| Author |
Message |
david anderson (Davidanderson)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, December 15, 2004 - 7:31 pm: | |
I'm planning a long trip for Christmas, so I thought I should run the bus for a while before leaving next week. The bus hasn't run since the first of October.
It got down to 27 last night and I wanted to test the Webasto block heater, so I turned it on this morning and ran it for 1.5 hrs while I heated up the coach. It was 35 inside the bus.
The bus fired right up on the first turn. That felt good and it was now up to 62 inside the coach lounge. Those Webastos are great.
I started to drive off and the power steering gear made an awful whining noise. I checked the fluid, it wasn't full but it was above the low mark. After driving for an hour it the noise stopped.
I've started in cold weather before and it never did this. The only difference is that I had it overhauled at BAB steering last June.
Is this something of concern, or am I a worrywart? Just wanted some input from those with experience.
Thanks,
David |
Richard Bowyer (Drivingmisslazy)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, December 15, 2004 - 9:05 pm: | |
David, Mine always made a noise when it was cold like that. I do not think it is a problem.
Richard |
TWO DOGS
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, December 15, 2004 - 9:06 pm: | |
maybe an air bubble |
utahclaimjumper
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, December 15, 2004 - 9:27 pm: | |
>>>If you have an intracal power system you can turn the wheel to the stop in each direction and purge any air from the system.>>>Dan |
John Rigbyj
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, December 15, 2004 - 9:51 pm: | |
David,
The correct way to bleed the system of ALL the air is to jack the front end up off the ground. Run the bus and sit in the drives seat and turn the steering wheel from one side to the other about 20 times. Be SURE YOU DO NOT TURN THE WHEEL ALL THE WAY TO FULL LOCK IN EITHER DIRECTION. ONLY JUST SHORT OFF FULL LOCK.
This will purge the system of air and no noise. If you dont do it the noise will come back, when you make a left or right turn.
John |
mel 4104
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, December 15, 2004 - 9:51 pm: | |
David if you are in an area where the tempature drops below 40* F then you might think about using a lighter oil in the steering system as due to the length of the lines and the colder weather the oil gets a lot stiffer than it was in june and the pump will have a hard time with it till the oil warms up a little here on sunny Vancouver Is. BC we use 30 weight in the summer and if we are going to use the bus in the cold weather we use 10 weight or trans hyd. fluid, i run it all year in my 4104 and works great |
david anderson (Davidanderson)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, December 16, 2004 - 8:00 pm: | |
I never thought about air being trapped. It could be since we had the changeout back in the summer. I didn't try John's technique for burping the system. I may try that when I have time.
The book calls for Dexron III in the pump. That is really light oil. I've read that some of you guys use 30wt. I doubt the Dexron is too viscous. It probably just needs to be burped.
Thanks for your help.
David |
John Rigbyj
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, December 16, 2004 - 8:25 pm: | |
David,
I also use Dexron III Transmission oil in mine.
John |
John that newguy
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, December 16, 2004 - 9:48 pm: | |
I haven't read it recently, but I believe the "book" said to turn
to the stop in each direction. Only when against the stop, will
the pump send the fluid back to the reservoir, purging the air.
I did it; it worked. |
Tom Caffrey (Pvcces)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, December 16, 2004 - 10:12 pm: | |
Maybe the relief valve passages trap air, so that you have to make it relieve in order to purge the air?
Tom Caffrey PD4106-2576
Suncatcher |
Marc Bourget
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, December 17, 2004 - 9:13 am: | |
Right action, wrong conclusion
No, The relief valve is an integral part of the pump. If it "pops" it simply "short" circulates the oil from the reservoir, thru the pump, out the relief valve (connected to the discharge passage from the pump) back to the reservior.
"Air in the system" is out in the lines/actuating cylinder or spool valve and is brought back into the pump/reservoir (allowing it to percolate out) when you run the steering from lock to lock because that requires full travel of the actuating piston and causes maximum exchange or circulation of the oil.
Onward and Upward |
Tom Caffrey (Pvcces)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, December 17, 2004 - 11:54 pm: | |
Marc, all you're saying is that you need to reach lock to lock, instead of relieving after hitting the stop.
I thought that the discussion centered around the need to make the relief valve pop. Or at least, that seemed to be what JTNG said.
So, does it make a difference if it goes into to relief or doesn't it? I don't know, but I do know that some designs of pump really take exception to cavitation, but I can't say that I know of a case where a steering pump got messed up that way.
Onward and Upward.
Tom Caffrey PD4106-2576
Suncatcher |
Marc Bourget
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, December 18, 2004 - 12:01 am: | |
You don't have to "pop" the relief valve. If you do so, you're just needlessly "stirring" things up in a closed loop that does nothing but wear the oil out, faster.
If you want to get rid of air, it's the mass flow created by running the acutating piston thru its full range of travel and subjects the rest of the system to sufficient flow of oil (Ah!, Yes, a virtual tidal wave, it was!) to sweep any air in the system back to the reservoir. There is where it will percolate out and the noise ceases.
Onward and Upward |
Marc Bourget
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, December 18, 2004 - 12:07 am: | |
Tom,
Being the bored, impatient type, the way I've done it is to jack the front wheels off the ground, start her up and spin the wheel lock to lock. The inertia of the system causes a momentary stall of the pump, reflected by a bark or squawk from the belt, the wheel bounces back the other way, helped along by my index finger till I bounce it off the other stop. BUT I DON'T HOLD IT AGAINST THE STOP TAKING PLEASURE IN MAKING THE DAMN THING SQUALL! I don't pull the wings off flies, either!
Onward and Upward
Marc Bourget |
TWO DOGS
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, December 18, 2004 - 7:43 am: | |
have you ever seen the fly they super glue to a tiny airplane...then turn him loose ?? |
Frank Allen
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, December 18, 2004 - 10:37 am: | |
My 4106 did that noise thing and no amout of bleeding would help it, it would quiet down after driving but would stil make a whine when turning right, it was found that the pump was worn out probly because the guy that had it run it dry of oil
Frank Allen
4106 |
Marc Bourget
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, December 18, 2004 - 12:11 pm: | |
Good point Frank, But to the experienced, your situation is a little bit different sound.
It's amazing how much punishment these pumps will take and still spin. I've opened up cores for rebuild and found them full of "hair", metal slivers that seemed to want to jump up off the work bench and impale you like arrows.
Onward and Upward. |
Tom Caffrey (Pvcces)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, December 18, 2004 - 8:34 pm: | |
Thanks, Marc. You cleared up what I was wondering about. Your method matches the one I always thought was right, but I was a little puzzled about some of the comments above.
Tom Caffrey PD4106-2576
Suncatcher |
Marc Bourget
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, December 18, 2004 - 11:41 pm: | |
Glad I could be of assistance! |