from 100% to 10%) of WVO in a Kubota diesel for a while now, all with good results in the right circumstances. Stan, I believe the laws on road tax, fuel, and aditives (what spell check?) state that if the additive helps reduce pollution, increase performance, or has another actual benefit it is an additive to the fuel, and not taxed as fuel. An example would be STP, Power Pal, Power Service, Heet or any other gas, or fuel additive. I hope I have not been breaking the law by not stopping at each jurisdiction, port of entry to show proof of milage driven, and fuel tax paid. | ||
| smoky (12.222.48.162) Rating: N/A |
a diesel engine was designed to run on peanut oil.Several years later it was found that it would also run on a biproduct from making gasoline that is now know as diesel fuel. for the last 2 years I've been running My jeep cherokee diesel on grease and it runs very well I also run a diesel suburban on grease and it runs alot better on grease than diesel.It is not illegal to run on grease, home made whisky or even captured methane from the poop pit on a hog farm. At least not yet, I think that we pay far too many taxes so I guess this is my little way of getting out of a few taxes . Smoky, | ||
| john marbury (Jmarbury) (65.100.118.22)
Rating: N/A |
Smoky, Have you addressed the "Quantity" issue with running a bus with greasel. It's very difficult to filter 150 gals of veggie oil, especially when it's 15 degrees outside. I've got the greasel system but have not installed it yet. John | ||
| mel 4104 (208.181.100.108)
Rating: N/A |
Smokey, e-mail me so that i can get you in contact with Hal. he is the fellow that drove his bus there and never had any trouble with the law, going or coming and he still has it . mel 4104 | ||
| Geoff (Geoff) (66.238.120.78)
Rating: N/A |
It seems funny to me that everyone clammers about how you have to use CF-2 40wt motor oil, preferably Delo 100, but when it comes to fuel you'll pour anything in your tank! | ||
| two dogs (66.90.216.97) Rating: N/A |
saw a program on tv a couple of nights ago...a girl said: "the exhaust smells like french fries" | ||
| Phil Dumpster (12.230.214.167) Rating: N/A |
Geoff, that's why I'm reluctant to run vegetable oil in my bus, at least until there is substantiated evidence that it doesn't cause any damage to the engine. I just don't have $10,000 lying around to pay for a new engine should it do some nasty things to it. Now, if it is proven that the 6V92TA will run on properly filtered and purified waste vegetable oil with no engine damage, I will definately look into using it. Why is this different than engine oil? Using the wrong oil in a DD 2 cycle engine is proven to cause premature wear. At 6 miles per gallon, if it doesn't harm the engine then the benefit is definately desirable. | ||
| TWO DOGS (66.90.216.97) Rating: N/A |
yeah...you could keep the 'extra' fuel tank under the bed...cabin heat would keep it from congeling,just gravity flow to the injector pump.. was reading an old publication on tractors one time..you would start the tractor on gas..let it get good and warmed up...switch to "economy fuel"it didn't say,but guess they were talking about kerosene... | ||
| Richard Bowyer (Drivingmisslazy) (24.196.191.70)
Rating: N/A |
I was looking a an old Galion road grader a couple of days ago. Has an IH engine that you start on gasoline and then switch to diesel after it warms up. At least that is what the owner says. Richard | ||
| TWO DOGS (66.90.216.97) Rating: N/A |
basicly the same...diesel is oily kerosene...I got that tractor off an old man..he still had the owners manual...it was hand crank,and the spark plugs were about 2" in dia. ya' took them apart and replaced the rod going thru the porcelin | ||
| Jack Conrad (Jackconrad) (207.30.189.28)
Rating: N/A |
Richard, When I was growing up on my grandfathers farm, we had a John Deere B model tractor that ran on gasoline and diesel. This was the old 2 cylinder engine with a petcock on the cylinder that you opened to release some of the compression before turning the large flywheel on the side of the engine to start it. As soon as it started, you closed the petcock. You started on gasoline, let it warm up then switched to diesel. Before shutting it off you switched back to gasolene so that the carb would be full of gasolene when you started it the next time. AHH, the "good old days" Jack | ||
| Geoff (Geoff) (66.238.120.78)
Rating: N/A |
A while back I was waiting for parts at a Cummins distributor and I picked up a bulletin on using processed vegtable oil fuel and the bottom line was that is was okay to use, but that the cetane rating was lower than regular diesel and it might be better to mix the two for better operation. There are companies that will sell you the equipment to refine the veggie oil yourself, but it takes up so much room and takes so long to process that it wouldn't be practical for most people. I don't think you can simply "filter out the chunks" and pour it in your fuel tank-- that is what I was commenting on before when I said people would put anything in their fuel tanks... | ||
| Bill Glenn (151.197.30.95) Rating: N/A |
Hey Geoff, really, there isnt much more than (filtering out the chunks), you only need filters, not refining. There isn't that much difference in C-tane rating either. You know I dont think WE are "most people". No offense, I think we all must be nuts. Hey Jack, that is after the "Poppin John" Right? Seems like we are reverting back. We are starting on fossil fuel, and switching over to vegetable then switching back so as to purge and be ready to start cold. 2D's It really does smell different when it burns, and with a coolant heater for the filter, lines and tank (do install a pump though), growing your own fuel isn't out of the question, let alone recycling some waste oil. John, Do Not put off installing that greasel kit. Find the time. (easier said than done)With a little modification a diesel is truly a multi fueled engine. Please kick out my soap box! W.H.G. | ||
| Geoff (Geoff) (66.238.120.78)
Rating: N/A |
Sounds really good, Bill-- strained french fry grease and waste oil for fuel, what do you recommend for engine oil, refried beans? --Geoff | ||
| BrianMCI96A3 (65.40.154.50) Rating: N/A |
The biggest problem with used cooking oil as I see it, is that while it will burn quite nicely in a diesel engine... if sufficiently filtered and mixed with diesel fuel... usually at no greater than 20% to 25%... unless it is refined, you will cause coking or carboning in the combustion chamber that will lead eventually to injector spray pattern degradation. AND if it is refined you'll need to change out any rubber hoses in the fuel system because the Biodiesel will attack them. Other than that, sounds great Brian | ||
| Smoky (12.222.48.162)
Rating: N/A |
Geoff, when it comes to things like this I am very doubtful, I have been turning wrenches for a living for about 18 years now and I am a very cautious person,I like to use OEM parts and when I finish A job I like it to look like I was never there once it gets a little road grime on it. most of my experince coming from a medium and heavy truck dealership service department. I had customor about 4 years ago that had a homemade greasel system installed on spartan motorhome chassis with a cummins ISC I was very impressed and decided to experment on a old ford tempo diesel. after getting it perfected on the junk tempo I tried it on beloved diesel cherokee now there is a lot of information on the internet and I havent tried it on a DD but several other people have and they always say that they notice improved performance when running on grease. Right now I'm a wanabe saving my pennies and waiting for just the right bus My wife and I really like the style of the 4104 and I dream of scenicruiser with a lowered floor and I am considering and 4108 with engine troubles that I previously ruled out (the owner lower the price) but I can assure that what ever bus I end up with it will run on Grease Smoky, | ||
| Geoff (Geoff) (66.238.120.10)
Rating: N/A |
Smokey-- what do you think about mixing in used crankcase oil (waste oil)? That practice is specifically denounced by Detroit Diesel. | ||
| DonTX/KS (66.82.9.29)
Rating: N/A |
What do you bet they never even tried it Geoff? I never did it, but I feel it is stupid NOT to do it. I know people who have done it for decades, and they always seem to get far longer engine life than us that did not. Wonder if THAT could be the reason from DD, after all, they ARE in the business of selling parts and engines? | ||
| Geoff (Geoff) (66.238.120.10)
Rating: N/A |
If you pour waste oil in your fuel tank you are putting back all the "dirt" that the oil picked up to begin with. We buy refined diesel fuel that has had all the crap removed from the oil, why do you want to pour it in? If the engine is worn out anyway I guess it wouldn't matter, but I wouldn't put waste oil into a new engine. | ||
| DonTX/KS (66.82.9.29)
Rating: N/A |
Well most people have a gizmo called an oil filter, highly regarded to take out all that dirt. Some also have a fuel filter or two, also designed to take out that crap. As I said, I could not bring myself to do it either, but it is hard to argue with those who do it routinely and it works so darned well for them. The vast majority of bus people never changed their own oil anyway, so it probably has never been an issue, but sure is a neat way to get rid of your old oil and "aid upper cylinder lubrication"! | ||
| Geoff (Geoff) (66.238.120.161)
Rating: N/A |
The oil filter only picks up the big stuff-- the smaller "dirt" is suspended in the oil molecule. If the oil filter "takes out all that dirt", why do we change the oil instead of just the filter? Also, why do you think oil turns brown/black? Likewise, the fuel filters only filter the larger contaminants, the tiny stuff goes through the injectors (not good) and the rest forms deposits on your pistons and valves and adds to liner wear. Detroit has a Bulletin on this subject. | ||
| DonTX/KS (66.82.9.43)
Rating: N/A |
Hey neat Geoff, can you get me a copy? | ||
| Johnny (63.159.120.82) Rating: N/A |
"It seems funny to me that everyone clammers about how you have to use CF-2 40wt motor oil, preferably Delo 100, but when it comes to fuel you'll pour anything in your tank!" That's because a diesel is designed to burn practically anything (Rudolf Diesel envisioned burning coal dust, among other things), but requires the right oil. http://members.nuvox.net/~on.watscarb/greasel.htm | ||
| Johnny (63.159.120.82) Rating: N/A |
"Smokey--what do you think about mixing in used crankcase oil (waste oil)? That practice is specifically denounced by Detroit Diesel." Any idea what International has to say? Plenty of trucking fleets do it. I take mine to a local place that heats their shop with it. | ||
| smoky (12.222.48.162) Rating: N/A |
sorry for the late post worked 15 hours today. Geoff, I don't burn used motor oil in any of my diesels because I worry about dirt or metal particals going through my injection pump (the one on my jeep costs $1000.00 from mopar if mine was not rebuildible)ouch .However I did experiment with filtered used ATF in the tempo and it seemed to run great but the smell was awful. On another note I now work in a fairly large transmission shop and have hot water heat (pex tubing in the cememt floor) we have a huge scottish marine tpye boiler that has a custom made filter system and gun that burns used oil our shop stays very warm. Smoky, | ||
| mndean (67.30.118.102)
Rating: N/A |
Geoff, There are lots of people doing this WVO thing, but I'm a bit skeptical for long-term use. Rather than using WVO, I'd use biodiesel instead simply because it's been found that WVO works better on prechamber diesels (like older Mercedes diesels) and not as well on direct injection engines. Also biodiesel does have a higher cetane than #2, has better lubrication properties, and mileage is very close to #2. The downside of both WVO and biodiesel is that it can gell at temps higher than #2 if the oil used is, say, palm oil or coconut oil. | ||
| Paul Singleton (205.210.53.253) Rating: N/A |
Take a look at this guy in Europe. He runs a Mercedes car on vegetable oil. Click on the British flag for the English version. http://www.rerorust.de/ | ||
| Robert Wood (Bobwoodsocal) (4.63.41.14)
Rating: N/A |
i took a look, and all i wanna know is what the hell is RAPE OIL? "I'm now having my rape oil delivered home" Bob | ||
| mndean (67.30.119.111)
Rating: N/A |
Most people call it canola oil. Same thing. | ||
| Robert Wood (Bobwoodsocal) (4.63.41.14)
Rating: N/A |
oh, thanks for clearing that up. just sounded weird to me... all the best! Bob | ||
| Peter Broadribb (Madbrit) (216.67.210.74)
Rating: N/A |
Full title is Rape Seed Oil. Comes from those yellow flowers you see fields of, as you drive across country. Peter. |
