| Author |
Message |
donald goldsmith (Bottomacher) (63.252.96.128)
Rating: 
Votes: 1 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, December 27, 2000 - 5:52 pm: | |
I would really appreciate a competent discussion of hot water heating systems. I hope to use baseboard heat with engine preheater in my 4106, but I lost the previous posts by Bob Sheaves and Fast Fred and others when the board crashed. Thanks to all. |
FAST FRED (209.26.110.235)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, December 28, 2000 - 5:11 am: | |
TO figure out what would work for you we need to know the design requirements of your plan.
I start with how many days heat you need without running the gen set .
This way the conversion becomes a realistic option to use as a guest house { your guests would not know how or when to start the genset}, or as an emergncy shelter in a problem time.
Also your choice of fuel , diesel, propane , will determine the operating cost , as will the life style { camp all winter in a ski area , or just another snowbird who needs to keep the cold out for a week or two}.
Finally your willingness to accept compromise in terms of system operation and falure modes.
The easiest by far is an OTS {off the shelf} Suburban or similar hot air unit , $400. done!
A bit up scale is a propane water heater , Bosch, Paloma ect, that has a high efficency 12v circ pump and baseboard radiators.
This is probably the best in terms of very low electrical consumption and is quite easy to troubble shoot.
AT the other end of the scale is the diesel furnaces, Espar , Webasco , Hurricane or Aqua Hot
Depending on how complex a sustem you are willing to maintain this furnace setup can make hot water , pre heat the engine or gen set, and heat the coach.
The huge downside { besides cash} is the very complex systems needed will take some time to get to work together, and the "Daisy Chain" that a leak anywhere in a complex system can make the coach undrivable.
To me this is not a valid choice.
With even more $ and complexity it could be made "Fail Safe" , but it wouldnt be easy.
Other hassle is very high electric consumption when operating makes more than an overnite use with out charging help very difficult.
Remember you only get to use about 60A from a 200A deep cycle battery before charge is needed,when field camping , so electrical draw is prime consideration if you envision boondpockin style use.
What do you think you need?
FAST FRED |
JanDen (64.188.242.19)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, December 28, 2000 - 9:05 pm: | |
Okay, this question ties into warm bus and cold starts?
We have a Webasto unit in our bus and an engine block heater.
If you take a bus out in cold winter weather and have to park it without electricity available, what do you run the Webasto to keep the engine hot?
If so, what about battery power?
If not, how do you warm the engine to start it?
It would be great to come back to a warm bus but not if it means a dead battery. |
Frank Wells (161.184.180.53)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, December 29, 2000 - 1:03 am: | |
I have a fairly simple system in my MCI 5A. This may have a bit of redundancy in it but it seems to work. The basic system is run with a 80,000btu webasto 2020 24volt heater and ties the engine, original coach heat, baseboard fin and tube, and a marine style hot water tank together. There is a valve bank which enables the selection of all or only one of the systems to be selected, ie: engine only. In this mode the engine can be ready to start in about 30 minutes at minus 20 degrees. I like the fin and tube baseboard htrs because of the low amp required and the lack of fans as with forced air systems, however I am considering changing the webasto out for a Super Hot propane boiler as it would be quieter and have no diesel smell. I have been doing some work in the coach this month and the webasto does keep it warm even at minus 30 degrees and it does not seem to cycle too much or pull too many amps.Good luck |
don (Bottomacher) (63.253.112.104)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, December 30, 2000 - 9:03 am: | |
Thanks to all of you. I was really trying not to haul a propane tank around, but it looks unlikely. I do want water heat, so I can keep the engine warm, preheat the domestic hot water, and not have cold areas of the bus when doors are closed, especially the bath. Do any of you know where to get detailed information about propane boilers, and which are junk? Fred is right about power consumption, since I don't want to hear the genset run unless I have to, and I'm looking for three or four days' use between charges. |
Glang (64.12.105.41)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, December 30, 2000 - 5:27 pm: | |
I use a ProHeat Furnace ( similar to Webesto )coupled to small heaters(8700BTU) with 12v fans. The heaters are in series ,so I control the fans using thermostats in different sections of the bus(no fan means very little heat). My domestic hot water is heated by the furnace. I use two Zone valves. One for heat the other for hot water. A switch in each zone valve starts the furnace when the zone valves recieve a heat needed signal from the bus thermostat or the low temp senser of the water heater.
I also have a heat exchanger connected to the bus front heater line. It supplements the furnace when I'm driving and I can use the furnace to heat the motor on a cold day. I can shut this off with a zone valve controlled by a dash switch or with manual valves in summer. All hot water piping is KYTEK with brass fittings. The expansion tank is off a 60's ford car engine ( small tank with rad cap 7 lbs) and the exchanger is a remote bus auto transmission oil cooler.Hope this helps someone. |
FAST FRED (209.26.110.157)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, January 03, 2001 - 5:16 am: | |
TO have a warm engine it takes either a furnace and circ pumps , and as many batterys as it takes to keep the voltage up on all the machinery ,and a setup with valves and heat exchangers .
or it takes a propane engine heater that uses a tiny amount of juice to keep a micro valve open.
Propane is an excellent stove fuel , and makes weeks of silent boondockin possable with an RV fridge , its only expensive for a continus gen set , or months of heat.
FAST FRED |
rocketeer2 (64.12.101.156)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, January 03, 2001 - 8:35 pm: | |
Where do you get info on a ProHeat Propane Furnace ? Sounds like a good setup. |
Gary Langley (Glang) (152.163.213.48)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, January 04, 2001 - 7:42 pm: | |
My Proheat is diesel |
don (Bottomacher) (63.252.92.29)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 06, 2001 - 6:59 pm: | |
I'm convinced. Now, how much propane should I carry? And Fred- what do you do for domestic hot water when 'docking? Thanks again. |
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