| Author |
Message |
Johnny (4.174.112.122)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, June 06, 2004 - 12:12 pm: | |
OK, I have decided NOT to run rear airbags on my schoolie (Ford B-700) conversion. The main reasons are price (it ain't cheap), complexity (it ain't simple), reliability (see above), and the simple fact I don't have anywhere to put the darn compressor on my engine without losing my cab A/C (not happening). SO, that means replacing the granite-stiff rear springs with something more compliant. I know most spring shops can do this. I know they'll need the spring dimensions & the axle weights. Am I missing something?
Also, overload leaves: yes or no? Normally, I'd say yes, for a better ride unloaded...but these springs won't BE "unloaded".
FWIW, rear GAWR is, IIRC, 17,000. Tires will be 11R22.5 Bandags in a mild traction tread on 10-lug Budd wheels. |
FAST FRED (4.245.128.98)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, June 06, 2004 - 2:05 pm: | |
Most spring shops can pull enough leaves to give a fine ride AFTER you have finished and get a realistic "all up"camper road weigh OR an entire new set is not too dear.
They have a majical book , and can compare what springs you have with what you (they hope) need.
Many folks with Skoolies use an RV air bag set , with 12V RV air poump to lift an inch or so off the springs.
This is about $400 worth of parts but smoothes the really harsh edge off the truck like ride.
Your but will thankyou if you do much backroads or washboard touring.
FAST FRED |
Stephen Fessenden (Sffess) (65.154.176.228)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, June 06, 2004 - 8:41 pm: | |
Are you really going to be heavier than a school bus full of kids. Figure High School football team and band, average 170 lbs,two to a seat. Thats 8000 or 9000 lbs that the bus was designed to carry pllus the weight of the seats you removed and the equipment the band and team carry. Maybe you don't need overload springs at all if you watch your weight.
I would go with Freds suggestion of manual controled air springs. You don't have to go back roads to appreciate one. We had a Travco motor home with truck type trailing arm air spring rear suspension added. Wonderful ride, like my bus. We replaced it with a Travco motor home with stock leaf spring rear suspension and vibrated everything loose on a trip to Yellowstone and back. Those Midwestern and Northwestern highways had so many freeze heaves that the ride was bone jarring and shook loose parts of the motor home.
The system had two airbags about the size of the ones on my bus, with a 10 gallon air tank and pressure regulator like the one you would use on a home air compressor to regulate hose pressure to lower than tank pressure for spraying etc. It did not even have a pump and we only had to fill the tank once on a 3 week trip. I think the tank as a reservoir with a regulator is important. Otherwise you would need to be watching the ride and adding air manually. I have bbouth this type of regulator for under $30. Less if you want ultra cheap. |
TWO DOGS (65.179.209.238)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, June 06, 2004 - 8:41 pm: | |
I've run some small trucks with about the same weight you are talking about...empty...they rode BAD...loaded..NICE....(with your water & furniture & refrigerator....you will probably be surprized...like the post before this one....I'd SURE wait till I got her built & full of fuel,& water...BEFORE I even thought about 'adjusting' the springs....bet you will be surprized how well it rides with the springs you have on there right now... |
Johnny (4.174.103.197)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, June 06, 2004 - 9:37 pm: | |
The rear GAWR is 17K. No way I'll come close to that. |
ralph7 (208.155.122.155)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, June 06, 2004 - 10:01 pm: | |
You will be suprised just how much you will be adding, my first IH 66 passanger skoolie without seats 11,250 lbs. got MH plates and filled bus/moving van with house hold goods and tipped scales on turnpikes at close 22,000. That 345 worked hard 250miles to qt. of oil and 9 miles to gallon of gas with bus gov. only 55 mph. SUPER ride. |
Johnny (4.174.103.197)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, June 06, 2004 - 10:05 pm: | |
If I'm running 17K in back, I'll have to be under 8500 in front (GVWR is 25,500). Probably impossible. |
John the busboy (12.72.234.180)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, June 07, 2004 - 4:33 am: | |
I put air springs on my Bluebird. This was after I had the local spring shop pull a couple leaves....which didn't do squat for the ride.
The air suspension came off a Volvo semi. It is a sealed unit at this time. The weight of the bus doesn't vary all that much so I haven't added the ride height controls....this may change inthe future.
Not only is the ride smoother, it is quieter. All the road noise that used enter the bus via the leaf springs isn't there anymore.
And the suspension cost about $400. This is the same amount I wasted at the spring shop. It probably cost another $400 by the time it was completely installed.....new reamer bits, grade 8 bolts, new U-bolts, new jack, etc.
The hard part was getting everything exactly aligned before drilling any holes. The lucky part was not having to change any cross members.
It could still use a sway bar. And I should do something about the front suspension.
I installed a 4.11 rear end at the same time. That also made the bus quieter. Quiter and faster.
Because the engine now runs 2/3's as fast as it used to, it doesn't heat up enough. On an 80 degree day it won't break 170 degrees. If the temperature is in the 60's then it will barely get up to 160 degrees. Detroit Diesel is confused. No one ever has this sort of trouble.
John the busboy
84 BB/GMC
x's to v's for email |
Phil Dumpster (24.16.243.37)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, June 07, 2004 - 4:48 am: | |
What kind of brakes do you have? |
Henry R. Bergman, Jr. (Henryofcj) (63.224.197.10)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, June 07, 2004 - 4:53 pm: | |
I believe FF has got it right. (again!) Finish your coach conversion and take it out a couple of times at full load curb weight and see how she handles.
This may include some wild maneuvers done safely. Then at that time decide if the ride is still too rough, then if necessary, have your local...
...friendly and professional spring shop decide the best way to reduce the suspension. They may just remove a few leaves, or they may decide you need...
...completely new (different) springs to do things correctly and safely. My '74 Crown 10-wheeler will ALSO need to have the suspension springs...
...MARKEDLY reduced too. Has 16K front springs along with 34K rears. (tandem) with a wild, huge 47,160 lb GVWR. No way it will go that much. Good luck. |
Johnny (4.174.112.240)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, June 07, 2004 - 8:43 pm: | |
New springs are REQUIRED. Each pack has at least 2 cracked leaves. |
mark (216.239.160.71)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, June 07, 2004 - 10:15 pm: | |
John the busboy...
I am interrested in the setup that you have with the air bags off of a Volvo semi. What all is involved in this type of conversion?
Would other 'donor' trucks / buses have what I need? Did you do the conversion yourself?
My bus is a Gillig ('75) - probably has a similar type of leaf spring arrangement.
Thanks!
mark
75 gillig 636D |
John the busboy (12.72.234.186)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, June 08, 2004 - 1:28 am: | |
If the question was directed at me: Hydralic disk brakes.
Mark: I tried International first, but there were too many interferences. And the Volvo uses a 3 inch wide zipper spring which made things easier.
I did all the work myself. Except for welding the lateral control arm perch on to the axle housing and filling and drilling some holes on the hubs. The latter was done so the disk brake calipers could be mounted forward of the axle. (They and the zipper spring occupied the same space behing the axle.)
In choosing which suspension to use I tried to get one with a similar ride height. spaldings-the wrecking yard where I get my stuff-let me get small parts off different rigs as I needed them.
Measure everything. Then measure it a couple more times.
I have to go to work NOW......
John the busboy |